How much body work?
 

How much body work can be hung on a sprint car before it becomes visually an Eastern Dirt Modified? For many years I have been touting our sport and bringing what I hope will be new enthusiasts. Before I used to hear "great racing but wow the bathrooms and the dust". Now I get 'I thought you said I could see the driver doing their thing, but I could barely see them".

IMHO we need to think about this issue if we want non-wing racing to differentiate its product from its competitors for the potential newbie that might become a diehard.

Re: How much body work?
 

IMO, I just don't think you become a diehard based mainly on whether you can see a drivers arms or not. As a fan, I've never really thought about that a whole lot. A lot of those changes have come along to keep flying objects from getting into the cockpit and to keep the drivers arms from extending out of the cockpit in the event of a crash. My uncle spent the last 40 years of his life with a steel plate holding the bones in his forearm together after getting them smashed by a roll cage in an old time sprinter. In fact, one of his sons and 2 of his daughters were at the Haubstadt Hustler to commemorate the 50th anniversary of that crash there. And I think Bob Christian lost an arm because of a piece of wooden guard rail that came into the cockpit. If you didn't tell them that they could see the driver working the wheel, then maybe they wouldn't go to the track expecting to see that and wouldn't leave disappointed when they didn't and would notice all the other things that make this the best form of racing. And there are so many.

Jerry

Re: How much body work?
 

I'm all for the least amount of body work possible.
I love seeing the driver and the basic outline of a sprintcar.
Also have any of you guys ever worked on a dirt modified ? We would probly have and race a n.e. mod if it weren't for the insane body. Its just a huge pain in the butt compared to a sprintcar and almost makes in mandatory to have a crew.
Theres kinda a comparision that can be made between the awesome mid sixty mods compared to the new cars and Sprintcars compared to winged cars. The old bigblocks I worked on had the most simplistic bodies and the hugest engines, weighting in as light as 1500lbs. They dominated the heavy factory cars till they were ruled out of existence.
If you feel you need body parts to keep you safe your in the wrong sport anyhow. Never saw a piece of tin that would stop a wood post. Stop trying to over protect everyone. Reminds me of my government, all the things I cant do because of people that don't know me are trying to hold my hand and lead me to safety, lol.

Re: How much body work?
 

Man, I've really had some hostile responses about this issue. I've been going to midget, and sprint races since 1960 ( I was 6 weeks old at my first race!). I've driven, owned, been on board of directors for a midget club, etc. etc. But I've not set foot in a speedway in nearly 6 years, it's my personal choice, but visually midgets, sprints, differ very little from dirt modified, (or even late models when there is a wing on top) They all look like wedge shaped door stops with tires stuck to the sides. The cars could very well be remote control, there is little visual evidence that a human is behind all that body work actually driving the car. Then I get this..."well, it's the action on the track that matters, you can't go back in time man, it's the racing"...yeah, well....if it's only the racing on the track that is paramount, then all dirt (or oval) racing should be one type of car, a hobby stock, dirt modified, or even a go-kart. If it does not matter what the car looks like, then who cares what type of vehicle is on the track? Again, it's my own personal preference, but when you show a photo, or a video clip to a newcomer who is somewhat interested, do to the stories you have told them, and they ask.."are those big R/C cars", or "do people drive those". It's hard to get people excited or interested in the "on track action".

Re: How much body work?
 

I just got to thinking....at least with go-karts you can see the driver!

Re: How much body work?
 

I'll live in the past, saves money, time, aggravation.

Re: How much body work?
 

I do think some of the chili bowl bodies are excessive, but the normal bodies are not. And you will understand why when you are going about 90 and take a decent sized rock off of the rr tire of the car in front of you.

Re: How much body work?
 

You need to checkout Korey Weyents Body work he is running at the Jesse Hockett Memorial with the WAR series . It is Old school and looks great. He has pics on his FB page. It is nice looking made me think back to the 70's, ya I guess I am old.

Re: How much body work?
 

As one who builds all these problem for all of the above mentioned classes (even karts,) I will have to be on the other side of this one.. I love some of the new stuff that all of the guys are doing.. I was the one that brought Rick Ferkel's #0 to Syracuse in the early 80's with the wheel covers,sideskirts and a few other Kenny Weld type items.. So I truly love the aero look.. But some of the old stuff still looks great and I don't have a problem living with it.

Re: How much body work?
 

I ran midgets from 1982 till 1996, never had a drivers side guard, used foam, or cardboard under my uniform around my bicep. The only time it really got my attention was at Belleville behind the V-6 of Higman, with Ken Schrader driving, that thing really kicked up some shotgun dirt clods. Made multiple bruises on my arm, even through the cardboard. One car I drove had an old style Edmunds type hood, but the cowl was not cut down, and the rounded corners of the top of the cowl kept most dirt out of the cockpit. I know we were going faster than 90 mph at Belleville.

Re: How much body work?
 

One more point, and I'm done. Having been born and raised in Colorado, good sprint car racing was rare till the later 1970's, even then there were no really great dirt tracks there. My first trip to Ascot in 1976 made me realize what truly great sprint car racing was out there. I've always been a bigger sprint fan than midgets, even though I raced midgets, I will always regret not getting into sprint cars instead. The sprint drivers today are just as brave, and talented as anytime in history, for me however, the cars are just not fun to look at, it's more depressing than exciting to see how the cars look. So, I don't go, holds no appeal to me, personally, my choice. Bob East at Ascot in 1975.....This is what I saw at Ascot, way back.

Re: How much body work?
 

Big Cars are still the way to go watch history.. Love them,,I haven't messed many of those up yet..One of those and Hewitt and life is great.

Re: How much body work?
 

its the snow flake generation. that's why there is body work all over todays ugly sprint cars.

Re: How much body work?
 

Isn't it ironic then that in the early 2000s Kent Christian's car had less sheet metal on the left side than just about anybody elses. Personally I like to be able to see a driver get his elbows up.

Last month we mourned the loss of our most popular driver and brainstormed ways to make our cars safer. This month we complain that we can't see the drivers and that they need to be exposed to the elements of the track more? Does that make any damn sense?

Re: How much body work?
 

If you ever listen to 84.8 I think it is, Louisville AM, the announcer there, Leland Conway, calls them "buttercups", either is fitting. Bob

Re: How much body work?
 

How bout no more racing all together, or put bubble wrap all around them. The spirit of the sport is lost when it no longer resembles any part of the origins of the sport. Again my opinion. If it makes you feel better, every division of oval track racing should be full bodied, with covered wheels, big surrounding bumpers like rental go-karts, maybe put lane dividers on the track so the cars won't touch each other, like gutter guards for little kids at the bowling alley. At what point does it become a joke, and not a real sport, it's dangerous always has been. Accept it, or move on to something less stressful. And that's why I'm more than happy not to waste my time or money on this crap.

Re: How much body work?
 

Well I must say how appreciative I am that you took your incredibly, remarkably precious time to come to this site, read this thread, quote my post, and create a very sensible, well-articulated reply. I can't imagine how passionate you must be about crap that you do spend your time on.

You are correct that this sport in particular will always have an inherent danger. My comments weren't about baby-proofing sprint car racing. My comments were directed at the thought of reversing 25 years of safety innovation because it's more aesthetically pleasing. I don't get it. Good day.

Re: How much body work?
 

Easy Jim, we all want to make it safer, but sometimes just wanting to do "something" can cause more harm than good. There was also a latemodel driver who died in a crash and fire this year because all that sheetmetal trapped him. With all due respect, surely you don't think more tin would have prevented the tragedy you referred to.

Re: How much body work?
 

sprint cars use to be like a beautiful woman you couldn't keep your eyes off of, now they look like a woman who fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down.

Re: How much body work?
 

Correct PJ more .040" aluminum wouldn't help in a serious accident and I haven't said that. Perhaps I've overstepped my bounds in terms of bodies. My point is that the aesthetics of a gorgeous Edmunds midget, hood only with the driver hanging out of it, isn't coming back, because of enhanced safety measures. That's all.

Re: How much body work?
 

Agreed Jim. The only time I've left a race and wished I'd have stayed home was when a driver was seriously injured or worse. If somehow someone did have a race for cageless sprintcars I wouldn't go. I was upset a few years ago when Kevin Olsen decided to race his midget wearing a t-shirt. Not always, but I think there may be times when a racer may say he wants to add more bodywork for safety when what he really wants is an aero advantage.

Or maybe it's a wild shot at killing/maiming a few less drivers than in generations past.

Re: How much body work?
 

I really hate for you to keep telling all of us how you never had a drivers side guard , used foam or cardboard. When your very next sentence you talk about how you received multiple bruises on your arm EVEN THOUGH THE CARDBOARD so tough guy which was it? For a guy who doesn"t go to races anymore cuz its a waste of your time and money seems you sure know a lot about the sports now :7:

You have to change with the times, and the fact is, today's cars are going faster due to increase in horsepower and suspension technology. People are trying to make racing safer.

Sorry to tell you, but if u want racing to prosper with future generations you are going to have to except more closed off and streamlined bodies, the younger crowd likes the cool new designs and even the aero advantages that come with them.

Re: How much body work?
 

agreed

Re: How much body work?
 

Oh, so you want to go back to single roll bars 6 inches under the driver's head? How about no seat belts?
See, its easy to exaggerate & ridicule the other guy's point of view....

Re: How much body work?
 

Its racing and tragic things happen. Nobody is really saying to go back and not run cages or whatever. I'm ok with todays sprintcars but lets not make them something else in the name of safety. Sprintcars don't need no barnstorming they need to just race.
I believe the only real solution is to go to virtual reality racing, but then folks would complain about thumb injuries and such.
Maybe 50 years around racing, seen all the good and bad has hardened me a bit but racing isn't racing without risk. Not everyone makes it out unscathed, just the way it is inless you want to change the whole fabric of the sport.

Take the bodies off, completely cover em. Doesn't matter.

ANYTIME I get a chance to see a 1400 pound car making 8 to 900 HP railing around a racetrack on the ragged edge of control, I'm a happy camper.

Take a step back, have a sniff of methanol and enjoy the spectacle.

Re: How much body work?
 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...3784376&type=3


Wonder if anybody in DC is saying this now???