I adapt just fine to delays, and, let's face it: most on this website likely do as well. But there is an absolute standard-practice notion of fairness to starting when you say you will, moving with efficiency toward a program's completion, and limiting any and all dead air that takes place from beginning to end. We are Race Fans. We are prepared for accidents that require extra diligence to clean up; yellows for cars that spin too frequently; weather delays that arrive at inopportune times. What we should NEVER be forced to endure is too few vehicles to clean up a three car wreck; reworking of a track during a show due to unforgivable lack of advanced preparation; B-mains that eliminate NOBODY when every car is going to start a feature anyway; delays due to the only ambulance having to leave; and mandatory fuel stops because of excessive laps run while under caution.
I'll make myself busy after the event is done, but don't start at 6:30 and end at 11:30 and expect no issues to be raised by those whose presumption of basic competency on the track's part was betrayed.
And half-hour-long modified qualifiers don't help.

Bill,

I think there's so much irony in the fact that you can walk around during Midget Week or Sprint Week and talk to people from all over the United States or from as far away as New Zealand, Australia, England or Canada that feel so lucky that they even have the chance to come here to enjoy what goes on, right here in our back yard. And at the same time, see people who live right here in the middle of it all, that can find a way to hate nearly every race or every track they go to, in that same racing scene. I just thank God that I was born and raised smack dab in the middle of the Land of Milk and Honey, as far as racing goes. If the early morning dew has combined with clay dust to make mud, on my windshield and the rest of my car, then I'll deal with it. I know how. I watched my dad, uncles or whoever else I could get a ride to and from the track with, when I was a kid, deal with it, leaving places like Paragon and Haubstadt. I'd always rather get on the road at a decent hour, but when I don't, the smell of the parking lot and the fog or mist in the valleys and fields reminds me of the many great races that finished in the wee hours, that I've been lucky enough to see over the years.

Jerry

as i stated in a other post, time have changed. race tracks need to change as well. the last 3 jobs i had the start times have been 5 a.m. for the people who wanted to start early and 6 a.m. for every one else. 6:01 and you are late. years ago it was 7 a.m. and in some cases 8 a.m. how can a person who starts work at 5 a.m. stay at a race track until 11:00 p.m. drive home, for 30 minutes to an hour get up at 4 a.m. and be at work at 5 a.m. and want to do this every week for an entire summer.
it's not 1960 any more. change or get left behind. the NBA changed their start time years ago,(15 or so) the NFL change their start time years ago.(20 or more years ago from 1 p.m. to noon cst.) WAKE UP PEOPLE IT'S 2009. If people don't like your product they wont show up. HEY LOOK WHATS HAPPENING.:34;

I once slept through an entire Brickyard 400, while in the stands. Watched the first lap, took a nap and woke up for the last lap.

Well I'll be honest, I may be young to some (33 years old) or old to a few, but I can honestly say that i consider myself to be ridicously lucky to have grown up as a kid around Lincoln Park Speedway in the 80's and seeing some of the best in sprints, though, admittedly, I liked the Thunder Cars because they bashed on each other! However, I saw some tremendous racing and some of the God's honest best in the business there though I didn't appreciate what was on the track then. However, as a Greencastle native, I and my parents were uprooted when IBM closed and I moved to a little place called Mechancsburg, PA. It was merely a month, maybe less, as a 10-year old that my Dad took me to a little bit of heaven called Williams Grove Speedway. I call myself lucky because so many fans from Central Indiana haven't found an appreciation of the best of the winged madness that was mid-PA then. I saw Fast Freddie Rahmer, Paul Lotier, Doug Wolfgang, Chris and Doug Eash, the Shaeffer's and so many more on a weekly show and I miss that too. However, I hesitate to say my true feelings when I hear so many people complain so much about "long shows." It literally drives me nuts!! I mean, it's still light in this state until 9:30 or so during the summer. I understand that people don't want to have downtime during a racing show, but my god, we have the PRIVILEGE of seeing so much talent at any track in Indiana on a given night. I would give my left arm to re-live a couple of nights at Bloomington, LPS or East Coast tracks with Wangs! Time goes so fast in life, what is an extra 30 minutes for the track crew to work in the rough spots because I'd wager, dollars to donuts that most any REAL fan will take that time to share invaluable stories with NEW or OLD friends in the stands. Just my opinion. But I look forward to every chance I get to be at the track because it's a blessing to roll home with a little dirt/clay in your hair!!

I am a little more of an optimist and more patient then a lot of people, although a lot of the complaining on this board is just that, useless, selfish and unnecessary. For some perspective of what it takes for me to see non wing racing here is the rundown:
- A $80 5 year passport (US passports are $40 and good for ten years?) for me to enter the US
- $9.50 round trip toll to cross into the US
- Waiting a customs to pass into another country (sometimes 5 minutes, sometimes 1+ hour(s))
- A trip through the roughest Detroit area roads (by far the worst of any major city I have been to)
- A mid afternoon weekend drive at 3:00 with all the other vacationers, and people returning home from work
- 1 1/2 hours drive before I reach the north east corner of Indiana
- The ever present slowdowns on I-69 south that I always hit
- The option of travelling south on I-75 through the heavily radar enforced state of Ohio
- $1.70/minute phone calls to call home (Canada is notorious for bad cell phone rates), I bought a US phone to call home, but I don't have twitter, IOW or email when I am travelling (yes I can live without it)
- returning to the border, and waiting in traffic with many Michigan and Ohio under 21 year olds going drinking in Canada (our drinking age is 19), if I get out of a US track at 9:30 and make it back to the border at midnight.

There could be several positive and negative variables in there that alter this, but this is the usual. In some countries people are arrested or shot at the border, just trying to get food, money or medicine. I have been to 15 races in the US this season already, and plan several more. I could move to the US and become an American citizen, find a new hobby or just sit around and type about how bad it is, and that I am never going to another race again. I wouldn't trade any of this as I know we have it so good in North America and I should appreciate it should it all come to an end. As fans trying to bring in new fans, we can't force racing on anyone. Many people wouldn't do what we do to race, and just the same it's not too easy to get any of us out of racing.

My home track (South Buxton Raceway) is where I spend every Saturday from May to the end of August. We start at 7:00 and end at approx. 10:30-11:00. 4 classes of cars with a 1/2 hour intermission. Some days we run late, some days we run 5 classes. Most of our locals complain of a short season more so then the hours on any given night. On Fridays I try to travel to as many different tracks within a few hours of my home.

For those of you who work at 5:00 am, and can work at 6:00 it's obvious to go in at the later hour. I know switching a job, or having a job in these times is not so easy to change. Since you should be finished work at 1:30 or 2:30, take a nap. I went to college and worked full time, partied even harder, and while I was younger then it was chaotic and I did what I had to do. I am fortunate in having a 5 day 40 hour a week job. I do what I have to do now as well. If it means (with my employer's blessing) going in 1 hour earlier all week so I can leave early on a Friday to drive through rush hour traffic in another city, it's what I do. It works very well for my lifestyle.

Start times on Friday have to cater to racers who work late and fans who work Saturday morning. I have been in many of these situations and left before an A-main started, I got over it. I know I am not the average fan, I get to the track 3 hours before the races start and stay a 1/2 hour after the races are over. I have an addiction, it could be a problem that alters my view of the real world. I go to races alone, so nobody needs to stop on the road, and nobody needs to leave earlier then I determine. I have met many great people during track prep/intermission, and until you build your own track or start your own series there isn't much you can do. Bill is right sleep is for dead people, think about shoveling snow this weekend instead of going to the track. Kids grow up and still remember the race track, I went from birth until 12 years old, stopped for 15 years and have went for the last 4 years as much as possible. I bring my daughter when I can, and will plan more races that I can bring her. Everyone's situation is different, and we all have to make the most of it.

When I have non race fan relatives or friends visit the racetrack, they always seem to leave at about 9:30, which is always the street stock feature and the first race after intermission. They don't like racing, I don't know many of those people. I am Canadian, and I have probably watched a 4 cylinder heat race that lasted longer than the total amount of time I have spent watching hockey in my entire life. I love cars and racing, do not care for other forms of sport. They don't try to recruit me to watch football or UFC, as my time not at a track is devoted to my family, my website or reading IOW.

I recently went to some races with some of my co-workers. Both nights the races ended at midnight or after midnight. Both nights we had a 1.25-2 hour drive home. Two of the people on these trips are "casual" fans. Due to the late night, they have become selective about what they attend. ONe has stated he is done with road trip races for a while. The other is only limiting himself of Weekends. As a result, a planned trip to the Brad Doty race in Lima was cancelled. The track did not get our $100 for admission. We did not buy food at the Kewpie burger. We did not buy $40 in gas. We did not buy a 12 pack of beer. I chose not to go by myself because I did not want to drive home in the wee hours and the get up for work at 5 AM the next day.

This is what is wrong with races that run late. They discourage casual fans and newbies from attending. I firmly believe that tracks need to work towards improving the pacing of shows. Without improviing the pace of the shows, new and casual fans will not attend. No new fans means trouble for us all.

I barely made the 30 mile drive home Friday night from the 'burg without falling asleep at the wheel. I take life saving meds at night that make me drowsy. I have to get up for work at 4 A.M. If I leave a track like THAT for instance at midnight and drive 3 hours to get home, well, it just ain't gonna happen for this old fart.

There is no excuse for a race that uses up two days of a fan's life for a one day show. There are extenuating circumstances at times, but midnight or 1 A.M. for a normal show is ridiculous.

The day shows work best for me, but most of them are history.

i agree with starting on time if the weather permits. i do think tracks should always run the main traveling division first. in michigan when we are lucky enough to get usac or any kind of sprint show most tracks run them as the last feature. talk about late nights, go to butler. i really don't mind the down time if it is to work the track for the better. that show at gas city for ISW was pretty close to perfect for me. great racing top to bottom, only one support group and time to catch up with people while anticipating the feature! unless you have to work the next morning i suggest camping, with the kids if necessary. we have a 5 year old girl that loves the usac cars. anything over a 1 hour drive we usually camp. probably about 20 times a season we just stay at the track.
Randy Stull

Bill thats easy. When you work 12 hours the next morning getting home by 11 and cleaned and asleep by midnight

A lot of people do Church 730 am adult masses.

I understand your view. I was off yesterday so I stayed and went to the Frolic after T.H.A.T. Thats awesome sharing a drink and convo with the particapants of the event, NHRA drag racers and racers past, present and future and some super fans as well.

I don't want to leave a track or the people either. Sometimes WE HAVE TOO

---------- Post added at 09:29 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:25 AM ----------

Huh? Hockey takes three 15 minute breaks that are often extended for cellebrities. Football takes a half hour half time and quite honestly several times there are several minutes between plays. Its made for TV. Baseball takes the 7th inning stretch which is no where near the other sports. five or ten minutes.

Racings a bit different. Number of accidents, track conditions. We got started late at both LBurg and That by at least a half hour but the show moved quick once it got going and a few lulls allowed for great conversation.

Chuck