Safety Thread

zeroracer · 10/19/08, 5:30 AM

The kill switch thing wouldnt be too hard, some friends and i had this conversation at one time and I believe closed cockpit racing boats use a check ball/tube style kill switch, it would work where if the car inverts past a certain angle say 85 degrees the ball would go up the tube, causing a short in the switch killing the motor

KRJoyce1 · 10/19/08, 6:11 PM

The center line position of the anchors should be 1.5" from the base of the helmet, and 6" forward from the center of the rear of the helmet. (use a stagger tape so it can easily bend around the surface of the helmet. That rear centerline point should also be 1.5" from the base of the rear of the helmet.

Some helmets have molded features that require you to adjust these positions, so you are on a smooth surface. Usually no more than a quarter or half in. adjustment is needed. I always try to use that 1.5" line as a minumum though and adjust up if needed.

For complete instructions go to:

www.hansdevice.com then click Resouces link and "Anchor Install Instructions"
to see a pdf. of illustrated directions.

Not sure why your anchors are not the same on your helmets?????Should be if models are the same. pm me on that one.

Ken Joyce
KRJ Race Products
ken@krjraceproducts.com

767 · 10/20/08, 1:47 PM

Safety, this is a very tuff issue, because it is not a CHEAP issue. If new seat belts were $100 or a new fire suit was $100 they would be changed out all the time. These items are not cheap. Large teams change there belts ou then sell them to smaller teams. Or look at the fire suits drivers wear. How many of them are wearing IRL related pit crew suits? Several. We need to sind cheaper ways for driver to be safe. Step 2 track safty. I knew the anderson speedway barels would be brought up. Open wheel guys can not stand the fact that when a car goes full throtel into them that it springs back onto the track. Yes this is bad, but the drivers WALK AWAY. I seen way to many stock car drivers severly injured when those barrels were not there. So take the good with the bad. Lets take a look at the burg. Millions of dollars spent redoing the place. How much was put in saftey. Concrete wall all the way around the out side, awsome catch fence mounted correctly, but no safer wall or anything like that to take the blow. No other track in indiana is going to be able to put that kind of money into there facilities. Why do we think things are going to change in the future?

fridaynightracer · 10/20/08, 7:16 PM

Yes i think there could be some safety issues addressed. But the racers know that there is a chance that they could get hurt. That doesnt stop them from strapping in every night. This is racing people expect it to be fast and exciting.Some of these ideas are crazy.

safetyworker · 10/21/08, 9:28 PM

I would like to congratulate all the folks who have participated in this discussion...it is nice to hear so many folks who are concerned about safety respond with thoughts and ideas...let's keep it up! Please feel free to visit my blog on racing safety...
http://racingsafety.blogspot.com/

You folks are what keeps me sweating in a firesuit in July...racing folks are special folks!

onthegas7j · 10/22/08, 8:21 AM

i use every piece of equipment i can get, have a good impact helmet, good alpine stars dual layer suit that i bought 2 years ago at the start of the 07 season, granted i havent run much the last 2 years being in the marine corps but they have served me well bein that i had a nasty flip last year, i cant aford a hans but i did have one of those generic hutchins kinda deals that gforce makes that was only around 100 dollars and that saved me a lot of headache. but i will never get in a race car again without that head and neck system again... I know everytime i get in that car i could get hurt just like im pretty sure daron knows he could get hurt to, but as racers we understand that and work past it, granted were not gonna do anything stupid to endanger ourselves, and take every precaution possible.

safetyworker · 10/22/08, 9:50 AM

Safety, this is a very tuff issue, because it is not a CHEAP issue. If new seat belts were $100 or a new fire suit was $100 they would be changed out all the time. These items are not cheap. Large teams change there belts ou then sell them to smaller teams. Or look at the fire suits drivers wear. How many of them are wearing IRL related pit crew suits? Several. We need to sind cheaper ways for driver to be safe. Step 2 track safty. I knew the anderson speedway barels would be brought up. Open wheel guys can not stand the fact that when a car goes full throtel into them that it springs back onto the track. Yes this is bad, but the drivers WALK AWAY. I seen way to many stock car drivers severly injured when those barrels were not there. So take the good with the bad. Lets take a look at the burg. Millions of dollars spent redoing the place. How much was put in saftey. Concrete wall all the way around the out side, awsome catch fence mounted correctly, but no safer wall or anything like that to take the blow. No other track in indiana is going to be able to put that kind of money into there facilities. Why do we think things are going to change in the future?

I appreciate your point...and let's expand on it.

Improvements to the track facilities are going to take time. As much as I am an advocate of racing safety, I am also a realist. We need to improve the factors within our control first...then we can move on to other areas. The SAFER barrier was not developed overnight. I wholeheartedly believe someone will come up with a short-track wall package that will revolutionize our tracks. We have some very bright folks in racing...it will happen. Approaching the owner/promoter at your local track about specific areas of concern with an attitude of problem-solving, not confrontation, will go a long way. How can we expect a track to invest in safety if the participants have not done the basics?

BTW, belts are not very expensive...new basic Simpson 5 pt @ $109...top of the line Platinum 6 pt @ $145.

New Simpson Super Sport firesuits (SFI 5) @ $399...not pocket change...and a lot less expensive than a basic emergency room visit and way cheaper than a trip to the Burn Unit. Let's think about upgrading to mutli-layer suits...at least FR undies!

onthegas7j · 10/23/08, 9:56 AM

i have fr undies and alot of guys dont wear em cause they say it gets to hot in the summer but i say hog wash, your life is worth a little bit of sweating for 30 laps plain and simple....

767 · 10/23/08, 1:29 PM

"I appreciate your point...and let's expand on it.

Improvements to the track facilities are going to take time. As much as I am an advocate of racing safety, I am also a realist. We need to improve the factors within our control first...then we can move on to other areas. The SAFER barrier was not developed overnight. I wholeheartedly believe someone will come up with a short-track wall package that will revolutionize our tracks. We have some very bright folks in racing...it will happen. Approaching the owner/promoter at your local track about specific areas of concern with an attitude of problem-solving, not confrontation, will go a long way. How can we expect a track to invest in safety if the participants have not done the basics?

"BTW, belts are not very expensive...new basic Simpson 5 pt @ $109...top of the line Platinum 6 pt @ $145.

New Simpson Super Sport firesuits (SFI 5) @ $399...not pocket change...and a lot less expensive than a basic emergency room visit and way cheaper than a trip to the Burn Unit. Let's think about upgrading to mutli-layer suits...at least FR undies!"

Thanks for posting prices, the ones i was looking at were over $200. I guess the main thing going on right now is the lack of support. Its to the point right now that if you get 20 cars to show up in each class you are doing very good. Less cars, less people, less money to go around. I think everyone understands this. I would applaud any track that would put tires up on the wall right now. Are they the long term answers, no. will they help, in some issues yes. Almost every race track has a pile of tires lieing around. You guys are right some things need to start happening. I would be willing to bet if a track wanted to do a project like this, they could probablly get some free help right here on the board.

safetyworker · 10/23/08, 8:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onthegas7j

i have fr undies and alot of guys dont wear em cause they say it gets to hot in the summer but i say hog wash, your life is worth a little bit of sweating for 30 laps plain and simple....

I appreciate your resolve to wear the FR skivvies. Was recently chatting with a driver who wears a single layer suit...encouraging him to wear the FR undies...he was not convinced it was a prudent idea...after listening to his rationale, I merely offered to not wear mine either when I would be coming to potentially assist him...guess he changed his mind. Go figure! <G>

10/19/08, 5:30 AM	#61 Re: Safety Thread
zeroracer Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 251	The kill switch thing wouldnt be too hard, some friends and i had this conversation at one time and I believe closed cockpit racing boats use a check ball/tube style kill switch, it would work where if the car inverts past a certain angle say 85 degrees the ball would go up the tube, causing a short in the switch killing the motor

10/19/08, 6:11 PM	#62 Re: Safety Thread
KRJoyce1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 182	The center line position of the anchors should be 1.5" from the base of the helmet, and 6" forward from the center of the rear of the helmet. (use a stagger tape so it can easily bend around the surface of the helmet. That rear centerline point should also be 1.5" from the base of the rear of the helmet. Some helmets have molded features that require you to adjust these positions, so you are on a smooth surface. Usually no more than a quarter or half in. adjustment is needed. I always try to use that 1.5" line as a minumum though and adjust up if needed. For complete instructions go to: www.hansdevice.com then click Resouces link and "Anchor Install Instructions" to see a pdf. of illustrated directions. Not sure why your anchors are not the same on your helmets?????Should be if models are the same. pm me on that one. Ken Joyce KRJ Race Products ken@krjraceproducts.com

10/20/08, 1:47 PM	#63 Re: Safety Thread
767 Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,112	Safety, this is a very tuff issue, because it is not a CHEAP issue. If new seat belts were $100 or a new fire suit was $100 they would be changed out all the time. These items are not cheap. Large teams change there belts ou then sell them to smaller teams. Or look at the fire suits drivers wear. How many of them are wearing IRL related pit crew suits? Several. We need to sind cheaper ways for driver to be safe. Step 2 track safty. I knew the anderson speedway barels would be brought up. Open wheel guys can not stand the fact that when a car goes full throtel into them that it springs back onto the track. Yes this is bad, but the drivers WALK AWAY. I seen way to many stock car drivers severly injured when those barrels were not there. So take the good with the bad. Lets take a look at the burg. Millions of dollars spent redoing the place. How much was put in saftey. Concrete wall all the way around the out side, awsome catch fence mounted correctly, but no safer wall or anything like that to take the blow. No other track in indiana is going to be able to put that kind of money into there facilities. Why do we think things are going to change in the future?

10/20/08, 7:16 PM	#64 Re: Safety Thread
fridaynightracer Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 65	Yes i think there could be some safety issues addressed. But the racers know that there is a chance that they could get hurt. That doesnt stop them from strapping in every night. This is racing people expect it to be fast and exciting.Some of these ideas are crazy.

10/21/08, 9:28 PM	#65 Re: Safety Thread
safetyworker Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 44	I would like to congratulate all the folks who have participated in this discussion...it is nice to hear so many folks who are concerned about safety respond with thoughts and ideas...let's keep it up! Please feel free to visit my blog on racing safety... http://racingsafety.blogspot.com/ You folks are what keeps me sweating in a firesuit in July...racing folks are special folks!

10/22/08, 8:21 AM	#66 Re: Safety Thread
onthegas7j Senior Member Race Count This Year: 48 Race Count Last Year: 31 Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 302	i use every piece of equipment i can get, have a good impact helmet, good alpine stars dual layer suit that i bought 2 years ago at the start of the 07 season, granted i havent run much the last 2 years being in the marine corps but they have served me well bein that i had a nasty flip last year, i cant aford a hans but i did have one of those generic hutchins kinda deals that gforce makes that was only around 100 dollars and that saved me a lot of headache. but i will never get in a race car again without that head and neck system again... I know everytime i get in that car i could get hurt just like im pretty sure daron knows he could get hurt to, but as racers we understand that and work past it, granted were not gonna do anything stupid to endanger ourselves, and take every precaution possible.

10/22/08, 9:50 AM	#67 Re: Safety Thread
safetyworker Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 44	Safety, this is a very tuff issue, because it is not a CHEAP issue. If new seat belts were $100 or a new fire suit was $100 they would be changed out all the time. These items are not cheap. Large teams change there belts ou then sell them to smaller teams. Or look at the fire suits drivers wear. How many of them are wearing IRL related pit crew suits? Several. We need to sind cheaper ways for driver to be safe. Step 2 track safty. I knew the anderson speedway barels would be brought up. Open wheel guys can not stand the fact that when a car goes full throtel into them that it springs back onto the track. Yes this is bad, but the drivers WALK AWAY. I seen way to many stock car drivers severly injured when those barrels were not there. So take the good with the bad. Lets take a look at the burg. Millions of dollars spent redoing the place. How much was put in saftey. Concrete wall all the way around the out side, awsome catch fence mounted correctly, but no safer wall or anything like that to take the blow. No other track in indiana is going to be able to put that kind of money into there facilities. Why do we think things are going to change in the future? I appreciate your point...and let's expand on it. Improvements to the track facilities are going to take time. As much as I am an advocate of racing safety, I am also a realist. We need to improve the factors within our control first...then we can move on to other areas. The SAFER barrier was not developed overnight. I wholeheartedly believe someone will come up with a short-track wall package that will revolutionize our tracks. We have some very bright folks in racing...it will happen. Approaching the owner/promoter at your local track about specific areas of concern with an attitude of problem-solving, not confrontation, will go a long way. How can we expect a track to invest in safety if the participants have not done the basics? BTW, belts are not very expensive...new basic Simpson 5 pt @ $109...top of the line Platinum 6 pt @ $145. New Simpson Super Sport firesuits (SFI 5) @ $399...not pocket change...and a lot less expensive than a basic emergency room visit and way cheaper than a trip to the Burn Unit. Let's think about upgrading to mutli-layer suits...at least FR undies!

10/23/08, 9:56 AM	#68 Re: Safety Thread
onthegas7j Senior Member Race Count This Year: 48 Race Count Last Year: 31 Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 302	i have fr undies and alot of guys dont wear em cause they say it gets to hot in the summer but i say hog wash, your life is worth a little bit of sweating for 30 laps plain and simple....

10/23/08, 1:29 PM	#69 Re: Safety Thread
767 Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,112	"I appreciate your point...and let's expand on it. Improvements to the track facilities are going to take time. As much as I am an advocate of racing safety, I am also a realist. We need to improve the factors within our control first...then we can move on to other areas. The SAFER barrier was not developed overnight. I wholeheartedly believe someone will come up with a short-track wall package that will revolutionize our tracks. We have some very bright folks in racing...it will happen. Approaching the owner/promoter at your local track about specific areas of concern with an attitude of problem-solving, not confrontation, will go a long way. How can we expect a track to invest in safety if the participants have not done the basics? "BTW, belts are not very expensive...new basic Simpson 5 pt @ $109...top of the line Platinum 6 pt @ $145. New Simpson Super Sport firesuits (SFI 5) @ $399...not pocket change...and a lot less expensive than a basic emergency room visit and way cheaper than a trip to the Burn Unit. Let's think about upgrading to mutli-layer suits...at least FR undies!" Thanks for posting prices, the ones i was looking at were over $200. I guess the main thing going on right now is the lack of support. Its to the point right now that if you get 20 cars to show up in each class you are doing very good. Less cars, less people, less money to go around. I think everyone understands this. I would applaud any track that would put tires up on the wall right now. Are they the long term answers, no. will they help, in some issues yes. Almost every race track has a pile of tires lieing around. You guys are right some things need to start happening. I would be willing to bet if a track wanted to do a project like this, they could probablly get some free help right here on the board.