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8/2/14, 9:06 AM   #11
Midget18
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Yep we do travel that far to race... We travel to PA and eastern Ohio...
 
8/2/14, 10:04 AM   #12
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DAD
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Gidget

Ya but you guys are like them "Gipsy Outlaw" racer types, always chasing them big purse and big name races. We are just poor underfunded armatures scraping our nickles together to get to a race.

If we could get a few people to build the type of car I am thinking about, there just might just be a few tracks closer to home for us to race at. Right now with your Midget you are in pretty exclusive company.

Midgets for the Masses is what I am looking for, and I think Harold, with his rule package might be on the right path for such a class.

Honest Dad himself

PS did you guys race at Gas City last night?
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Last edited by DAD; 8/2/14 at 10:11 AM.
 
8/2/14, 3:21 PM   #13
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
BrianBSU23
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Dad,

There is currently no engine limit size or rules to prevent this engine, and it would be legal.

We are under the stance as long as the car looks like a traditional Midget from top to bottom along with drives, races, and performs like a traditional Midget should, it would be legal (Not to fast to obsolete the current Midget engine platforms nor to slow to be a safety issue)

Our platform is built upon the foundation to be able to compete in a Midget as economically as possible and give racers the opportunity to get laps and seat time. We also realize there is no such thing as a cheap way to go racing, but we are doing our best to keep costs down (such as turning away product sponsorship money they necessitate a specific brand or part).

The Liguori's and many others have really supported us through this learning curve with the Midgets, and we appreciate everyone's support fan and teamwise. We are in this for the long haul and will do whatever we can to provide great Midget racing for many more years.
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Last edited by BrianBSU23; 8/2/14 at 3:22 PM.
 
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8/2/14, 4:07 PM   #14
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DAD
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Brian

Thanks for the response. We all know that racing is expensive. We also know that racing Midgets is even more expensive than any other form of open wheel dirt track racing. You guys have stuck your neck out to help Midget racing in your area and I hope maybe all around the USA.

Like I told Lindsey we are armature racers. The major Midget sanctioning bodies for some reason or another have stuck their heads in some sort of hole and have failed to recognize that they do have a problem in the Midget Class. Even PowerI has followed suit with it's older brother to more or less rule out the average racer.

Automobile engine design has made great strides in the last 50 or so years since the"Pinto" Esslinger or "Chevy II" motor was designed. To keep up with the stress put on these motors engine builders have resulted into making patches in the form of special Heavy Duty Cylinder heads and blocks.

In that time period The auto makers have been designing better and better engine with much better machine work and more robust design in cast aluminum.

To keep everybody on the same page I am Looking at the engine from a Lincoln LS from about 2000-2009. This engine was designed with the help from Cosworth Engines, Porsche, and Yamaha. In it's stock state sitting in the automobile it has been rated at close to 300 horsepower. With the help from a very modest tune, 400 horsepower should be no problem at all to achieve. Racing with 10 year old Midget motors it might or might not have an advantage. The biggest advantage would be initial cost and the cost of maintenance over the older motors. Buying a Midget motor is the small portion of Midget racing sending the motor back every 10-12 races for the "Freshen Up" is what gets expensive.

I think with the money we saved by not racing this week I will go out and buy one of these little motors and start working on finding an engine builder to help in its development. Maybe next year we can join your program.

Honest Dad himself
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Last edited by DAD; 8/2/14 at 4:11 PM.
 
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8/2/14, 6:20 PM   #15
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DOK
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First off my name is Don O’Keefe Jr. I say this 1st because before I go into any thoughts, ideas, or whatever, I’m not hiding behind a screen name.

Many thanks to Harold, Brian, and all the folks at Montpelier Motor Speedway that have put forth the effort and dedication to make this midget class happen, let alone the great weekly shows thru the season. You have made every effort to interact, notify, and include those who wish to make midget racing happen at Montpelier.

Your rules are inclusive, not exclusive. Dam what a concept, open tire, upright mini sprints, national midgets, Volkswagen, Yamaha, Fontana, Chevy, tall ,short, young, old (like me), male, female, bring your dam car and run. I sit week in and week out looking at some of these posts and wonder why the hell someone can’t just say Thank You for giving us a place to race when we are able too.

Sadly these days it’s easier to jump on the old message board and tell you that you can make everything better if you do this for me because I can’t afford it or for the betterment of the sport you need to do this because everyone else has their head up their rears. I mean honestly Dad have you forgotten about the Ford Focus Fiasco? The Eco Tec Experiment? The supposed Honda (actually there were some guys on the west coast that had a Honda that kicked some butt) motor? Montpelier as of now says bring it, run it, and we’ll go from there. I have 2 midgets we run when we can, one has a 20 year old Fontana in it, and the other has a 14 year old Esslinger. They both run well enough for this 57 year old and the few other drivers that have been behind the wheel. Buy that motor you’re looking at, build it run it and enjoy the process, be a leader and show us how it’s done. Any form of open wheel racing these days is expensive period! But if you want to try this, Montpelier is the perfect place for you to go.

Last week I wasn’t able to run due to issues that I had. Maybe I should have gotten on IOW and suggested you cancel the show because I couldn’t attend. But in all honesty I was happy that 14 cars (plus all the other classes) were able to run despite the lousy weather. I was looking forward to being there tonight, but since Mother Nature once again stepped in. I will say Thank You to all at Montpelier.

Don O’Keefe Jr.
Midgets #0k, 8ok
 
8/2/14, 6:50 PM   #16
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DAD
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Don

My first engine of choice would have been a 410 sprint motor but I felt that might have been pushing the envelop a tad. I by nature am a tinker, I have an aversion to doing things the way everybody else does.

The guys up at Montpelier are also thinking outside the box, to me that is a good thing. More than likely this thing will fall on it's face but you never know until you try. It is taking a lot of talking to get some support on this thing and the last thing I want to do is pee off a bunch of people, maybe I might encourage a few more brave soles t o try something different. Racing has ceased to be experimental and racers have settled into a rut, nobody wants to try anything, they just wait until so and so makes his new engine and go out and spend their last dollar on the thing in order to beat their less financially endowed opponents.

Honest Dad himself
 
8/2/14, 9:29 PM   #17
BrianBSU23
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Don,

Your post and compliments are much appreciated!

Dad,

I've already fielded a call about a 410 in Midget. Actually, it wouldn't perform, drive, appear like a traditional Midget.
We allow for a variety of powerplants, but it will never be run to that extreme. The speeds the midgets ran last week was about as fast as aMidget needs to go on a 1/4 mile.

I' ve talked with Dad a bunch of times. I know he likes what we are doing. He is just promoting discussion.

Our deal will hopefully never fail because we have a very supportive group of car owners behind us. I believe our two 14 car fields were both weather related (along with some hard crashes the night before). I had 22 cars confirmed for tonight until we were rained out.

I think our mission initially was to provide Midget racing economically as we could (and again we know its not cheap), provide seat time for the future and even current stars, and to give Indiana Midget owners somewhere local to race.

We have this nowhere near we want it, but as long as the Midgets continue to put on outstanding racing and fans are willing to put down the $12 to see it we are going to do the best we can to keep providing it for years to come and grow it everyway we can.
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Last edited by BrianBSU23; 8/2/14 at 9:42 PM.
 
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8/2/14, 10:28 PM   #18
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DAD
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Brian

I had actually intended to lay that old 410 over to the left side just like them Midget motors. Then when it was sitting still it would look just like one of them Speed Way Bikes that Scott Daloisio is always talking about, You know just the two left wheels on the ground and the right ones sticking up in the air like two outriggers. Us racers call that driving off of the left rear.

We need to get Scott working on a real midget class race program for out there.

Honest Dad himself
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Last edited by DAD; 8/2/14 at 10:56 PM.
 
8/3/14, 1:20 PM   #19
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
Ken Bonnema
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First, I would like to echo DOK'S sentiments and thank Brian and his people for giving local racers a great place to race their Midgets. I have no doubt that this class will grow and down the road Montpelier will be running B mains. It never ceases to amaze me how many folks want to dummy down Midget Racing. Midgets are an elite form of Motorsports. It is where Tony Stewart and the boys go to play. As such, on any given night you will likely run into a team or teams that have far more funding, ect. than than you. (us). I am not a big Newt Gingrich person but I once saw a video where he started out by saying..." Complete this sentence, If you cannot afford to buy a house......." The obvious answer is Don't buy a house, right?? When I was 18, I was working 3 jobs so I could race. I had an Early Model Stock Car budget, but I wanted more so I scraped $1500.00 up and bought an old, outdated Supermodified an went racin' at San Jose Speedway. My first motor was a bored out 322 buick that blew on the main straight at Clovis. In '74, I bought a used but fresh LT-1 from Lloyd Beard and started running the NASCAR circut in central Ca. I never came close to making a Main at San Jose. Lots of B and C races (remember them??) It never once crossed my mind to try to dummy down this great class. I knew what I was getting into when I went there and was just thrilled to be racing at what was then, the fastest paved 1/3 mile in the world.Since then, far to many classes have sprouted up so everybody can get a trophy. Today, there are many lower cost classes of Midget type cars. The IRS is a great series but if ya live in Indiana ya gotta tow to get to 'em. IMHO, T.Q.'s are the best bang for the buck. There are several groups out here with decent car counts and they cost far less to run........as long as you don't crash, because then you are buying Midget parts to fix it. If I was in a position to go racing, I would would buy a Midget for somewhere between 8K and 12.5K and go race at Montpelier. It's a place where you can just race your car and not have all the ******** that U$@C offers. BTW, I am also a HUGE fan of POWRi. They also do things right. Remember, you can make a small fortune in racing, just start with a large one......
 
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8/3/14, 5:13 PM   #20
Re: Montpelier Speedway Midget Series Returns Sat. August 2
DAD
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Ken. When was the last time a 2 valve motor won the Indy 500, has a 2 valve motor won any formula I races lately. How many race organizations still depend on a 2 valve motor platform other than NASCAR and USAC?

I don't think a new motor platform would dumb down the Midget racing. Paying $40,000.00 for a 2 valve race motor seem kinda of dumb to me. The Esslinger, Fontana , MoPar and TRO are beautiful works of art. They are achieving horse power numbers out of these once 90 Horsepower stock motors that are out of this world. In doing so they have also stressed them dangerously close to becoming BOMBS.

I want to start out with a 300 horsepower motor and maybe shoot for another 100 horsepower or so. If we can find this extra power it would put this motor on par with the TRO's. The only difference is I think We can do this with a stock block and cylinder head. That would do a great deal to bring the cost of owning a midget down a tad. Sure you still have tires>I can remember when they changed right rears every time the car stopped. We still got 4 or 5 dollar per gallon fuel cost to get to the races, work commitments that prevents a lot of us from traveling with the pro's. That is what makes racing expensive.

We have been racing Mini sprints for years, knowing that there was no way that we could afford even a 15 year old midget. With Montpelier and their rule package I think we might start racing Midgets. But we will do it racing a 10 year old slightly tuned stock block motor. Mini Sprints have had phenomenal growth in the last 15 years or so. With a motor like I am thinking about we could do the same for Midgets.

Can you envision a USAC Midget racing at a little track like Montpelier and getting beat by a local with a motor that cost 1/10 of what his motor did?

Honest Dad himself
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Last edited by DAD; 8/3/14 at 5:15 PM.
 
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