[Jerry Shaw]

As usual, I think Scott Baue is pretty well spot on, here. Sprint car racing has always been dangerous and it always will be. My Uncle Jim had steel plates in both arms, for the last 40 years of his life, from sprint car racing as it was in the 60's and 70's. But, you would have never known it if you hadn't heard the story from my Aunt. That air of danger is part of what draws people in, from hundreds of miles away, to see it.

With that said, especially with the technology that exists today, every accident with injury that occurs should be investigated fully, to find out what caused it to happen and prevent the same thing from again, in the future. If at all possible.

Jerry

[TQ29m]

Originally Posted by robert gatten There has always been the tragic results of racing and there will continue to be no matter what is done. That being said, i feel the main problem today is the lighter "throw away" chassis being built by manufactures. There is a big difference in tubing of 120 gauge verses the .095 gauge now used by the top builders in the US. Just a couple years ago a chassis from outside the US was highly talked down, as unsafe, because of the poor material and light weight. But then it seems the lighter weight took over and has progressed to the problem we seem to have today. I don't have my USAC rule book and can't look up the required gauge rule they have but i would bet that many chassis are below that requirment. Don't have any idea how this could be controlled , short of cuting a cage, and that can't be done, but clearly this needs to be looked into more often. I think a manufacture has a responsibility to build and sign off that ,at least the cage, is built with 120 gauge material for safety FIRST.

First of all, the tube used in these chassis, is not measured like common fence "pipe", which is refered to as "gauge". Moly is sold in specified thickness, it is not rolled and welded in a machine, it is actually made from molten material, formed over a "bullet" to a specific wall thickness. Then it is heat treated, and the date and heat treat code are rolled on it, for reference. Most builders will make the main chassis, cage, hoop, downtubes and etc, all from the same heat treat, to keep strength and flex, all in the same "box", and, as modern technology rolls on, you can now buy an instrument, to measure that thickness, anywhere along a rail, for under a $100.00, several years ago, the only one's I knew that had an instrument of this type, was NHRA, and you could "hire" them to come ck the cars some night. Bob

[CRA91]

Chuck,
I noticed in your post before you edited it that you wondered about how many that have been injured were wearing a Hans or similar device,the thing is a Hans doesn't really protect you much against compression or whiplash type injuries.The driver of the car I work on was injured about a month ago while wearing a Hans and still suffered severe whiplash and ligament damage in his neck due to severe rear impact into the wall,the Hans is good for frontal impact but not much protection for the other types of impacts that we see in sprint car crashes. So I feel that wearing a Hans isn't really a determining factor on whether someone gets injured or not.

[Charles Nungester]

Originally Posted by CRA91 Chuck, I noticed in your post before you edited it that you wondered about how many that have been injured were wearing a Hans or similar device,the thing is a Hans doesn't really protect you much against compression or whiplash type injuries.The driver of the car I work on was injured about a month ago while wearing a Hans and still suffered severe whiplash and ligament damage in his neck due to severe rear impact into the wall,the Hans is good for frontal impact but not much protection for the other types of impacts that we see in sprint car crashes. So I feel that wearing a Hans isn't really a determining factor on whether someone gets injured or not.

Yes I did edit it as im no expert, Just wondering. Im also wondering if the Hans is reducing serious injury. Causing others or in some cases is ineffective as you state above. probably a little bit of all of the above and I still think it's a good idea to wear some type of frontal impact device over nothing at all. Those accidents happen too.

If it can be prevented or lessened, Im all for it! I will say the danger and they all know it is part of the draw for fans and the thrill for the drivers and we all know it.

[robert gatten]

Originally Posted by TQ29m First of all, the tube used in these chassis, is not measured like common fence "pipe", which is refered to as "gauge". Moly is sold in specified thickness, it is not rolled and welded in a machine, it is actually made from molten material, formed over a "bullet" to a specific wall thickness. Then it is heat treated, and the date and heat treat code are rolled on it, for reference. Most builders will make the main chassis, cage, hoop, downtubes and etc, all from the same heat treat, to keep strength and flex, all in the same "box", and, as modern technology rolls on, you can now buy an instrument, to measure that thickness, anywhere along a rail, for under a $100.00, several years ago, the only one's I knew that had an instrument of this type, was NHRA, and you could "hire" them to come ck the cars some night. Bob

didn't know there was such an instrument , where can you purchase one ? If the thickness ,or gauge, isn't less then why can i put two chassis that measure the same and look alike, except for minor differences, on a scale and the 06 model weighs much more than the 08? Never heard of "throw away chassis" until just a few years ago. I'm not down on any builders but do think this subject is needed to be discussed and chassis improved , if posible. I have one that fliped and hit nothing but the track and the rear and side halo is bent down and in about 6 inchs. granted, it did its job but thank god it didn't hit anything harder than the ground.

[Motormasher]

I thought we all learned our leason on the "light weight" roll cages when Brad Doty got hurt and that was with a wing.

The only wreck I know of where the cage was damaged was Biro's flip and it came down on the concrete wall, but I haven't heard anybody say "it failed". It would really be hard to make any kind of cage to with stand that kind of impact but you also gotta remember it has to be made where a driver can get out of it, upside down, or on its side in case its on fire.

I have seen a couple of sprint cars that had cages that looked like the old dragsters and I wondered then how fast he could get out of it.

If you can remember back in the early 90's there was a Japanese driver killed at Indy when he just hit the wall. Didn't look that bad but they said he hit so hard that his brain hit his skull and that is what killed him. His head didn't hit anything. So go figure???

We are back to this being a dangerous sport, just depends on the person driving and what kind of shape he/she is in or how their built?

[4wheelsinthekoosh]

[QUOTE=Motormasher;69531]I agree with LeadersEdge. Chassis are of top quality and construction. They are suposed to still be made of chrome moly tubing. USAC's cage requirements are that they are to be of .120 wall tubing. Whether or not any sacntioning body is checking this I don't know but that makes for a strong cage.



All cars must have a roll cage, which is integral with the frame and does not encroach upon an imaginary cylinder, 20 inches in diameter, extending through the top cockpit opening directly above the seat. The roll cage must be adequately braced fore and aft, and side to side, to secure it in an upright position in case of
rollover. The roll cage must be gusseted in all four corners with tubular gussets 11/16” OD x .095 wall thickness or 7/8”OD x .065 wall thickness. Gussets must be attached a minimum of 2 inches from the centerline of the angle being
gusseted. Roll cage gussets should be constructed as shown in Illustration #1.
The roll cage should extend four inches above the driver’s helmet when seated in the driving position. Any manufacturer wishing to produce a design that is a departure from standard sprint car construction must submit a finite analysis report for the roll cage structure proving their design is equal in strength.

B. All cars constructed after 1/30/2004 are required to have roll cages constructed of SAE 4130 tubing with a minimum OD of 1 1/2 inches and a minimum wall thickness of .095. For all construction after 10/01/2004, the main uprights supporting the roll cage must be minimum 1 3/8 O.D. and .095 minimum wall thickness.

And that is straight from the Usac rule book. Check it out at http://usacracing.com/assets/files/a...ebook/apdd.pdf

[hupp#9]

The only wreck I know of where the cage was damaged was Biro's flip and it came down on the concrete wall, but I haven't heard anybody say "it failed".

chad boseplugs cage and rob dennis their cages have also collapsed this year or were bent really bad

[STIDA.com]

Originally Posted by CRA91 Chuck, I noticed in your post before you edited it that you wondered about how many that have been injured were wearing a Hans or similar device,the thing is a Hans doesn't really protect you much against compression or whiplash type injuries.The driver of the car I work on was injured about a month ago while wearing a Hans and still suffered severe whiplash and ligament damage in his neck due to severe rear impact into the wall,the Hans is good for frontal impact but not much protection for the other types of impacts that we see in sprint car crashes. So I feel that wearing a Hans isn't really a determining factor on whether someone gets injured or not.

Very true......All the devices work wonders in head on impacts....but for rear or or side to side they do not do much...escpeciallly in side to side which occurs so often in sprint car racing with barrel rolls or side impacts.....safety has come a long way in the last 15 years......with helmets....fire suits.....Head and Neck restraints.....lets be grateful for that.....I believe it is time to check into soft walls like NASCAR.....or figure out something there....Most of the injuries this year are a result of that....

STIDA

Originally Posted by cecil98 I don't think sprint cars should be redesigned from what they are now. If they scare you, stay away from them. My suggestion is miminmum 17 years of age and a valid drivers license. Also, at the pit sign in, have a cut out of Barney Rubble or Fred Flintstone that is about 4'-10" tall and have a sign on it that says. "you must be this tall to ride this ride".

The problem with the height requirement... well... a quote from this weekend at Granite City can sum it up...

"I'm 28 years old and I'm four inches away from a booster seat..." -Matt Hummel, Brady Bacon's crew chief talking about his days as a driver...

Some people can't help that they're short... :O: