Bailey front king pins slop

PatrickMead#13 · 3/13/14, 4:04 PM

I am going over my car and both front spindles have slop in the king pins through the axle itself. There are 2 Allen set screws in the axle and they take up most of the slop but work loose very easily after a few laps even with lock tight. Is this normal for the slop or is this axle past it's prime? There are no bushings in the axle or spindles if that helps. They are for the 4 pin front hubs with a stepped snout. Any input would be appreciated. Thank you.

cbaumeyer48 · 3/13/14, 5:47 PM

Patrick.... I had the same issue with mine.... I eventually pulled the pins and mic'd them to check the tolerance to the boss fit on the axle. They usually oval out the hole after a while and require either new boss fits, or replacing the axle itself. Unfortunately there isn't a good fix , but to replace the parts. Be cautioned, when they get wore out , I've seen a guys right front spindle come off and he went for a destructive ride!

DAD · 3/13/14, 5:55 PM

Pat

They left the factory loose. They are a little light for 1000cc cars of today. We would take and install the King pins and spindle to the axle reach through the two holes with a small drill and mark where the set screws met the king pin then remove the king pin and drill a 1/4" hole about 1/8" deep to give the set screws a place to seat. Seems like we could get two short set screws in there.

Stay with the smaller tracks for right now. The problem is not the fit of the king pin so much as the lightness of the spindle. We have broken the spud out of them on rough fast tracks. Keep an eye out for a midget axle and convert it to your car. Even the midget spindles will be a little loose but them two gyroscope attached to them will help keep things in line at speed.

It's kinda of strange but usually it will be the left spindle that gives you problems.

Honest Dad himself

jjones752 · 3/13/14, 6:34 PM

Guess I'm fortunate, mine are pretty snug. When you say there's no bushings in the axle or spindle, I'm curious; my Bailey setup has needle bearings with outer races that press into the spindle casting and a radial thrust bearing that rides between the bottom of the kingpin boss and the lower spindle "ear" (for lack of a better term).
Mind you, the bearings were pretty tired when I took the car apart but a fresh set from Floyd Bailey and a couple of healthy squirts of Lucas Red 'n' Tacky in the zerks seemed to do the trick...

PatrickMead#13 · 3/14/14, 1:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAD

Pat

They left the factory loose. They are a little light for 1000cc cars of today. We would take and install the King pins and spindle to the axle reach through the two holes with a small drill and mark where the set screws met the king pin then remove the king pin and drill a 1/4" hole about 1/8" deep to give the set screws a place to seat. Seems like we could get two short set screws in there.

Stay with the smaller tracks for right now. The problem is not the fit of the king pin so much as the lightness of the spindle. We have broken the spud out of them on rough fast tracks. Keep an eye out for a midget axle and convert it to your car. Even the midget spindles will be a little loose but them two gyroscope attached to them will help keep things in line at speed.

It's kinda of strange but usually it will be the left spindle that gives you problems.

Honest Dad himself

I have two midget axles sitting on the floor. I'll have to get creative as they are 1/2" mounting bosses and my car is 3/8" bosses.......

DAD · 3/14/14, 1:14 PM

Pat

Like I said the old mini stuff is kinda of light. Get to work it should work just fine. The midget spindles are a lot tuffer bigger king pins etc. I thought the Bailey stuff used 7/16" bolts.

Honest Dad himself

PatrickMead#13 · 3/14/14, 1:17 PM

They have the xh Heims. 7/16" on the rods and 3/8" through the holes......

jjones752 · 3/14/14, 1:28 PM

I have heavier-duty than stock Bailey hardware, possibly 7/16"x7/16", but the heim ends have spacers pressed into them so they adapt to the axle and chassis spuds; you could probably do something similar to adapt midget hardware to your chassis...

TQ29m · 3/14/14, 1:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickMead#13

I have two midget axles sitting on the floor. I'll have to get creative as they are 1/2" mounting bosses and my car is 3/8" bosses.......

Not a problem, do like I do, just buy a short pc of 1/2 X 3/8 tube, and cut short pcs to go in the heims, and still use your 3/8 bosses, might cost a couple of bucks, but it'll work, and the 3/8 bolts are plenty strong enough, as long as you don't pull them in to buy too much torque on them! Bob

97juicedgmc · 3/17/14, 5:29 PM

almost every straight axle race car i have ever seen has done this, my bailey does the same thing every race you tighten the allens and they loosen up, they are always going to have a little play but its always the same amount of play..... if it gets to be more then just a little wiggle then look into replacing them. when i first started i would tighten them up and they would get loose id call floyd get new king pins and install them and it was back to tight again, race it ....there loose, finally after about 4 sets in 4 weeks floyd said to me ....what are you replacing the king pins every week because they get a little movement? i said yea, he says they all do that he says you will never fix that, he said a little play is normal just make sure allens are tight and youll drive your self crazy if you keep replacing them, he says i wish i told you that 4 sets ago would have saved you a ton of time and money.

3/13/14, 5:55 PM	#3 Re: Bailey front king pins slop
DAD Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 5,957	Pat They left the factory loose. They are a little light for 1000cc cars of today. We would take and install the King pins and spindle to the axle reach through the two holes with a small drill and mark where the set screws met the king pin then remove the king pin and drill a 1/4" hole about 1/8" deep to give the set screws a place to seat. Seems like we could get two short set screws in there. Stay with the smaller tracks for right now. The problem is not the fit of the king pin so much as the lightness of the spindle. We have broken the spud out of them on rough fast tracks. Keep an eye out for a midget axle and convert it to your car. Even the midget spindles will be a little loose but them two gyroscope attached to them will help keep things in line at speed. It's kinda of strange but usually it will be the left spindle that gives you problems. Honest Dad himself _________________________________________________ Last edited by DAD; 3/13/14 at 6:02 PM.

3/14/14, 1:28 PM	#8 Re: Bailey front king pins slop
jjones752 Senior Member Race Count This Year: 19 Race Count Last Year: 22 Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 2,259	I have heavier-duty than stock Bailey hardware, possibly 7/16"x7/16", but the heim ends have spacers pressed into them so they adapt to the axle and chassis spuds; you could probably do something similar to adapt midget hardware to your chassis... __________________ Jim Jones Midwest Thunder Speed2 Midget #97 _________________________________________________ Last edited by jjones752; 3/14/14 at 1:33 PM.

3/13/14, 4:04 PM	#1 Bailey front king pins slop
PatrickMead#13 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 954	I am going over my car and both front spindles have slop in the king pins through the axle itself. There are 2 Allen set screws in the axle and they take up most of the slop but work loose very easily after a few laps even with lock tight. Is this normal for the slop or is this axle past it's prime? There are no bushings in the axle or spindles if that helps. They are for the 4 pin front hubs with a stepped snout. Any input would be appreciated. Thank you.

3/13/14, 5:47 PM	#2
cbaumeyer48 Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 247	Patrick.... I had the same issue with mine.... I eventually pulled the pins and mic'd them to check the tolerance to the boss fit on the axle. They usually oval out the hole after a while and require either new boss fits, or replacing the axle itself. Unfortunately there isn't a good fix , but to replace the parts. Be cautioned, when they get wore out , I've seen a guys right front spindle come off and he went for a destructive ride!

3/14/14, 1:14 PM	#6 Re: Bailey front king pins slop
DAD Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 5,957	Pat Like I said the old mini stuff is kinda of light. Get to work it should work just fine. The midget spindles are a lot tuffer bigger king pins etc. I thought the Bailey stuff used 7/16" bolts. Honest Dad himself

3/14/14, 1:17 PM	#7
PatrickMead#13 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 954	They have the xh Heims. 7/16" on the rods and 3/8" through the holes......

3/17/14, 5:29 PM	#10 Re: Bailey front king pins slop
97juicedgmc Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 188	almost every straight axle race car i have ever seen has done this, my bailey does the same thing every race you tighten the allens and they loosen up, they are always going to have a little play but its always the same amount of play..... if it gets to be more then just a little wiggle then look into replacing them. when i first started i would tighten them up and they would get loose id call floyd get new king pins and install them and it was back to tight again, race it ....there loose, finally after about 4 sets in 4 weeks floyd said to me ....what are you replacing the king pins every week because they get a little movement? i said yea, he says they all do that he says you will never fix that, he said a little play is normal just make sure allens are tight and youll drive your self crazy if you keep replacing them, he says i wish i told you that 4 sets ago would have saved you a ton of time and money.