USAC pavement sprint cars

snoopy · 9/17/10, 7:13 AM

Difficult question!

Different tire company. Usac goes Goodyear, HOSS stays Hoosier, and Extreme goes American. This saves money how?

Combo cars, now we would have even more pavement cars setting around. Hard telling the owners to make a planter out of their new Beast pavement car.

Where does a person learn? Take the wing off and go to Winchester. Not good. Maybe some races at Grundy, Spartan, Columbus and other smaller tracks. These tracks would be much easier on the cars also.

Weight. stock cars way back in the 70's when I ran them would build light and then add ballest for handling. Yes my "pavement dirt car" and driver can make 1600 lb.

Yes I have a one car, one engine, one steering, 2 axles for each end.
Why would I want to start the season with Salem, Winchester and the little 500. It could be a short summer.

Universal rules would help

If anything happens I guess that I'm ready, been running a dirt car on pavement for years.

LEADERS EDGE · 9/17/10, 9:08 AM

No doubt about it...rules could be made so a car could run both dirt and pavement. I still don't believe that would do much to get cars because not everyone who owns a pavement car is running as it is.
(Nor would I want to run todays dirt cars on pavement without some significant chassis changes.)

If 95 percent of all of the pavement cars available to compete, were competing today, then I would say that is something that should be looked into. Thats just not the case. There are people out there who have already made the investment in the car and equipment, but still do not race on a regular basis because of tire and testing costs.

From Kenyon cars to Sprint cars I hear the same two words that are citied as the reasons people don't race anymore or as much.....testing and tires.

Solving these issues aren't that easy either.....many of the tracks won't schedule pavement shows if the sanctioning body limits or bans testing. They feel they need that income. The sanctioning body does not have the leverage of a guarenteed large car count nor the more important factor....a large fan following to entice these tracks into booking races.

The tire company is paying the sanctioning body not as a sponsorship, but more of a kickback. The tire company providing tires for USAC makes the bulk of it's money from racing and in doing so it has to generate profit margines and show growth each year. By taking the kickback...the sanctioning body basically gives up any leverage it posseses in limiting what the tire company does. The mice are in charge of the cheese.

All of this leads to small car counts and the cycle continues to feed itself because of one thing....Money. When the sanctioning body lost sight of it's true core, what it's main products are and how to generate income based on selling it's product verses SELLING TO it's product....well you have what you have today.

If we fix the core problems....then we could look at things like chassis. A chassis rule may work for a race or half a year, but by the end we will be back were we are today, except now the people who were really the supporters of pavement racing and had the pave only cars are now pissed and won't run at all.

#1jackhewittfan · 9/17/10, 11:17 AM

need something like the mscs for pavement non wing sprints. a series with a tire rule no outrageous sanction fee and run alot of the smaller pavement tracks around and maybe winchester and salem once a year.
Posted via Mobile Device

SPRINTCAR · 9/17/10, 12:27 PM

Well, all of the Usac guys could put a wing on their cars next year and run with the other outfits.

Seadog · 9/17/10, 12:52 PM

Racing is my favorite pleasant diversion. USAC Pavement racing is my favorite type of racing. If it goes away, I will be able make it through. Right now I have way more important things to worry about in my life than that.

1121 · 9/17/10, 1:13 PM

I hate to disappoint you all, but the problem is not with the tire companies. The problem is not with the sanctioning bodies. The problem is not even with chassis manufacturers or the engine builders.

The problem is with the car owners! (Remember I am one) As long as the various owners out there are willing to spend $2000 to make $1000, then this problem will persist in some fashion. The mentality of the car owners have changed over the years, as well as the drivers. Very few drivers are actually running for money any more. Most of the pavement cars (and many dirt cars also) are either father – son teams or buy-a –rides. The fathers will spend outrages amounts of money because they think their son is the next big thing. And the drivers that buy their rides make the car go to the highest bidder rather than who can wheel it the best. Then when they are the highest bidder, they seem shocked when to car owner goes with someone else because they brought more money.

We don’t need rule changes; we need car owners with a brain! If every car owner refused to put on more than two tires, guess what? Then we wouldn’t use as many tires. Now I know this has absolutely no chance of happening. I understand that there will always be that car owner (s) that will spend whatever amount it takes to win a race. But don’t blame the tire companies for wanting to sell tires. Nobody makes us buy those tires. It is our own fault. And it will be our fault when pavement racing goes away and doesn’t come back.

We have met the enemy and he is us.

Tom Paterson
HOSS Sprint #11

Pavement Dave · 9/17/10, 1:35 PM

This might be a stupid question but do all the top teams that run pavement with USAC such as TSR, Kunz, East buy all thier tires? I didnt know if some of these teams get free rubber form Hoosier or substancially reduced prices. I always wonedered this question and wonder if anyone actually knows.

TQ29m · 9/17/10, 1:49 PM

I seriously doubt anyone would actually admit it, either party! Bob

mccune88 · 9/17/10, 3:37 PM

Here is what ive seen... made my first race back with usac sprints in a long time...raced toledo 50 lap feature spent about 1200.00 in tires finised 11th and walked away with a lil more that 500.00 makes me wanna go right to the next race..lol.....what i would like to see is someone at usac to have the nuts to say its a 3 tire rule 1 new RF a 60 compound ! 1 new RR the 55 compound and a 30 for the LR.....and thats all u get for the night dont care what u run in hot laps but the 3 new ones u Qualify on stay on all nt and get stamped per night at Qualifying it will take alot of cost away from teams that cant afford to spend a grand a night and why should we to get paid crap if u run 10th...and the same goes for the wing racing i wish they would all adapt a tire rule of some kind no matter how it works out!!!

Jimmy

TQ29m · 9/17/10, 3:49 PM

Not that I run any pavement anymore, but I'd rather see a number limit, rather than a spec tire, dirt or ashfault, unless of course you somehow damage one, rather than just wore it out. JMHO. Bob

9/17/10, 1:49 PM	#58 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
TQ29m Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 6,565	I seriously doubt anyone would actually admit it, either party! Bob __________________ "Being old, isn't half as much fun, as getting there"! Ole Robert I!

9/17/10, 3:49 PM	#60 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
TQ29m Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 6,565	Not that I run any pavement anymore, but I'd rather see a number limit, rather than a spec tire, dirt or ashfault, unless of course you somehow damage one, rather than just wore it out. JMHO. Bob __________________ "Being old, isn't half as much fun, as getting there"! Ole Robert I!

9/17/10, 7:13 AM	#51 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
snoopy Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 173	Difficult question! Different tire company. Usac goes Goodyear, HOSS stays Hoosier, and Extreme goes American. This saves money how? Combo cars, now we would have even more pavement cars setting around. Hard telling the owners to make a planter out of their new Beast pavement car. Where does a person learn? Take the wing off and go to Winchester. Not good. Maybe some races at Grundy, Spartan, Columbus and other smaller tracks. These tracks would be much easier on the cars also. Weight. stock cars way back in the 70's when I ran them would build light and then add ballest for handling. Yes my "pavement dirt car" and driver can make 1600 lb. Yes I have a one car, one engine, one steering, 2 axles for each end. Why would I want to start the season with Salem, Winchester and the little 500. It could be a short summer. Universal rules would help If anything happens I guess that I'm ready, been running a dirt car on pavement for years.

9/17/10, 9:08 AM	#52 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
LEADERS EDGE Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 980	No doubt about it...rules could be made so a car could run both dirt and pavement. I still don't believe that would do much to get cars because not everyone who owns a pavement car is running as it is. (Nor would I want to run todays dirt cars on pavement without some significant chassis changes.) If 95 percent of all of the pavement cars available to compete, were competing today, then I would say that is something that should be looked into. Thats just not the case. There are people out there who have already made the investment in the car and equipment, but still do not race on a regular basis because of tire and testing costs. From Kenyon cars to Sprint cars I hear the same two words that are citied as the reasons people don't race anymore or as much.....testing and tires. Solving these issues aren't that easy either.....many of the tracks won't schedule pavement shows if the sanctioning body limits or bans testing. They feel they need that income. The sanctioning body does not have the leverage of a guarenteed large car count nor the more important factor....a large fan following to entice these tracks into booking races. The tire company is paying the sanctioning body not as a sponsorship, but more of a kickback. The tire company providing tires for USAC makes the bulk of it's money from racing and in doing so it has to generate profit margines and show growth each year. By taking the kickback...the sanctioning body basically gives up any leverage it posseses in limiting what the tire company does. The mice are in charge of the cheese. All of this leads to small car counts and the cycle continues to feed itself because of one thing....Money. When the sanctioning body lost sight of it's true core, what it's main products are and how to generate income based on selling it's product verses SELLING TO it's product....well you have what you have today. If we fix the core problems....then we could look at things like chassis. A chassis rule may work for a race or half a year, but by the end we will be back were we are today, except now the people who were really the supporters of pavement racing and had the pave only cars are now pissed and won't run at all.

9/17/10, 11:17 AM	#53
#1jackhewittfan Senior Member Race Count This Year: 45 Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 356	need something like the mscs for pavement non wing sprints. a series with a tire rule no outrageous sanction fee and run alot of the smaller pavement tracks around and maybe winchester and salem once a year. Posted via Mobile Device

9/17/10, 12:27 PM	#54 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
SPRINTCAR Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,501	Well, all of the Usac guys could put a wing on their cars next year and run with the other outfits.

9/17/10, 12:52 PM	#55 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
Seadog Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 2,136	Racing is my favorite pleasant diversion. USAC Pavement racing is my favorite type of racing. If it goes away, I will be able make it through. Right now I have way more important things to worry about in my life than that.

9/17/10, 1:35 PM	#57 Re: USAC pavement sprint cars
Pavement Dave Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 475	This might be a stupid question but do all the top teams that run pavement with USAC such as TSR, Kunz, East buy all thier tires? I didnt know if some of these teams get free rubber form Hoosier or substancially reduced prices. I always wonedered this question and wonder if anyone actually knows.