[Charles Nungester]

Originally Posted by Dick Monahan When the WoO started, it was non-wing.

It was promotor's choice

He has also done reasonably well in a Midget, having a 4th at the Chili Bowl in 96?

[quickchange]

My bad...Doug Wolfgang also won the Nationals both wing & nonwing.

---------- Post added at 06:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:24 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester I believe they ran paragon for half a season then hit the WoO trail

I'm not saying that's not true.....but he won the first ever WoO championship back in 78.......it would be kinda hard to do that if he only ran a half of season..?

[Charles Nungester]

I believe the first year for Winged Nationals was 1980. I distinctly remember over the years being told and reading that Shuman was the last NW winner. That makes Wolf the only one to do both.

Back at WoO startup there were a variety of Full up sprint cars, CRA was running a mix of roadsters and sprints, Posse ran everything from plywood wings to cars with NERF WINGS and both. It really was kinda Run what you Brung. Posse also ran a lot of BIG BLOCK SPRINTERS as well.

Chuck, thinking winged helps a driver NWed in smoothness and seeing things as the speeds are faster and thinks NW teaches drivers how to drive side by side, Drive over your head and keep it under control (Winged to me has just become so (HAVE TO BE PERFECT or you got no chance)

---------- Post added at 06:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:34 PM ----------

Originally Posted by quickchange My bad...Doug Wolfgang also won the Nationals both wing & nonwing. ---------- Post added at 06:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:24 PM ---------- I'm not saying that's not true.....but he won the first ever WoO championship back in 78.......it would be kinda hard to do that if he only ran a half of season..?

Whens his B day?, Could have been 77 Im not taking away from Steve by saying the first year wasn't a huge draw for most to make EVERY SHOW. Wolf picked and choose as did Ferkel and others. Bounced checks seemed to be quite common.

[slide22]

Originally Posted by quickchange My bad...Doug Wolfgang also won the Nationals both wing & nonwing. ---------- Post added at 06:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:24 PM ---------- I'm not saying that's not true.....but he won the first ever WoO championship back in 78.......it would be kinda hard to do that if he only ran a half of season..?

When the WoO first started it wasn't a single actual touring series. in 78' every race that payed $2000 to win ( i think) counted for WoO points. So there could be 2-3 WoO races on the same night.

[Flatrightrear]

Steve dominated at Haubstadt in Karl's #11 after he got the ride after Dick Gaines got hurt bad at Champaign,IL. It was all non-wing then and Sammy would come up most Sunday nights in the Sparks Electric car so it was grand times at the speedway watching those two cut their racing teeth there. Steve got a late start racing as he was at least 20 before he even started. I think Flat Out magazine had an article on Steve an issue or two ago that went into some of the early days. I remember he didn't kick butt in his own car but became a terror after learning how to drive under Karl's tutelege. He wadded up a bunch of cars while learning his craft but learn it he did!! Tom

[Vukie]

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester I believe the first year for Winged Nationals was 1980. I distinctly remember over the years being told and reading that Shuman was the last NW winner. That makes Wolf the only one to do both. Back at WoO startup there were a variety of Full up sprint cars, CRA was running a mix of roadsters and sprints,

I was at Knoxville in 1980 and it was wingless. Steve won the Nationals in 1980 and it was held on Sunday afternoon after it was fogged out on Saturday night.

I believe that 1981 was wingless also but after the Gary Scott fatal wreck in May of 1982, wings became mandatory at Knoxville.

CRA became a full time sprint car club in the mid 1950's, the roadsters faded into history after that.

http://www.stevehardin.com/genemarderness/unserjr2.jpg

http://www.stevehardin.com/genemarde...kville1981.jpg

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...2vMYK6NeT5_bEL

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...2vMYK6NeT5_bEL

[Joe Whisler]

Originally Posted by the1jet17 I saw Steve brought up in another thread on here and it made me start thinking bout him. I know that many Wing drivers at some point have takin the Wings off and run Non Wing. Has Steve ever run non wing? Where did he race? Did he do any good? Thanks JJ Hughes

I believe Steve's website has a complete list of his wins. www.SteveKinser.com Click on the tab with his name on it.
Posted via Mobile Device

[sceckert]

So the answer to the specific question is: Yes, Steve Kinser raced--and Won-- in Traditional Sprints.
The answer to the unasked speculative question as to how good he would have been as a Traditional Sprint Car Racer had he run it full-time is that he would certainly have been among the absolute greatest ever with Opperman or Foyt or Hinnershitz or Horn. Right where he is now: on Mt Rushmore. His awe-inspiring ability would have assured that he had his pick of the best cars, and, frankly, he would have crushed most fields. He is that rarest of racers in his accomplishments: The Incomparable. His career numbers are obviously unapproachable, and the amount of wins and earnings places him beyond the realm of standard compare. There is nothing in his achievements to suggest that he would have enjoyed lesser success without the foil. Particularly if Karl was wrenching for him.
Say what you will about all others at their peak, but at HIS peak (which lasted an unparalleled number of years), Steve Kinser was as great as great gets.

[Panama]

Steve in the famous Karl Kinser 11 at Topeka 1978
Look ma, NO WING MOUNTS!