[jdull99]

Where would many of those "$75,000" cars be legal? (Not just talking about the ones that would have to add weight)

[darnall]

A big majority of the "TEAMS" that run the chilibowl do race midgets the rest of the year. The difference is that these teams run one car at each race...maybe a second car at some of the bigger shows... then they put together everything they own from last year and all the new stuff they bought for this year and end up with 4-6 cars at the chilibowl. When was the last time you saw the Wilke team unload 3-4 cars for a badger show at Sun Prairie? When the Loyet team decides to go run a midget race there is only one orange #05 on the track, but at Tulsa there are 4 or 5 each year. The Camfields usually have 2-3 cars at a typical POWRI show, but had 5 or so midgets together and ready for Tulsa. Andrew Felker typically takes one midget to all the POWRI and USAC shows he runs, but come January they roll 2-3 cars out of that trailer.Even the low budget teams who typically run one family owned car through the year end up piecing together a second car for the Chilibowl.

Many of the pro sprintcar drivers that show up at Tulsa own a midget, but they make more money running the sprintcar through the year so the midget stays parked. Daryn Pittman has owned that car he brings for 3 years or so. Not sure if he owns the motor or if he rents one for the indoor races. The Swindells are using the same cars as they were using the last bunch of years, and there is nothing at all special about the Esslingers they have in them. Brady Bacon has owned a midget for many years but it stays parked most of the time because he's running somebody elses stuff. Dustin Morgan has had a midget or 2 for at least 5 years but rarely runs them because he's hauling his sprintcars all across the country. Etc Etc...

Why do all these full time midget teams only run one car all year and then bring 2-6 cars to Tulsa? Because there aren't too many people willing to spend $4,000- $9500 bucks to rent a midget for the POWRI shows at Macon. The Gold Crown Midget Nationals pays way way better than the Chilibowl, there is a small fraction of competitors at the Gold Crown compared to Tulsa so in theory it should be easier to get a decent paycheck, but you don't see people lined up around the block wanting to spend 8 grand to rent a ride for that race either.

People would be amazed if they truly knew how many cars at Tulsa were rent-a-rides. They would be amazed if they knew how many high profile drivers had to rent rides for the chilibowl... Guys that have won multiple Knoxville 410 track championships, World of Outlaw race winners, very few actually get to show up and drive good cars without paying for the opportunity. In the past Joe Loyett would actually pick 4 guys he thought had a legitimate chance at winning and give them a ride for the Chilibowl...he wants a driller that bad...but this year he even had a rental advertised before hand. Other than that, very very few owners are just hiring drivers for that race. If you have enough equipment that you can put together 3 extra cars theres no reason to leave that stuff at home. Three rentals can go a long long way towards funding your season, and with the damage clauses they all have in the agreements, there is really minimal risk in letting people rent your extra stuff.

As for "ALL THESE GUYS BUILDING $75,000 CARS FOR JUST ONE RACE"... there really isn't much of that happening. 90% of those cars are legal to go race anywhere else with possibly some body panels changed or some weight added. There are plenty of cars down there that have frames considered as "Indoor only", some lighter, thinner tubing here and there. Some of the chassis like Yeleys new car or the Bondio cars or Murdocks fueler car may not be legal anywhere else, or may be considered too light/dangerous to race outdoors, but other than the frame the rest of the car is the same stuff everybody runs everywhere else. Everybody whos serious about their midget team already uses all the titanium bolts, the rearends with all the titanium, 3 spoke front hubs, carbon fiber body panels, carbon hoses, etc etc. If they have a Chilibowl only car it consists of a standard chassis built lighter than standard, some body panels that may or may not be legal anywhere else, a 12inch wide right rear wheel, and components that they will use on any other car they run the rest of the year. There are no "Chilibowl only" rear ends, steering gears, birdcages, engines, etc. The frames are a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of all the components it takes to build a car.

As for regular midgets not having a chance against all the purpose built cars... I disagree... T-Mez put a car in the show that was pretty standard/nothing special. Alex Bright had a helluva run in an ARDC legal car. Harli White was in the Hard 8 teams normal standard car and had she not broke a RF steering arm I think there was a really good chance so see her in the main. And I would bet anybody anything that if Sammy or Kevin were to destroy their car during Monday practice they could get in any Spike/Esslinger down there, put their shocks and bars in them, and be just as much of a contender as they are in the cars that everybody thinks are so superior.

[jjones752]

Do a quick scan of the entry list, then sort it by region (Indiana-Ohio, Missouri-Illinois, etc.), then take out the "hired guns" and/or rent-a-rides; what you come up with is pretty close to what the car counts are in that particular region, give or take. Given the travel expense alone, it would be pretty hard to gather up that much equipment more than once a year. Oh sure, they used to get 100-plus cars for Turkey Night or the Hut Hundred and it would be nice if those numbers came back, but personally I'm thrilled that we're able to see the racing that we are blessed with.

[DAD]

Originally Posted by johnnythunderhead I find it rather strange that everyone uses the excuse that the reason we don't see more midget racing during the actual racing season is, because it is too expensive to run them/ yet 300 plus owners put out up to $75,000.00 to run a car once per year for next to nothing in return if they don't make the big dance and for a mere 10g's if they win the big feach (in my book a 10g return on a 75g investment does not make much sense). seems to me if they brought them out and tried to build up a following that they'd stand a chance of earning their investment back, something they'll never do running them once per year and then put'n them in mothballs! and I must add, there is plenty of incredible driver talent available in Indiana alone!

John

I don't think anybody racing Midgets either full time or part time are delusional enough to actually think that they are going to make any money off of the purse they could win for the whole year, in fact I don't know of too many open wheel racer's that think that there is any profit at all in any form of this type of racing. True the owners are almost always very successful business people in their own chosen fields.

The money for and or enjoyment of racing is in the advertising on the car. Many of these owners are living a childhood dream and if they have enough expendable funds to invest in race cars and perhaps the sponsorship on these cars that is what they are going to do. Running a racing operation as a business is a sure way to loose money. The government only gives you a few years to show a profit.

However if you already have the money and wish to advertise on a race car you can do that the rest of your life and it is a legitimate business expense for tax purposes. The fans out there should be glad to have people like this around and should when all other things are equal spend their money with these company's. The ROI on race car advertising is not too great.

As far a purpose built race cars the place to find them is the "Rumble". A race car is only as good as it's driver, and crew, and that is what makes winners different from whiners.

The price of a Chili Bowl rental may be $7000.00 or more the chance to bang wheels with racers like Sammy or DD is priceless. You can talk about that the rest of your life.

Honest Dad himself

[Tony Barhorst]

Originally Posted by DAD John As far a purpose built race cars the place to find them is the "Rumble". A race car is only as good as it's driver, and crew, and that is what makes winners different from whiners. The price of a Chili Bowl rental may be $7000.00 or more the chance to bang wheels with racers like Sammy or DD is priceless. You can talk about that the rest of your life. Honest Dad himself

The car that Russ Gamester won the Friday night feature, and nearly won on Saturday at the Rumble was "purpose built" by Grant King in 1977. Here it is.. He won in the same car at the older Coliseum in 1989...winning the USAC indoor championship with it.

http://chrisseelman.smugmug.com/Midg...ne/i-kJdQJKg/A

All in good fun Dad..

[DAD]

Originally Posted by Tony Barhorst The car that Russ Gamester won the Friday night feature, and nearly won on Saturday at the Rumble was "purpose built" by Grant King in 1977. Here it is.. He won in the same car at the older Coliseum in 1989...winning the USAC indoor championship with it. http://chrisseelman.smugmug.com/Midg...ne/i-kJdQJKg/A All in good fun Dad..

Tony

I agree. A real racer will race anything he can get into or onto. It takes a spl.car to run up there, although the Munchkin was not a special designed for indoor it sure does work there. The Rumble is another race where newbie's and the season veteran can come together an do exactly what they are supposed to do, HAVE FUN Racing. Also the rental's arent usually as high up for the Rumble either, but driving is probably a little more like work up there.

Honest Dad himself

[Tony Barhorst]

This thread link here goes back to the Munchkin and Tony Stewart....https://www.indianaopenwheel.com/sho...t=tony+stewart

In the history of the event, Tony Stewart, Mike Fedorcak, and Lou Cicconi have won in a Munchkin. Those are pretty good drivers. I have seen Stewart go to the front in a Grant King VW also in 1999. I would like to see that again, too bad it is not on youtube.

John Heydenreich owns that car now.

Jim Anderson won with this car a few years ago. Ellis/Mopar
http://chrisseelman.smugmug.com/Midg...ne/i-P8Scnn3/A

Justin Peck won the second night this year- Beast/Volkswagen
http://chrisseelman.smugmug.com/Midg...ne/i-C9dR94s/A

Derek Bischak won last year- Spike/Gaerte Ford
http://chrisseelman.smugmug.com/Midg...ne/i-xNQ92xk/A

[treecitytornado]

Johnny Won with it at the only indoor show ever held in the FargoDome in 1999! I ran that 100 lapper too, but Johnny was the class of the field that night!