[1121]

Long time reader, first time poster......except for an ad about selling a motor. I've always hesitated to reply to a post here because honestly, some of you guys scare me more then Winchester or Salem ever did! But this issue is dear to my heart. I am a long time HOSS driver/car owner. And I am a very low buck guy. But with all due respect to Duke, the answer is not having guys drive the same car on dirt and pavement. The problem is not a shortage of cars. There are 20-25 cars running with HOSS and another 20-25 running with AVSS. The cars are there. And I personally would love to run some USAC races to get more non-winged pavement expierence. But the shear cost of running USAC is out of control. Not the price of the cars, but the race to race expense. HOSS and AVSS both run very similar tire rules. But USAC (and yes, I know they came first) uses different compound of tires on all four corners. And add to that, the big dogs bolt on new tires every time they hit the track. To me, the MSA (supermodified group out of Ohio) has the best tire rule. They specify a compound and you can only buy two tires a night. They don't care what two you buy, but you can only buy two. In fact this is a rule I wish HOSS and AVSS would adopt also.

Also, and I don't want to start a safety debate here, but with USAC, you have to run a HANS device. I'm not debating their effectiveness, but I doubt if there is five guys total between HOSS and AVSS that have one. Again, MSA mandates them, but they give you a three or five race (I'm not sure which) grace period to buy one. That allows you to decide if you want to run with them all the time before investing in a HANS.

I would jump at a chance to run more non-winged, I'm just not going to mortgage my house to do it. Maybe someone would like to have some non-sanctioned non-winged races..........are you listening Tony Barhorst?

Tom Paterson
Sprint car #11

[KKinser99]

Run a compund thats very hard and durable. Stamp all four tires after cars qualify. Have to run that set the rest of the event. If a tire has to be changed due to damage that car will have to start tail. When namars included 600's to their roster in 2003 this is how it was done. I thought it was a great idea. This could be done for dirt races as well.

Kerry Kinser

[SUPERDUKE]

Originally Posted by 1121 long time reader, first time poster......except for an ad about selling a motor. I've always hesitated to reply to a post here because honestly, some of you guys scare me more then winchester or salem ever did! But this issue is dear to my heart. I am a long time hoss driver/car owner. And i am a very low buck guy. But with all due respect to duke, the answer is not having guys drive the same car on dirt and pavement. The problem is not a shortage of cars. There are 20-25 cars running with hoss and another 20-25 running with avss. The cars are there. And i personally would love to run some usac races to get more non-winged pavement expierence. But the shear cost of running usac is out of control. Not the price of the cars, but the race to race expense. Hoss and avss both run very similar tire rules. But usac (and yes, i know they came first) uses different compound of tires on all four corners. And add to that, the big dogs bolt on new tires every time they hit the track. To me, the msa (supermodified group out of ohio) has the best tire rule. They specify a compound and you can only buy two tires a night. They don't care what two you buy, but you can only buy two. In fact this is a rule i wish hoss and avss would adopt also. Also, and i don't want to start a safety debate here, but with usac, you have to run a hans device. I'm not debating their effectiveness, but i doubt if there is five guys total between hoss and avss that have one. Again, msa mandates them, but they give you a three or five race (i'm not sure which) grace period to buy one. That allows you to decide if you want to run with them all the time before investing in a hans. I would jump at a chance to run more non-winged, i'm just not going to mortgage my house to do it. Maybe someone would like to have some non-sanctioned non-winged races..........are you listening tony barhorst? Tom paterson sprint car #11

most of those cars will not race without a wing! Bout 95% and i raced for 25 years non wing same car on dirt and pavement and we had plenty of cars and races!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you run dirt with your winged car?

[metal bender]

[QUOTE=Pat O'Connor Fan;112841]Huh ?? Not in USAC ![COLOR="Black"]

[SIZE=1]------Iam, not talking USAC or USUCK this was in AAA , kid . I seen indy drivers run the midgets and sprints, dirt and paved tracks , the best dam racing ever, offys chevys fords studabackers, ext !!! Now they whant to make a champ car look like a pregnant rear engine car , because they cant run the big tracks what are these guys nuts , I, seen Foyt run his dirt car at Milwaukee and blow the crap off the piss ant rear engine cars!!! I, will say it over USAC needs to go. Go back to run what ya brung , as long as its safe any engine any tire the only rules should be for safty Oh ya, get ride of these assembly line cars, let new stuff have a chance to come about .

[SUPERDUKE]

Originally Posted by kkinser99 run a compund thats very hard and durable. Stamp all four tires after cars qualify. Have to run that set the rest of the event. If a tire has to be changed due to damage that car will have to start tail. When namars included 600's to their roster in 2003 this is how it was done. I thought it was a great idea. This could be done for dirt races as well. Kerry kinser

a tire rule that makes it cost less to race is good!

[PJ Wright]

Originally Posted by sc96 One thing to look at is Kevin Miller has always said he is selling a product well if the product is not selling dump it. This is very hard to swallow for the people who live and breath sprint car racing but on the other hand 12 cars showing up for a race is very sad for sprint cars. I can see the reason Kevin is dropping the pavement sprint cars its because the paying public is not buying the show and when 12-15 cars show up why would you go pay to watch. The Silver Crown cars are in the same boat and unless USAC comes up with a long term plan you are going to see a steady decline in our sport. All the top divisions are loosing car owners faster than new ones are comming on.

So as each division declines, the "business plan" is to drop it??? Gee things aren't going real well at work right now so I think I'll quit. My marriage is struggling a bit so we'll get a divorce. Our Country has some real problems so let's move to Mozambique. Some business plan. Some business man. But hey, they've got a really cool hip website.

[SUPERDUKE]

Originally Posted by pj wright so as each division declines, the "business plan" is to drop it??? Gee things aren't going real well at work right now so i think i'll quit. My marriage is struggling a bit so we'll get a divorce. Our country has some real problems so let's move to mozambique. Some business plan. Some business man. But hey, they've got a really cool hip website.

as i said they are lost!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No real leadership!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[D.O.]

We all know that it's changed.

Remember when you got a Ronnie Ward or a King car with your buddies. Somebody knew how to build a chevy and you and your friends had some mechanic's to bolt, paint or bring the beer.

One car, open wheel trailer, van, pickup, station wagon and a tool box, cooler and ciggs.
Remember those days? You earned your way into the feature, no LCQ's or Prov's. End of the day you set on the trailer and car drinking beer with everybody talking about the days race. Maybe even herk and Prince would be looking for a beer from Watson. Remember those days?

You were proud to be a USAC Racer. You built your **** and raced it.

Think about Terre Haute in the day time without lights, New Bremen under the tree and Frank Dickie, great days. Watch any Dick Wallen and look at the crowds everywhere.

Today you order a car from a builder go to Bernie & Mark's WalMart of race parts and bolt it all together.
Callup a HorsePower shop and get a motor. Daddy pays somebody to work on his young kids car out of the semi rig. Yes there are a few who stilldo the down home with the family deal like the Fox Boys.


SO how does todays racing and tracks get turned around ????

Lots of ideas can only help.

But USAC, Hoss/avss, open, how do you organise it?


We can't complain about the racing we have. Most track have great local racing, all near Indy. Hey that's great.

[1121]

Duke,
I don't mean to argue, but if you look at the qualifying field for the little 500, probably over half were winged guys going topless. Don't say we won't do it. I own two cars and I would take them both to the right venue running non-winged. By the way though, to reinforce the idea of running a car on both dirt and pavement, my second car is a 1999 Stealth dirt car that Sam Davis drives for me (my car, his motor) and he does very well. But my point is, why obsolete a bunch of good cars to try to get dirt drivers to run pavement when there are pavement drivers willing to run.

Tom Paterson

[spankytoo]

The problem that I see with USUC is that you and I do not have a voice. We can not complain about anything without being labeled a trouble maker. The "Good Ol Boys" club that runs it knows that if you don't like it you can leave. WELL WE HAVE LEFT!!! Now the number of people that have left has finally added up to a point that USAC has noticed. All of the official positons at USAC are appointed by the "Insiders". The club needs to have the top three positons in each series or region voted on by members of the same series or regions. That way if they want to keep their job they will listen.