We build our own engines for the sprints, and if we ran these little guys we would build our own engines for them also. We can't see having someone do what we can do ourselves. That includes the rest of the car also. You save thousands on thousands doing it that way. And you don't always need new this and that, thats the want list. And for many people their want list well exceeds the need list.

Originally Posted by griffithracing I was just wondering ,Why do late model shows pay so much to win??? How much does WOO sprints make to win?

WoO pays $10,000 to win, $5,000 for second and $800 to start for a one day show.

[DonMoore10]

Staggerman, that is exactly my point!! The midget owners/drivers cannot have it both ways!! You can't have it one way in Oklahoma at what most people call the biggest midget event of the year and have it another way in Indiana. One of two things needs to happen.

1. The midget/owners and drivers boycott the event... or

2. Some how, some way, the midget owners/drivers bring intense pressure on the promoters there to pay a respectable purse. By that I mean something like $25,000 to win and pay a respectable purse on back. That would include boosting the purse considerably for each preliminary night... for example $5,000 to win and a respectable purse for the positions on back.

But until this "Oklahoma Gold Rush" attitude goes away, all of you are wasting ur time even talking about larger midget purses for the outdoor season. It's not gonna happen as long as these two guys pay pennies to race midgets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! When are all of you ever going to figure this out and get real?

[Hawker]

It costs our owner/driver $500 to race our winged 360 one night if we don't break anything. That covers fuel for the truck and car...Pit passes for 4 and a new RR. He's lucky because the shop is 10 miles from the track.

Sammy and Steve figured it out years ago. Own your own team, have corporate sponsorship pay all of your expenses, and pocket ALL of the winnings. I heard an interview with Sammy several years ago where he stated that he made some investments quite some time back and "did good with them". That is the ONLY way to make money racing sprints and midgets.

[Hawker]

Originally Posted by DonMoore10 Staggerman, that is exactly my point!! The midget owners/drivers cannot have it both ways!! You can't have it one way in Oklahoma at what most people call the biggest midget event of the year and have it another way in Indiana. One of two things needs to happen. 1. The midget/owners and drivers boycott the event... or 2. Some how, some way, the midget owners/drivers bring intense pressure on the promoters there to pay a respectable purse. By that I mean something like $25,000 to win and pay a respectable purse on back. That would include boosting the purse considerably for each preliminary night... for example $5,000 to win and a respectable purse for the positions on back. But until this "Oklahoma Gold Rush" attitude goes away, all of you are wasting ur time even talking about larger midget purses for the outdoor season. It's not gonna happen as long as these two guys pay pennies to race midgets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! When are all of you ever going to figure this out and get real?

That's why I never could understand why people are so wrapped up in how much a race pays to win. Only one team gets the winners share. What a race pays to start, is the key. Also, what does 10th through 24th pay???

Look at the Knoxville Nationals. Though it pays something like $140k to win, it also pays something like $5k for the first non transfer out of the "C MAIN"!!!

It's going to be interesting to see the car count for the $15k to win midget race at Granite City this Fall. Considering who is promoting it, I seriously doubt that the payback will be too good. USAC is off that weekend and it is PowerI sanctioned...

[DonMoore10]

$1000 to start the feature. Look for every midget in America to be there.

[E.P.]

I have to admit on this Jackie Robinson Day in America I didn't think I would be reading "Silly Bowl" or "Oklahoma Sweat Shop" or "Oklahoma Gold Rush" comments form my main man DonMoore10.

Why do all of you choose to look at your cups half empty?

Didja all stop to thank your maker this morning that you could have been born in Istanbul or Mozambique and not ever know what a Spike dirt car or a Beast combo car was or ever hear the sound of an Ed Pink bullet screaming around the high banks of Belleville even if it ran you over and knocked the turbin off your head?

I concede the high ground that purses are stuck in the 60's, 70's or
80's...take your pick but the taxi cab contingent can pay 10K per event because they have the front gate to support the purse.

Do you think Anderson could have paid that kind of purse with a sparsley filled grandstand on a bright sunny Sunday afternoon? Do you think Kenly could have paid that kind of purse? Shoot they couldn't even get EMT's to the track on time or get proper push trucks.

Rome wasn't built in a day and this problem will not go away anytime soon. There are many pieces to the answer one of which is to get out to the USAC shows and support the promoter for making the investment he has in the event. :checkered:

[Seadog]

Originally Posted by E.P. I have to admit on this Jackie Robinson Day in America I didn't think I would be reading "Silly Bowl" or "Oklahoma Sweat Shop" or "Oklahoma Gold Rush" comments form my main man DonMoore10. Why do all of you choose to look at your cups half empty? Didja all stop to thank your maker this morning that you could have been born in Istanbul or Mozambique and not ever know what a Spike dirt car or a Beast combo car was or ever hear the sound of an Ed Pink bullet screaming around the high banks of Belleville even if it ran you over and knocked the turbin off your head? I concede the high ground that purses are stuck in the 60's, 70's or 80's...take your pick but the taxi cab contingent can pay 10K per event because they have the front gate to support the purse. Do you think Anderson could have paid that kind of purse with a sparsley filled grandstand on a bright sunny Sunday afternoon? Do you think Kenly could have paid that kind of purse? Shoot they couldn't even get EMT's to the track on time or get proper push trucks. Rome wasn't built in a day and this problem will not go away anytime soon. There are many pieces to the answer one of which is to get out to the USAC shows and support the promoter for making the investment he has in the event. :checkered:

Post of the week. No, make that post of the year.:applaud::checkered:

[ossuks]

Ty-EP
Cold, hard facts. People will flock to a LM show or a winged show and pay $40 to sit ass to ass and watch that type of racing. I have to say I would not go if it was free. I am in a minority,just as most that post on this board.
Next time you take your head out of the sand, look around, if your math skills lack, buy a calculatoer. Count the bodys, multiply, devide. hell even try some guesstimating. The answer will be that open-wheel non wing racing has a cult like following. They are loyal, love their sport, will travel the planet to watch. The trouble is they can all make the trip in a micro bus.

[DonMoore10]

And that last post brings me to this point. When are all the promoters and sanctioning bodies going to wakeup and decide that they have to improve the entertainment value of open wheel racing. By that I mean some new and fresh ways to present the product. The presentation of the product hasn't changed since I started going to races a zillion years ago. How many McDonald's restaurants have you seen torn down and a fresh building erected to attract the comtemporary customer. Do you still watch a 7 inch screen black and white TV? Would TV commercials that you saw many years ago work in today's market?

Where we have been:

1. Racing till all hours of the night... and morning. A major turnoff to me and the fans. Great way to send home the fans pissed. Did the powers ever think of getting all the nonsense preliminaries over like hot laps and qualifying by 7 PM? People come to see racing, not a bunch of jacking around.

2. Same racing format for a zillion years. Qualify, heats, semi, feature. A zillion years ago the midgets had the Austrailian pursuit race. That seemed to have disappeared. At Montpelier a few years ago, the midgets ran two 20 lap features. The fans loved it. Haven't seen it since. There's an idea that worked and nobody picked up on it. Duh.

Recognition of drivers winning the race. The driver used to carry the checkered flag around the track after the win. I presented this idea several months ago and it was resounding yes to that including drivers. Well... I been to several indoor races and haven't seen it yet. Another idea to sharpen the entertainment value that nobody's picked up on. Duh.

Problems with the pill draw/point system. Haven't seen a good solution to it yet. So if ur in the fourth heat race and tie several others with points from previous heat races, you may want to plan on loading up early. Another bad deal for the racers and fans. My suggestion of another draw to break the ties... haven't seen that either.

When the pill draw is used, how about running the heat race for 8 laps or so, wave the checkered flag and reverse the order, then go another 8 laps. Total the points from each race. Something different to try.

Racing with radios. Get the guys off the track that don't want to get in line. I'm personally tired of watching race drivers go lap after lap (with radios) and not get in line. Either get in line immediately or load up and go home.

Start the clock for intermissions and stick by it. 10 minutes and we're starting to race. No exceptions. BMARA does this and it works.

Now... costs of racing. We can post on here all day, but the fact is that almost every racing organization has done nothing... that's nothing.. to reduce the costs of racing. And now we have $4 a gallon fuel costs to contend with. USAC is the biggest problem, allowing bigger engines, namely the Esslinger and Fontana driving up costs for owners to stay competitive. This is just one example. Plan on USAC doing nothing as long as 20-40 midgets show up to race, mostly multi-millionaire/factory supported teams/some with salaried drivers racing for $2500 to win. Stop and think of how rediculous that is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When are we going to make some drastic changes in tires to even the competition. I keep hearing it won't make any difference.. OK... when was it tried?????????? Why do we need such big tires to race? Did anybody ever think that we would attract more participants if the costs weren't so high?? The fans on this message board love to see a big car count. Duh. Are you listiening promoters and sanctioning bodies?

Outlaw purose built cars. I've already posted on this many times and I keep hearing that it can't be done. Register one car for the season would be a start. Legislation could be worked out for this with some creativity.

Can anybody name me one item that has been initiated by the new order at USAC to drastically reduce the cost of racing????????????

And finally as much as I love POWRi/Siner/Brown/BMARA..... guys you need to step out of the box and reinvent midget racing with some fresh ideas. We don't know if they will work unless we try them. Is anybody trying???????