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Vukie (Offline)
  #1 1/28/10 12:40 PM
outsider
  #2 1/28/10 8:20 PM
If you didn't see this coming, you are blind as a MLB umpire.
bigmojo5
  #3 1/28/10 10:35 PM
I believe, and have for a while, that there is much more to than anyone on this board can even imagine. There's a lot of finger pointing and blame being put on Tony George that might not be deserved.
Yes, mistakes have been made, but he's not the only one to make them. He had a lot of help.
And, some of it was just the changing times.
The biggest mistake was the thinking -- by many -- that the Indy 500 and the IMS were indestructable.
I read once that someone said they did not know why Indy was so successful, so the best thing was not to change things that made it magic.

Here's a few thoughts:
1. attendance for practice days, Fast Friday and qualifying started declining when Tom Carnege no longer could say "IT's A NEW TRACK RECORD.!!!!" It was the thrill of seeing a new record that drove those crowds, but the speeds had reached the point where 250 mph was in reach on a track built when the horse and carriage was still the most common mode of transportation. Could anyone survive a crash at those speeds? I believe that, more than any other factor, killed the practice and qualifying crowds.

2. The party in the infield was eliminated. I have spoken with many people who went to the infield to party and a race broke out. They went from $5 infield tickets to sitting in the Penthouse. I know some of my friends will argue that the infield wasn't needed. To some extent, I agree but we lost the connection to an entire generation of young people. Not everyone who is a race fan today was one the first time they went to the Speedway.

3. No one expected the CART/IRL fight to last as long as it did.

4. Even before the split, the heroes of a generation were leaving the sport. Johnny Rutherford, Al Unser, A.J. Foyt, Rick Mears, Mario Andretti, to name a few, all retired before 1996. This left a void of the best known drawing cards the speedway ever had. They were replaced by rent-a-racers -- both from traditional open wheel racing and those "foreigners" -- that could have replaced those legends if their money had not ran out before they established a fan base. As one crew member once told me, sprint and midget drivers had just as good a chance as anyone else to buy the seat in their car.

5. Everyone assumes the financial woes are the result of the large investments made at IMS and the family tired of Tony's spending spree. They don't consider that it might have been investments by other family members that created the most recent set of circumstances.

6. Tony George abandoned his own dreams of a racing career because the family needed him. Tony had been the figurehead for 20 years, but it was still a family-owned business governed by a board comprised primarily of family members. Tony George did not create the Indy Racing League; the Hulman/George family did. Tony George did not spend massive amounts on major renovations that allowed NASCAR and Formula One to compete at the Speedway; the Hulman/George family did.
Tony George did not single-handedly create this mess. The Hulman/George family, and a host of others, did.
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openwheelKT (Offline)
  #4 1/29/10 7:10 AM
I personally think something is up. No way he walks away from everything not to be heard from again. I think all of the recent moves will result in some new involvement. I'm not sure what or when, but I don't see him going away for good. I think all of this leads to something....just not sure what the something is yet.
Shawn (Offline)
  #5 1/29/10 9:38 AM
I have to agree with you, KT. I'll be interested to see where Tony ends up...
Gregg (Offline)
  #6 1/29/10 10:21 AM
I agee with all the points Jim made and I would like to add two more from my perspective.

The complete and total lack of diversity in the sport of Indy Car racing. For the most part the drivers come from the Formula car background (Star Mazda, Atlantics, F2000...). In 1966 when I first came to IMS the rookies that made the race consisted primarily of three sprint car drivers, a midget champion, a NASCAR stock car driver and two top F1 drivers. Today I am supposed to be happy with Bobby D because he alledgedly progressed enough in his career to become a Formula One test driver. I say big deal because way back when Indy attracted a F1 World Champion in Graham Hill. Now that's impressive. It was also about trying to get the best drivers possible. Maybe we were weighted heavily with midget and sprint car drivers back then and maybe on a level playing field a few of then wouldn't cut it. Now it is weighted heavily in ravor of formula car road racing specialists to the extent that I really question how good some of these drivrs really are. Today I hear many times where so-and-so is a rookie and was racing his first or second ever oval track race, at Indy. Since when did the Indianapolis 500 became the place for on-the-job training?

The cars all look the same and sound the same. Indy used to be the Mecca of innovation. Last year almost every car entered at Indy was the 2002-design Dallara with a Honda engine. BOORRING! Again back in 1966 we had a Hawk, Eagles, FE and RE Watsons, a Brabham/Moore, Coyotes, Volstedts, Lotuses, Lolas, Gerhardts, Huffakers, Shrikes, BRPs, a Cecil, an Esiert and a few other home made sleds I can't remember. They were powered by Fords, Chevys, Offys blown and unblown, a Novi, a Turbine and even a twin-engined Porsche. There is speculation whether a new "Delta wing" chassis is going to replace the tired old 2002 Dallara. So now I guess we may have 33 Delta wing-designed cars starting the Indy 500 next year with the same old Honda engines. I think the novelty of this will wear off very quickly.

I don't expect anyone that came into Indy Car racing the last 10-15 years to harken back to the "good old days" like I can. They only can go back to the present day spec series and the immediate pre-cursor that Indycar/Champ car has become. I remember back when I was just entering my teen years race car fabricator and curmudgeon Charlie Peck, whose own racing history probably dated back to the board tracks. He bemoaned the course that Indy Car racing was taking back in the mid-1960s and in his Kentucky-Southern accent he was "tarred of those rear-engined funny cars" that were taking over the sport. I couldn't really share in that distain because my own racing history only went back a couple years when Foyt notched number two at Indy. It's a little late but Charlie, I understand. For me the ICS isn't working. Seeing the same cars that I never was infatuated with in the first place with with the same engines and for the most part drivers with the same backgrounds gives me little incentive to come back to Indy. With the shutting down of Vision the three short track drivers I would want to see may will be reduced to two and if Davey doesn't put a deal together or ends up retiring I am left only with Sarah that raced somewhat local.

I guess all of us were fooled into believing that the Indianapols 500 could never fail no matter what, just like most wall street types thought Bear-Stearns was too big to fail. With the economy, the enormous expence of fielding an Indy car team and the almost total departure of Tony George from the scene this might be the biggest test of Indy Car racing and the Indy 500 since the post World War II days. Nothing, not even the Indy 500 is completely safe. I hope corrections can be made to right the course and I hope that one day I will once again make my trek up I74 to IMS enthusiastically like I did so many times in the past. We will see.
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LEADERS EDGE (Offline)
  #7 1/29/10 10:35 AM
Personally......I am really starting to fully believe this doesn't have as much to do with the money Tony spent as much as it has to do with possibly vast sums of money being lost through what seemed to be sure-fire high return investments. At the end of the day...this may even have very little to do with Tony and the IRL.

The situation at the Speedway sure seems to be running stride for stride with another high profile situation. What at one time I felt to be just rumor mill talk, I am almost convinced of today.

Honestly though; this may be the thing that was needed. Tony seems more engaged today than ever before. For years no one associated with the Speedway seemed to have to work to survive and thrive. It all kinda came and it all seemed endless. There was always talk of vast numbers of people that were related that had what appeared to be nothing more than"ghost" jobs at the facility and they didn't really contribute much to the facility, those days appear to be gone.

As someone who was very much against the IRL because I always felt that it would turn out pretty much as it has, I do feel bad for Tony in a sense because I really believe that he thought he was doing what was best, and maybe in the long run.....he did. You can never say he didn't put his money where his mouth was and help others along the way. In fact, he was probably too generous.

I will say this, the facility lacks much of the soul that it seemed to have in spades when Tony Hulman ran it, but it is absolutely a shining gem when it comes to the grounds themselves and their appearance inside and out. Absolutely best in show when it comes to that.
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Mud Packer (Offline)
  #8 1/29/10 4:25 PM
Originally Posted by LEADERS EDGE:
Personally......I am really starting to fully believe this doesn't have as much to do with the money Tony spent as much as it has to do with possibly vast sums of money being lost through what seemed to be sure-fire high return investments. At the end of the day...this may even have very little to do with Tony and the IRL.

The situation at the Speedway sure seems to be running stride for stride with another high profile situation. What at one time I felt to be just rumor mill talk, I am almost convinced of today.

Honestly though; this may be the thing that was needed. Tony seems more engaged today than ever before. For years no one associated with the Speedway seemed to have to work to survive and thrive. It all kinda came and it all seemed endless. There was always talk of vast numbers of people that were related that had what appeared to be nothing more than"ghost" jobs at the facility and they didn't really contribute much to the facility, those days appear to be gone.

As someone who was very much against the IRL because I always felt that it would turn out pretty much as it has, I do feel bad for Tony in a sense because I really believe that he thought he was doing what was best, and maybe in the long run.....he did. You can never say he didn't put his money where his mouth was and help others along the way. In fact, he was probably too generous.

I will say this, the facility lacks much of the soul that it seemed to have in spades when Tony Hulman ran it, but it is absolutely a shining gem when it comes to the grounds themselves and their appearance inside and out. Absolutely best in show when it comes to that.
The only thing I would add is this. The renovations that have taken place at IMS have been paid for by the corporation and not been shoved down the tax payers throats. When they say they are doing something, it comes WITHOUT their hands out like most stick and ball sports. JMO.

Mike

Be nice to people on the way up. You might need them on the way down. Jimmy Durante
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