[openwheelfan1]

Okay…this isn’t REALLY open wheel related, but a track two hrs. from me is running 12 classes tonight. Clarksville Speedway in Clarksville TN. Is running:
Super LM
604 Crate LM
602 Crate
QS Street Stock
Pure Mini
Mini Mod
Taxi Cab Street
Factory Street Stock
Cruiser Street
Mod Lites
Tri-State B Mod
UMP Open wheels

They have 187 cars signed in, so an average of 15.5 cars/class.

I’m not sure, but I think we’ve found the definition of insanity.

[Charles Nungester]

Seriously, Be glad you have a track. My sense is there will be many fewer in he near future The avg of 15 cars a class tells you that one, there are less cars and two. many classes are just diluting the top class.

[RMR3]

The smartest thing any track can do is choose their two largest classes and invest in those classes. Back gate promoting is not sustainable. The only way you make money is with front gate sales. Back gate promoting runs off front gate sales. Unfortunately, too many promoters haven't figured it out.

[miledirt]

I know promoters have their business reality to deal with, but man I don't get it all. Three classes is plenty for me.
Streets
Mods
Lates or Sprints

If a track is promoting more than three classes, unless they put it in print they are running the featured class feature first, I won't attend. Been held hostage too many times, lol

[Grocery Guy]

I saw that same Clarksville car count. Clarksville was supposed to close, but clearly they're making it a go packing the back gate.

Speaking of back gate, here's the divisions for the April 11th Circle City opening night. Last year CC posted on FB they needed to run this many divisions to make their nights profitable. I respect their business model, but don't understand it. Having 6 classes on a Friday night, starting at 8pm, running a track in a neighborhood, that leaves me and many others out. I pay to watch the features and when they don't get run till past 11pm, why go? Plenty of options in the Indy area to spend fun money and BE HOME by 11pm.

Midwest Thunder 410
UMP Modifieds
CCR Grub Getters
Victory Lane Car and Truck Crown Vic's
UMP Pure Stocks
UMP Hornets

[captrat]

Back gate promoting leading to an average Joe's form of club racing without the expense of joining a country club like facility.

[openwheelfan1]

[QUOTE=Grocery Guy;579485]I saw that same Clarksville car count. Clarksville was supposed to close, but clearly they're making it a go packing the back gate.

If I read correctly, the property that the Clarksville oval track sits on has been purchased by either the city or county and the oval track will be closed at either the end of this year or next. The adjacent drag strip MAY remain open for a longer period of time.

[hoosier race fan]

I’ve never been a supporter of back gate promotion, but I respect that promoters and track owners will do what they think is going to help them be profitable. If a track insists on running more than 3 or 4 classes, it is critical that they run an efficient program. I think there are ways to make the race format suitable to both fans and race teams while also being respectful to those who are concerned about the length of the event.

One suggestion I would make is to run heat races for the premier class or top 2 classes only. The rest of the classes that are often considered support classes should qualify and run features only, especially if those classes do not have full fields. Instead of running heat races that extend the show and wear out the patience of casual fans and those who only want to see the headliner, have them group qualify and run a slightly longer feature after the headliner class or classes. This still gives them the laps they need without the extra time for separate heat races. On most race nights, support classes might get 3 laps of hotlaps, 6-8 lap heats, and a 12-15 lap feature.

Using the Circle City race Grocery Guy mentioned as an example, a slight adjustment to the race lineup like this could save some time.

Midwest Thunder 410 - Hotlaps, 4 lap Group Qualifying
UMP Modifieds - 4 lap Group Qualifying
Grub Getters - 4 lap Group Qualifying
Crown Vic's - 4 lap Group Qualifying
Midwest Thunder 410 - 8 lap Heat Races
UMP Pure Stocks - 4 lap Group Qualifying
UMP Modifieds - 8 lap Heat Races
UMP Hornets - 4 lap Group Qualifying
Last Chance races for any classes that are necessary.
Midwest Thunder 410 - 25-30 lap Feature
UMP Modifieds - 20 lap Feature
Grub Getters - 18 lap Feature
Crown Vic's - 18 lap Feature
UMP Pure Stocks - 20 lap Feature
UMP Hornets - 20 lap Feature

[Frank Reiner]

Originally Posted by openwheelfan1 Okay…this isn’t REALLY open wheel related, but a track two hrs. from me is running 12 classes tonight. Clarksville Speedway in Clarksville TN. Is running: Super LM 604 Crate LM 602 Crate QS Street Stock Pure Mini Mini Mod Taxi Cab Street Factory Street Stock Cruiser Street Mod Lites Tri-State B Mod UMP Open wheels They have 187 cars signed in, so an average of 15.5 cars/class. I’m not sure, but I think we’ve found the definition of insanity.

Let us take a generous view of the possible proceedings for this "package".
The first three classes on the list could constitute the actual "show" for which a front gate customer would be willing to pay. The schedule for those classes might begin in the 5PM-6PM time frame with hot laps/qualifying activity, and proceed as usual.

The remainder of the classes, the "charity" classes, can, and should begin as early as 1PM. Those classes are not part of any show which would draw a paying audience; they are being provided with track time at a very low price; track time which could not be purchased at that price otherwise, and hence are charity classes. The promoter/track owner has a financial interest in supporting classes which provide training and development, and which may, in time, become the basis of competitors who move up and become part of the actual show.

[Chief Wahoo]

Originally Posted by Grocery Guy I saw that same Clarksville car count. Clarksville was supposed to close, but clearly they're making it a go packing the back gate. Speaking of back gate, here's the divisions for the April 11th Circle City opening night. Last year CC posted on FB they needed to run this many divisions to make their nights profitable. I respect their business model, but don't understand it. Having 6 classes on a Friday night, starting at 8pm, running a track in a neighborhood, that leaves me and many others out. I pay to watch the features and when they don't get run till past 11pm, why go? Plenty of options in the Indy area to spend fun money and BE HOME by 11pm. Midwest Thunder 410 UMP Modifieds CCR Grub Getters Victory Lane Car and Truck Crown Vic's UMP Pure Stocks UMP Hornets

With the exception of a Midwest Thunder 410 race in August all the others have 5-6 other classes, NOT counting the 410’s. I wish them well for these races, but I’m not going to be driving 5 hours round trip to sit thru this concoction of classes.