Kirk love that idea. docked for each spot you lose is a great idea that would get rid of most ties. It wouldnt even have to be the same number of points lost. Example if 1 1/2 points to pass cars. You lose 1 point for each position you go backwards.

I could make millions with the Excel spreadsheet it would require to calculate that...lol...

The USAC qualifying system (total invert for heats) definitely makes for the best overall qualifying show. People got sick of qualifying because most every other organization had straight-up heat races that sucked the life out of things after their night had already been killed by time trials (which, unless they involve a non-winged vehicle, suck). The tin-top people (or maybe Emmett Hahn with his winged stuff, I don't remember who was first) invented the passing points deal and the promoters discussed it at their little workshops. It seemed to work, so the copycats brought it home...lol...

Most Midget / Sprint Passing Points systems are based off of Emmett's (55-52-49 - three point spread). I've found that the four-point spread decreases the disadvantage against guys who start in the front and finish in the front. It also greatly reduces ties because the 1.5 passing points factor is a multiple of the three point spread (which guarantees ties). It is not a multiple of the four-point spread (which, as stated, reduces but not eliminates ties).

I haven't figured out why the group-qualifying thing failed? Any drivers have any insight to that? It was the new greatest idea when the transponders came out. Now it seems to be disappearing mainly due to driver complaints about the system.

JC

Kirk,

Here's the same Kamp race with a side-by-side comparison of 3 different passing point systems.

The first columns (black) is the actual USAC system that was used. It is a difference of 3 points between finishing positions with an added 1.5 points for each position gained. No points have been subtracted for drivers that finished worse than they started. This also shows which heat they were in, where they finished and where they started.

The second set of columns (red) is a passing point system based on your suggestion of 9 points between finishing positions with an added 4 points for each position gained. No points have been subtracted for drivers that finished worse than they started.

The third set of columns (brown) is a passing point system based on your suggestion of 9 points between finishing positions with an added 4 points for each position gained. 2 points have been subtracted for each position that a driver lost from where they originally started.



This is the only race from last year that I have the starting lineups on. To get a good feel of how a different system would work I still think you need to do a comparison of the last 2 years. That would give you 10 or more races to look at before you come to a conclusion.

Sandy