UNION COUNTY - Midget Week

IndyBound · 8/12/08, 8:57 AM

Tim, thank you for presenting your point of view.

Tony Barhorst last post brings up some of the same points I made in the five questions I sent to D.O. to ask on his show last night. Those questions were never asked, and although I feel Kevin Miller and Jason Smith may have danced around some of my concerns, I don't feel I have answers to my questions.

I do believe safety of the drivers should be the foremost concern of any sanctioning body.

That being said, having read thru all of these post for the past several days and being a former car owner in another division of auto racing, past experiences came to mind. While traveling with ISMA, we arrived at a track in Michigan we had never raced before, not only did the place not have any corner lights, there were no corner men to stand an wave a flag of any color. This was back in the day before each driver had a radio, where at least one of our officials could have screamed in the drivers ear, yellow, yellow when an accident occurred. There was alot of discussion about how safe it would be to race there, in the end we raced and learned the lesson never to go to a new race track to our sehedule sight unseen again.

The guestions I sent D. O. were probably formed from that past experience as well as what happend at Union County. I didn't keep a copy of the questions, so I will simply state my concerns. First, why weren't Mr. Barhorst and his race director included in USAC's meeting with their race teams? Second, why wasn't one member from all 48 teams given a voice at that meeting? Third, Greg Staab indentified concerns last October, why wasn't the new Health, Fire and Safety Officer sent to reinspect the track once Greg was let go? Fourth, what were the actual safety concerns? Fifth, what would USAC do in the future to prevent this from happending again?

What I learned from last nights radio show was Mr. Barhost and Mr. Miller have talked numerous times over the weekend and vow to never let this happend again. The ball dropped with the July 3rd cancellation of the MSCS race as far as the UCS track getting reinspected. Now with Tim's excellent post I have my answer about the safety concerns.

Some one posted earlier that racing injuries are usually from a freak accident. Unforatunely, the friends that I have lost in the sport all died at some of the safest race tracks in the country in freak accidents. I in no way am making light of this, I feel racers know the risk they take. An I have always felt racers are usually safer on the track than driving their street car on the highway.

Hopefully all parties invovled can set aside their difference and work together for the betterment of the sport in the future.

Safe racing to all,

Patti

ossuks · 8/12/08, 9:06 AM

Wait, hold on, I'm a little slow! Did this same promoter hold an event at this same track in 04 and teams chose not to race? Was there an event at this track in 04 that Tim C. loaded up and went home?

8/12/08, 9:19 AM

From the MSCS web-site:

Haubstadt, IN - August 11, 2008. Two dates on the 2008 Hoosier Tire Midwest Sprint Car Series schedule were cancelled today and those races will not be held. The newly updated schedule no longer includes the races that were to be held at the Union County Speedway in Liberty, IN. MSCS will not be racing at Union County Speedway on August 22nd or September 12th. Both dates were to have been Friday night shows.

The decision to cancel these two events came about after a top level discussion between MSCS Owner Tom Helfrich and Union County Speedway promoter Tom Wieck on Monday. These discussions came about after reports surfaced on safety concerns at the track in relation to running sprint cars. These concerns coupled with the very short time frame within which everyone would have to work to correct safety concerns before these shows came up on the schedule led to a final decision to pull the plug.

With both events cancelled and in sufficient time to advise teams and fans, both MSCS and Union County Speedway will be able to move on with their respective 2008 seasons. Union County Speedway will be running their regularly scheduled classes on those nights. MSCS has offered to be open to further discussions in reviewing the circumstances at the track again during the scheduling process for 2009.

767 · 8/12/08, 9:23 AM

ok well my offer will still stand to the track.

Tony Barhorst · 8/12/08, 9:29 AM

Ossuks,

The track owner Billy Danials promoted the race in 04 I believe. It was not our race. Danials was told to remove the rebar..Tom Wieck went to remove the rebar...and was told NO by Danials. I was livid to see it there yet.

HOWEVER...THE ISSUES WERE FIXED...THESE SAME TEAMS THAT PULLED OUT RUN ON SIMILAR TRACKS ALL THE TIME.

DonMoore10 · 8/12/08, 9:57 AM

Now the real reason comes out as to why the USAC officials didn't inspect the track prior to race day. Too much traveling!! Probably had to stop a few times along the way and rotate those tires on that 18 wheeler (that copy machine in the back must weigh a ton!!).

racefan20 · 8/12/08, 10:01 AM

Tony if the issues were fixed why did MSCS pull out. Obviously there is still a problem. USAC seems to be trying to take the high road here by stating that they were wrong and vowing to never let it happen again. You however continue to get on here and point fingers at everyone and dont seem to be taking any responsibility at all for what happened. You AND USAC should have returned BEFORE the day of the race and made sure that the problems had been solved and cancelled in advance of the day of the race if they hadnt. Also I have yet to see an admission from you that you were wrong in coming unglued on the microphone and calling the racers names as they left. Some I talked to later in the weekend thought it was the announcer, Pat Sullivan, that made those comments. Pat does not deserve that. Please put your ego aside for once, admit that you had a part in this fiasco, quit pointing fingers and let this die.

Tony Barhorst · 8/12/08, 10:21 AM

John,

The MSCS race has been killed off by bad publicity...races are going to be held weekly at UCS..Including a big modified race. Open wheel racing has been held at UCS the last few years. You can look it up...

No one would want to promote any race in two weeks after this....The changes had been made...

One reason so many teams pulled out...after the elite teams decided not to run a points race...then I lost many more cars. In reality...it was ELEVEN TEAMS...not even 15 that made the decision...because there are multiple car teams in the top 15.

The USAC track Steward Bill Carey....NEVER SPOKE TO ME ALL DAY!

MY VOICE IS MUCH DIFFERENT THAN PAT SULLIVAN'S ..

NO ONE FROM USAC TOLD THE TOWER/ANNOUNCERS/DICK JORDAN WHAT WAS HAPPENING...THE TEAMS IN QUESTION JUST PULLED OUT.

I am sorry that Pat Sullivan had to witness this....But life goes on...Bob Jenkins stayed all night, enjoyed the races we had...as did a good crowd who had chose to stay....The TOP ELEVEN USAC TEAMS ARE NOT GOD"S GIFT TO RACING...There is much more talent out there...AND I WILL PROMOTE THEM.

767 · 8/12/08, 10:21 AM

John you should go listen to the broadcast on www.racefanradio.com . then come back and edit your post

Dirtfan · 8/12/08, 10:22 AM

Its over, done with, history some PLEASE close this thread!!!!!:redflag:

8/12/08, 10:01 AM	#217 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
racefan20 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 5,096	Tony if the issues were fixed why did MSCS pull out. Obviously there is still a problem. USAC seems to be trying to take the high road here by stating that they were wrong and vowing to never let it happen again. You however continue to get on here and point fingers at everyone and dont seem to be taking any responsibility at all for what happened. You AND USAC should have returned BEFORE the day of the race and made sure that the problems had been solved and cancelled in advance of the day of the race if they hadnt. Also I have yet to see an admission from you that you were wrong in coming unglued on the microphone and calling the racers names as they left. Some I talked to later in the weekend thought it was the announcer, Pat Sullivan, that made those comments. Pat does not deserve that. Please put your ego aside for once, admit that you had a part in this fiasco, quit pointing fingers and let this die. __________________ John Hoover “To whom little is not enough, nothing is enough.” Epicurus

8/12/08, 10:22 AM	#220 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
Dirtfan Senior Member Race Count This Year: 51 Race Count Last Year: 57 Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 8,523	Its over, done with, history some PLEASE close this thread!!!!!:redflag: __________________ Dan Hetser "Today is a Gift, Tomorrow is not Promised"

8/12/08, 8:57 AM	#211 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
IndyBound Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 2,626	Tim, thank you for presenting your point of view. Tony Barhorst last post brings up some of the same points I made in the five questions I sent to D.O. to ask on his show last night. Those questions were never asked, and although I feel Kevin Miller and Jason Smith may have danced around some of my concerns, I don't feel I have answers to my questions. I do believe safety of the drivers should be the foremost concern of any sanctioning body. That being said, having read thru all of these post for the past several days and being a former car owner in another division of auto racing, past experiences came to mind. While traveling with ISMA, we arrived at a track in Michigan we had never raced before, not only did the place not have any corner lights, there were no corner men to stand an wave a flag of any color. This was back in the day before each driver had a radio, where at least one of our officials could have screamed in the drivers ear, yellow, yellow when an accident occurred. There was alot of discussion about how safe it would be to race there, in the end we raced and learned the lesson never to go to a new race track to our sehedule sight unseen again. The guestions I sent D. O. were probably formed from that past experience as well as what happend at Union County. I didn't keep a copy of the questions, so I will simply state my concerns. First, why weren't Mr. Barhorst and his race director included in USAC's meeting with their race teams? Second, why wasn't one member from all 48 teams given a voice at that meeting? Third, Greg Staab indentified concerns last October, why wasn't the new Health, Fire and Safety Officer sent to reinspect the track once Greg was let go? Fourth, what were the actual safety concerns? Fifth, what would USAC do in the future to prevent this from happending again? What I learned from last nights radio show was Mr. Barhost and Mr. Miller have talked numerous times over the weekend and vow to never let this happend again. The ball dropped with the July 3rd cancellation of the MSCS race as far as the UCS track getting reinspected. Now with Tim's excellent post I have my answer about the safety concerns. Some one posted earlier that racing injuries are usually from a freak accident. Unforatunely, the friends that I have lost in the sport all died at some of the safest race tracks in the country in freak accidents. I in no way am making light of this, I feel racers know the risk they take. An I have always felt racers are usually safer on the track than driving their street car on the highway. Hopefully all parties invovled can set aside their difference and work together for the betterment of the sport in the future. Safe racing to all, Patti

8/12/08, 9:06 AM	#212 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
ossuks Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 980	Wait, hold on, I'm a little slow! Did this same promoter hold an event at this same track in 04 and teams chose not to race? Was there an event at this track in 04 that Tim C. loaded up and went home?

8/12/08, 9:19 AM	#213 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
wideopenwheelie Posts: n/a	From the MSCS web-site: Haubstadt, IN - August 11, 2008. Two dates on the 2008 Hoosier Tire Midwest Sprint Car Series schedule were cancelled today and those races will not be held. The newly updated schedule no longer includes the races that were to be held at the Union County Speedway in Liberty, IN. MSCS will not be racing at Union County Speedway on August 22nd or September 12th. Both dates were to have been Friday night shows. The decision to cancel these two events came about after a top level discussion between MSCS Owner Tom Helfrich and Union County Speedway promoter Tom Wieck on Monday. These discussions came about after reports surfaced on safety concerns at the track in relation to running sprint cars. These concerns coupled with the very short time frame within which everyone would have to work to correct safety concerns before these shows came up on the schedule led to a final decision to pull the plug. With both events cancelled and in sufficient time to advise teams and fans, both MSCS and Union County Speedway will be able to move on with their respective 2008 seasons. Union County Speedway will be running their regularly scheduled classes on those nights. MSCS has offered to be open to further discussions in reviewing the circumstances at the track again during the scheduling process for 2009.

8/12/08, 9:23 AM	#214 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
767 Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,001	ok well my offer will still stand to the track.

8/12/08, 9:29 AM	#215 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
Tony Barhorst Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 752	Ossuks, The track owner Billy Danials promoted the race in 04 I believe. It was not our race. Danials was told to remove the rebar..Tom Wieck went to remove the rebar...and was told NO by Danials. I was livid to see it there yet. HOWEVER...THE ISSUES WERE FIXED...THESE SAME TEAMS THAT PULLED OUT RUN ON SIMILAR TRACKS ALL THE TIME.

8/12/08, 9:57 AM	#216 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
DonMoore10 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,474	Now the real reason comes out as to why the USAC officials didn't inspect the track prior to race day. Too much traveling!! Probably had to stop a few times along the way and rotate those tires on that 18 wheeler (that copy machine in the back must weigh a ton!!).

8/12/08, 10:21 AM	#218 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
Tony Barhorst Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 752	John, The MSCS race has been killed off by bad publicity...races are going to be held weekly at UCS..Including a big modified race. Open wheel racing has been held at UCS the last few years. You can look it up... No one would want to promote any race in two weeks after this....The changes had been made... One reason so many teams pulled out...after the elite teams decided not to run a points race...then I lost many more cars. In reality...it was ELEVEN TEAMS...not even 15 that made the decision...because there are multiple car teams in the top 15. The USAC track Steward Bill Carey....NEVER SPOKE TO ME ALL DAY! MY VOICE IS MUCH DIFFERENT THAN PAT SULLIVAN'S .. NO ONE FROM USAC TOLD THE TOWER/ANNOUNCERS/DICK JORDAN WHAT WAS HAPPENING...THE TEAMS IN QUESTION JUST PULLED OUT. I am sorry that Pat Sullivan had to witness this....But life goes on...Bob Jenkins stayed all night, enjoyed the races we had...as did a good crowd who had chose to stay....The TOP ELEVEN USAC TEAMS ARE NOT GOD"S GIFT TO RACING...There is much more talent out there...AND I WILL PROMOTE THEM.

8/12/08, 10:21 AM	#219 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
767 Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,001	John you should go listen to the broadcast on www.racefanradio.com . then come back and edit your post