Belleville

racefan20 · 8/8/12, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuhn74

@ Don Moore

PLEASE get off your soap box. QUIT complaining and continually being a part of the problem and not the solution. Your solutions will cost people plenty of money in the short term. That, in effect, will take several years of time to average out over being a good decision. We are a society of immediate gratification and people don't want to wait 6-7 years of time to see a return on their money, if it ever actually happens.

If your ideas are the savior for all of midget racing.........PLEASE stop wasting your time on this message board and your money on over priced midgets and engines and utilize your new found time and money to start a new midget series. That series would then be capable of running anywhere you choose in Northern Ohio for any amount of money you choose, without charging a pit pass fee for the entertainers, and you could use a conventional midget chassis with either a motorcycle engine or a junk yard engine and have yourself a dandy old time.

Your cost basis for midget racing is interesting to me as well. It is expensive, it always has been, but people always find money to go racing. It is easy to blame the economy, but racing has a very similar parallel to life............those that are willing to work hard, tend to get more out of it.

These message boards piss me off talking about $40,000-50,000 midget engines and these glorified mega teams that spend millions of dollars racing one midget for a national championship. Neither one of these two are actually true.

You can purchase a brand new engine from FONTANA AUTOMOTIVE right now for $32,500 and I know that Gary Stanton sells the Toyota engine he builds for that same amount. Dan Esslinger also sells his National engine for around the same.

Furthermore, in a effort to help out lower budget teams, we have a program available to allow racers to buy slightly USED engines out of the RW #17 for $25,000, freshly rebuilt, right off of the dyno. This also insures that people understand that they are getting the exact same engines that we race in our own cars. They are not something special with some outrageous price tag that is unattainable.

Both Fontana Automotive and Esslinger have lower cost alternatives to the "National" engine if you so choose. But that is just it Mr. Moore, it is up to the guy that writes the checks what he purchases. On your team, that is you. However, for every other team in the USA and elsewhere, that is not you.

Mr. Moore, you should actually reach around behind yourself and pat yourself on the back...........because, I always lurk on these boards to get a temperature of the water on different subjects, but I rarely respond to anything. You have accomplished something here in my book.

NOW, as you so famously tell just about everyone on every topic........GET BACK ON TOPIC. This thread started about BELLEVILLE. How can we make BELLEVILLE better? How can we restore the luster to this Historic event? For those of you reading this (that I haven't pissed off yet), please contact the Fair Board. Give them suggestions. Don't be mad if they don't use your suggestion, but just be willing to provide them some great ideas. Even if you yourself get nothing in return.

Should the purse structure be changed? Higher pay to start and lower pay to win? It seemed to work for the Gundakers last year at the Gold Crown race. Should USAC come back? Should we all contact our local clubs and begin a gentleman's agreement to not schedule races against Belleville? I mean, honestly, it is only one race a year. Should the Fair Board look at moving the date? Does it still need to be during the Fair? I know that is part of the atmosphere, but not many of the fair goers seem to still be on the racetrack bandwagon like they were in the past. Should the format be changed? Should every organization make this a points paying event like it used to be.

One thing is for sure, I would like to see this and many other Historic events on the midget calender stick around. I encourage others as well to contact the Fair Board with suggestions. Email or call USAC, POWRi, Badger, RMMRA and encourage them to support this event. Encourage them to help bring it back. Encourage them to not schedule against it. ENCOURAGE them in general, don't throw stones at them or tell them how they have done it wrong in the past. We cannot change the past.

I am done with this rant now. I too will now get off my soap box and get back to work. If you would like to further discuss this, please call me.

Thanks,
Brad Kuhn
(317) 852-1791 - Fontana
(317) 373-0351 - Cell

DonMoore10 · 8/8/12, 1:00 PM

Well... That was an entertaining rant. I stand by my positive proposal. I'm confident it would work for the betterment of midget racing at a fraction of the cost of anything mentioned in your post.

And as always, I appreciate your thoughtful advice on IOW. I'll try to keep you in good spirits next time I post.

Don Moore

Jonr · 8/8/12, 2:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonMoore10

Well... That was an entertaining rant. I stand by my positive proposal. I'm confident it would work for the betterment of midget racing at a fraction of the cost of anything mentioned in your post.

And as always, I appreciate your thoughtful advice on IOW. I'll try to keep you in good spirits next time I post.

Don Moore

If you are positive it would work, go make it work. You may become the next Emmett Hahn. You may become the savior of midget racing, but your Don Quixote rants are becoming a bore.

As much as it pains you, you must realize that not everyone see's the world from your point of view. What is worse is not everyone even agrees with your point of view. If you are unhappy with the current box, go build you own box.

Roy Bleckert · 8/8/12, 2:54 PM

Since credentials seemed to be ? I have owned a dyno since 87 that went from Webster/Axtell/Felts/Me that has run everything from Offy's -Jawa speedway bike eng, Sprint/Midget eng, NastyCar Open-restrictor plate,Vtec/Ecotec eng the kids in Socal work on + about every tool or Fab eqiup. to build a Sprint/Midget bumper-bumper without leaving my shop

also have roots that go way back in Midget Racing

http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/fo...p?db=ct&n=4816

@ Racer56 Hi Shane , you should ask Louie about the time Me, Bill Felts & your GrandPa were looking @ wheel polishers about the time he bought Steaker from Goudy in his new Caddy with the high buck paint job , we pulled into KMC wheel & Louies little dog starts yappin @ the junk yard dog there who proceeds to scratch the livin sheet outta the fancy paint job on the Caddy LOLLLLL !!!!!!!

To address your ? to me , I woulds leave the USAC rules alone lets not make peeps that have current equip. have to spend more $ redoing what they already have , let's integrate the new engines in with the current tech to transition into the next generation of Midgets that the kids are into

The more rules the more the separation between haves & have nots , been thru the whole NastyCar restrictor plate/2 barrel carb deal for the locals all it did was make the spread larger between those who had $ to spend vs. those who did not , The Chilli bowl works as a large part cuz there are not many rules

To address your concerns about the new production engines Vtec/Ecotec etc. , that is what the new generation wants to race cuz that is what they grew up on , most do not care about small block chebbies , pinto motors , mech fuel inj etc. & they are not interested in spec motors they can not use the skills they learned working with these engines

That is why I set on the table Lets keep the current specs as is & start integrating the next wave of racers coming up into future of what will be coming in racing one way or another whether any of us like it or not

I have been trying & talking to about every one in charge of Sprint/Midget racing the last 10 years trying to get this stuff outta the dark ages

BTW my ph # is in the old fashion ph book (LOLL !!!) if any one wants to discuss this further

951 242 5397

8/8/12, 5:39 PM

As a outsider looking in I always thought that running a midget was a expensive proposition. Thats the reason we have a minisprint. I figure if the midget is going to survive you need to figure out how to get more people to spend alot of money instead of trying to cut costs in the car. I think the worse thing you can do to a top class of cars is to have too many rules. Usually instead of saving money rules usually just dilute the field.

Racer56 · 8/8/12, 10:10 PM

Good to hear from you Roy and yes I heard about the story. You are spot on in regards to amending the rules to accommodate current engine designs. Currently there is a Honda powered midget running western states that has been fairly successful, but they need additional cubic inches to be completely on par with other midget engines. Hopefully it's only a matter of time before sanctioning bodies see the light.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roy Bleckert

Since credentials seemed to be ? I have owned a dyno since 87 that went from Webster/Axtell/Felts/Me that has run everything from Offy's -Jawa speedway bike eng, Sprint/Midget eng, NastyCar Open-restrictor plate,Vtec/Ecotec eng the kids in Socal work on + about every tool or Fab eqiup. to build a Sprint/Midget bumper-bumper without leaving my shop

also have roots that go way back in Midget Racing

http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/fo...p?db=ct&n=4816

@ Racer56 Hi Shane , you should ask Louie about the time Me, Bill Felts & your GrandPa were looking @ wheel polishers about the time he bought Steaker from Goudy in his new Caddy with the high buck paint job , we pulled into KMC wheel & Louies little dog starts yappin @ the junk yard dog there who proceeds to scratch the livin sheet outta the fancy paint job on the Caddy LOLLLLL !!!!!!!

To address your ? to me , I woulds leave the USAC rules alone lets not make peeps that have current equip. have to spend more $ redoing what they already have , let's integrate the new engines in with the current tech to transition into the next generation of Midgets that the kids are into

The more rules the more the separation between haves & have nots , been thru the whole NastyCar restrictor plate/2 barrel carb deal for the locals all it did was make the spread larger between those who had $ to spend vs. those who did not , The Chilli bowl works as a large part cuz there are not many rules

To address your concerns about the new production engines Vtec/Ecotec etc. , that is what the new generation wants to race cuz that is what they grew up on , most do not care about small block chebbies , pinto motors , mech fuel inj etc. & they are not interested in spec motors they can not use the skills they learned working with these engines

That is why I set on the table Lets keep the current specs as is & start integrating the next wave of racers coming up into future of what will be coming in racing one way or another whether any of us like it or not

I have been trying & talking to about every one in charge of Sprint/Midget racing the last 10 years trying to get this stuff outta the dark ages

BTW my ph # is in the old fashion ph book (LOLL !!!) if any one wants to discuss this further

951 242 5397

jdull99 · 8/8/12, 10:57 PM

Y obsolete all the old equip??? Thats the kind of thiking that will drive the final nails in the coffin of National midget racing (like mand. starters almost did years ago). Good form. to restrict the motors down to reasonable levels. Everybody loved the racing back when it was less than 300 HP with LOTS more cars...

Any1 that believes the current form is working through-out the country better remove their rose colored glasses...

---------- Post added at 9:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 9:49 PM ----------

THERE WERE NO OTHER MIDGET RACES SCHED LAST WKND IN THE MIDWEST!!! Houston, we have a problem!!!

Racer56 · 8/9/12, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdull99

Y obsolete all the old equip??? Thats the kind of thiking that will drive the final nails in the coffin of National midget racing (like mand. starters almost did years ago). Good form. to restrict the motors down to reasonable levels. Everybody loved the racing back when it was less than 300 HP with LOTS more cars...

Any1 that believes the current form is working through-out the country better remove their rose colored glasses...

---------- Post added at 9:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 9:49 PM ----------

THERE WERE NO OTHER MIDGET RACES SCHED LAST WKND IN THE MIDWEST!!! Houston, we have a problem!!!

Having more engine options that are on par power wise with what is currently being run, does not obsolete current engines.

Roy Bleckert · 8/9/12, 1:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer56

Having more engine options that are on par power wise with what is currently being run, does not obsolete current engines.

Racer56 summed it up in a nut shell !

dustbowl · 8/9/12, 1:53 PM

Don Moore: sell your midgets and buy a sprint car.

Posted via Mobile Device

8/8/12, 2:54 PM	#64 Re: Belleville
Roy Bleckert Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 377	Since credentials seemed to be ? I have owned a dyno since 87 that went from Webster/Axtell/Felts/Me that has run everything from Offy's -Jawa speedway bike eng, Sprint/Midget eng, NastyCar Open-restrictor plate,Vtec/Ecotec eng the kids in Socal work on + about every tool or Fab eqiup. to build a Sprint/Midget bumper-bumper without leaving my shop also have roots that go way back in Midget Racing http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/fo...p?db=ct&n=4816 @ Racer56 Hi Shane , you should ask Louie about the time Me, Bill Felts & your GrandPa were looking @ wheel polishers about the time he bought Steaker from Goudy in his new Caddy with the high buck paint job , we pulled into KMC wheel & Louies little dog starts yappin @ the junk yard dog there who proceeds to scratch the livin sheet outta the fancy paint job on the Caddy LOLLLLL !!!!!!! To address your ? to me , I woulds leave the USAC rules alone lets not make peeps that have current equip. have to spend more $ redoing what they already have , let's integrate the new engines in with the current tech to transition into the next generation of Midgets that the kids are into The more rules the more the separation between haves & have nots , been thru the whole NastyCar restrictor plate/2 barrel carb deal for the locals all it did was make the spread larger between those who had $ to spend vs. those who did not , The Chilli bowl works as a large part cuz there are not many rules To address your concerns about the new production engines Vtec/Ecotec etc. , that is what the new generation wants to race cuz that is what they grew up on , most do not care about small block chebbies , pinto motors , mech fuel inj etc. & they are not interested in spec motors they can not use the skills they learned working with these engines That is why I set on the table Lets keep the current specs as is & start integrating the next wave of racers coming up into future of what will be coming in racing one way or another whether any of us like it or not I have been trying & talking to about every one in charge of Sprint/Midget racing the last 10 years trying to get this stuff outta the dark ages BTW my ph # is in the old fashion ph book (LOLL !!!) if any one wants to discuss this further 951 242 5397 _________________________________________________ Last edited by Roy Bleckert; 8/8/12 at 4:29 PM. Reason: miss spelling

8/8/12, 5:39 PM	#65 Re: Belleville
backitin Posts: n/a	As a outsider looking in I always thought that running a midget was a expensive proposition. Thats the reason we have a minisprint. I figure if the midget is going to survive you need to figure out how to get more people to spend alot of money instead of trying to cut costs in the car. I think the worse thing you can do to a top class of cars is to have too many rules. Usually instead of saving money rules usually just dilute the field.

8/8/12, 10:57 PM	#67 Re: Belleville
jdull99 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 6,462	Y obsolete all the old equip??? Thats the kind of thiking that will drive the final nails in the coffin of National midget racing (like mand. starters almost did years ago). Good form. to restrict the motors down to reasonable levels. Everybody loved the racing back when it was less than 300 HP with LOTS more cars... Any1 that believes the current form is working through-out the country better remove their rose colored glasses... ---------- Post added at 9:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 9:49 PM ---------- THERE WERE NO OTHER MIDGET RACES SCHED LAST WKND IN THE MIDWEST!!! Houston, we have a problem!!!