Mini VS full sprint
 

Somebody help me out here. A I stupid to think that I'm about to pay the same kind of money for a full size sprint car VS. a mini? Seems like I can pick up a roller for about the same price and used sprint car motors obviusly vary but ive seen plenty for well under $10K.

A lot of the cheaper minis are 600cc and the 1000cc stuff seems about the same as the lower end V8 cars.

What am I missing here?

Just my opinion... Don't shoot!

Goes back to the old CTBC..
Cost To Be Competitive.

Yes it is true you can buy a sprint car for what a competitive 1000cc will cost, however you will not be competive in that car unless you go to a track that runs 2-3 features a night for a sprint class.

Older sprints with -11, or even -12 head engines would do good to qualify in a USAC show.

Then the cost of owning it is often over looked.
Sprint cars eat tires, if your going to be competive you need atleast a RR a night $250 or so a night there, fuel I'm guessing 20 gal to 30 gal a night.

When the engine does go south, the major cost sets in. Rebuilds alone cost what an entire 1000cc car can be purchased for....

All these facts is why I think the 305 Racesavers will take off here. The engine rules and cost are somewhat comparative to 1000cc cars. A working man could own and win races in either class. Both great platforms for a working budget.

Andy

I have less than 10k in my 305 Racesaver. Everything on and in the engine is "new" except the injection which came off a top 3 in Bloomington speedway points car. Plus I plan on taking the wing off on some weekends and going to other tracks on Saturday night and getting seat time.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Nope, not stupid to think that at all. The operating costs are higher, more tires etc. and full sprint cars break parts with minimal contact, while mini sprints just bend parts with hard contact.
The inatial investment in cars is the same pretty much, if you buy slightly used. Its been a long time since I drove, but we got my first roller used like 5 races from JJ Yeley, and a Claxton -12 that had just won Eldora for roughly 20k.
And the fun doesnt even compare. Driving a 410 is the most fun youll ever have.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

also 600cc cars are microsprints running on 10 inch diameter rims.
Minisprints are 1000cc running on 13 inch diameter rims, same size as a midget.
Sure you can get a decent sprintcar for the price of a great minisprint, but could you afford to race it ?

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

The #1 thing for me is that I can load up and go to the track by myself with my 1000 cc mini sprint. It takes pit help to run a big car. And a pocket full of money. If you can consistently run top 5 in a mini you have a good chance of breaking even or maybe even making a few bucks.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Not only can you do it by yourself, but you don't need as large a tow vehicle or trailer.
A 1/2 ton pickup and 12 -14 foot trailer works great. Less fuel to burn to get there.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Also takes up a ton less real estate in the garage/shop, which is potentially marriage saving.
You do see some seemingly high prices for Mini Sprints but most of the higher-dollar stuff is new or near-new with better-quality components. Even if you think you're getting apples-to-apples buying a Sprint Car, chances are that a full-sized sprinter of the same apparent age and quality will be a lot more used up than the "comparable" Mini Sprint. And, as everyone else has already stated, the real cost difference comes when you have to shell out for tires, fuel, spares and repairs.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Thing is to get what you really want and love. Then when your out of money and energy, you don't have to worry about selling it. Once you get to that point It will give you as much joy just sitting there.
I lucked out with the wife part, theres a mx bike in the living room and two speedwaybikes in the computer room. Not to mention my minisprint has the best parking spot in front of the house. She also knows I'm gonna blow a whole lot of money on a 410 as soon as we sell our vacation property and she cant wait.
Go into racing knowing your throwing your money away, for something that makes absolutely no sense if you think about it.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

You're not missing much. Also look at your particular area. Is car count good? Do I have the ability to race close to home at several different venues? If your answer is no to most if not all I would try a different class. Travel can be expensive and low car count is no fun.

Originally Posted by cws9:
The #1 thing for me is that I can load up and go to the track by myself with my 1000 cc mini sprint. It takes pit help to run a big car. And a pocket full of money. If you can consistently run top 5 in a mini you have a good chance of breaking even or maybe even making a few bucks.

This is the #1 reason I drive a mini and not a full size sprint car as well. That, and I don't have a garage. Very very affordable cars to keep racing. For
me personally, cheaper than a dirt go kart. I buy a lot of used midget tires.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by RookieMove:
Somebody help me out here. A I stupid to think that I'm about to pay the same kind of money for a full size sprint car VS. a mini? Seems like I can pick up a roller for about the same price and used sprint car motors obviusly vary but ive seen plenty for well under $10K.

A lot of the cheaper minis are 600cc and the 1000cc stuff seems about the same as the lower end V8 cars.

What am I missing here?

Rookie

Sprint cars are not really entry level race cars>>>even the 305's require more man power and wallet power to field than the smaller 13" wheel race cars. Notice I said 13" wheels. The reason being is there is a new class on the horizon called a D2 Midget. They take a Mini Sprint Chassis and Install a 4 valve stock block engine out of a late model car, Install a Midget drive shaft and rear end and go racing. In fact a lot of guys buy an old Midget rolling chassis and install the motor. As time goes on if Mini Sprints are not careful the cost of new donor motors starting at $2500.00 to 3,000.00 now days compared to around $500.00 to $1500.00 for the car engine. Then taking into account other add on parts that will be required to that Motor cycle motor to a race car and the D2 concept starts looking pretty good.

In addition the D2 midgets also allow Mini Sprints to race with them, not so the other way around however. They are new and you would be a pioneer. USAC and PowerI have taken it upon them selves to nurture the class also. Several independent groups have also sprang up. Research D2 Midgets on face book and other web sites and educate yourself a little more before deciding on what you want to race. Go observe some races walk around the pits and ask questions of the racers and above all else have fun.


Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by DAD:
Rookie

Sprint cars are not really entry level race cars>>>even the 305's require more man power and wallet power to field than the smaller 13" wheel race cars. Notice I said 13" wheels. The reason being is there is a new class on the horizon called a D2 Midget. They take a Mini Sprint Chassis and Install a 4 valve stock block engine out of a late model car, Install a Midget drive shaft and rear end and go racing. In fact a lot of guys buy an old Midget rolling chassis and install the motor. As time goes on if Mini Sprints are not careful the cost of new donor motors starting at $2500.00 to 3,000.00 now days compared to around $500.00 to $1500.00 for the car engine. Then taking into account other add on parts that will be required to that Motor cycle motor to a race car and the D2 concept starts looking pretty good.

In addition the D2 midgets also allow Mini Sprints to race with them, not so the other way around however. They are new and you would be a pioneer. USAC and PowerI have taken it upon them selves to nurture the class also. Several independent groups have also sprang up. Research D2 Midgets on face book and other web sites and educate yourself a little more before deciding on what you want to race. Go observe some races walk around the pits and ask questions of the racers and above all else have fun.


Honest Dad himself:6::6:

The automotive d2 cars commonly run between $15,000- $25,000

I have had and ran both for several years. I will tell you right up front that I love the sprint car. It's been a life long dream. The only bad part of it. It eats out of my wallet twice as fast as my mini did.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by cmiracingvids:
This is the #1 reason I drive a mini and not a full size sprint car as well. That, and I don't have a garage. Very very affordable cars to keep racing. For
me personally, cheaper than a dirt go kart. I buy a lot of used midget tires.

This could be my post and I would also add that they are self starting. I'm pretty much a one man gang when it comes to prepping our race stuff.

Originally Posted by TheSheriff:
The automotive d2 cars commonly run between $15,000- $25,000

False.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by Chris Baue:
False.

Chris

D2 Midgets are still in the middle of an identity crisis. People get them confused with National Midgets. $4500.00 for a slightly used roller $3000.00 for engine and add on parts. Makes $7500.00 investment in your D2 Midget program, of that $2500.00 is in re usable motor accessories. that can be reused when you freshen up your motor. A D2 Freshen up consist of going down to your local "pull a part" and jerking another Motor out.:D

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Originally Posted by DAD:
Chris

D2 Midgets are still in the middle of an identity crisis. People get them confused with National Midgets. $4500.00 for a slightly used roller $3000.00 for engine and add on parts. Makes $7500.00 investment in your D2 Midget program, of that $2500.00 is in re usable motor accessories. that can be reused when you freshen up your motor. A D2 Freshen up consist of going down to your local "pull a part" and jerking another Motor out.:D

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

What's your point? I was in disagreement with the statement that d2 cars commonly cost 15,000-25,000 dollars.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

chris

You will get old some day to>>>>I quoted the wrong post:5:

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Chris,
To a certain extent. I had about $23,000 into mine..... All depends on what approach you want to take....

Budget weekend racer wanting to tail the field and finish top 8 on a good day can buy a worn out midget and a junkyard motor for $6500-10,000

Weekend racer who enjoys running up front and having nice components/fresh motor/somewhat newish car can look to spend anywhere from $15-25,000.

I've seen both ways and if I'm gonna throw money away I'd prefer to have nice quality stuff and run up front.

And that's not counting spares, tires, etc.

Originally Posted by xoxide:
Chris,
To a certain extent. I had about $23,000 into mine..... All depends on what approach you want to take....

Budget weekend racer wanting to tail the field and finish top 8 on a good day can buy a worn out midget and a junkyard motor for $6500-10,000

Weekend racer who enjoys running up front and having nice components/fresh motor/somewhat newish car can look to spend anywhere from $15-25,000.

I've seen both ways and if I'm gonna throw money away I'd prefer to have nice quality stuff and run up front.

And that's not counting spares, tires, etc.

Ok, you got me. There's always a guy or two, like you apparently, who wants to spend 20k+ to show up to the "budget minded" race just to beat 19 other cars to make 200$. Congrats, more power to you.

Having said that, I still stand by my statement in that 15-25k d2 cars are the minority and not "common". Why is it that's all we have been hearing about all off season is "cheap junk yard engines" with "stock" components and merely bolt on a few parts and go race with others with the same stuff? Aren't these supposed to be STOCK engines? Where are you spending 15k on a stock legal engine?? The badger series is on an island from what I understand when it comes to the engine rules. Usac and powri use stock engines correct? What am I missing?

Ok enough bickering kids.
It's all preference.
You know on some Arabs 747s they have gold plated toilet seats..
They do the same job as the plastic ones.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by Chris Baue:
Ok, you got me. There's always a guy or two, like you apparently, who wants to spend 20k+ to show up to the "budget minded" race just to beat 19 other cars to make 200$. Congrats, more power to you.

Having said that, I still stand by my statement in that 15-25k d2 cars are the minority and not "common". Why is it that's all we have been hearing about all off season is "cheap junk yard engines" with "stock" components and merely bolt on a few parts and go race with others with the same stuff? Aren't these supposed to be STOCK engines? Where are you spending 15k on a stock legal engine?? The badger series is on an island from what I understand when it comes to the engine rules. Usac and powri use stock engines correct? What am I missing?

xoxide ran down in Florida with Wayne Davis's series and if i'm not mistaken they have some different engine rules.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

Originally Posted by Bradleyracing86:
Ok enough bickering kids.
It's all preference.
You know on some Arabs 747s they have gold plated toilet seats..
The do the same job as the plastic ones.

Andy

You calling me a kid? Thanks Kiddo:)

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Cody yes I did.

the rules were identical to imra, Illini , etc though nothing special about it.

I'm curious where you read anything about $15k in an engine though? I know my engine package was $8500 for a "stick with a few bolt ons" freshened motor and that included everything from header, ecu, plug wires, fuel pump, and even fuel filters...... I guess we can agree on the fact that "d2 motors" shouldn't be $15k..... The only ones I know of hitting that price are Hondas which are few and far between

In the grand scheme of things $23,000 for a brand new race ready car is still a hell of a lot cheaper than running national midgets, sprint cars, etc..... So I'm not real sure where "that one guy" comments are stemming from.

I don't think it has as much to do with the fact people want to spend that much to race for $200, but more so the peace of mind knowing my equipment wasn't one lap away from failure or my motor wasn't one feature away from blowing a piston out of the side, or having to constantly battle issues with worn out equipment.

Spending that $23,000 made me able to go out, race and not take my hood off or think about anything besides small setup adjustments all night, come home and wash the car and perform some minor maintenance and go out and repeat process without having a single headache all year.


Enough of that though no need to beat a dead horse

I'll make this real simple.......either you want to race as a hobby or you want to take on a second job. You can run a 1000cc as a hobby. A sprint car is a second job, and to be moderately successful you will need a second job to pay for it.

A buddy once told me that the higher the level you reach in racing the more it becomes like a job and less of a hobby.....and he was right.

You hit the nail on the head. Thats why our sprint is currently parked because neither my son or I have time for a second job

Originally Posted by Phylo82:
I'll make this real simple.......either you want to race as a hobby or you want to take on a second job. You can run a 1000cc as a hobby. A sprint car is a second job, and to be moderately successful you will need a second job to pay for it.

A buddy once told me that the higher the level you reach in racing the more it becomes like a job and less of a hobby.....and he was right.

That makes sense. Been there done that, once you're invested so far into something, chasing money, lap times and results it can become a chore I instead of a passion.

Good stuff, thanks for the advice guys.

Re: Mini VS full sprint
 

I have $ 3300.00 invested in my minisprint and untold amount of labor. It will keep pace with any minisprint and beat most.
That being said I'm not gonna bust on somebody for spending money buying a new car, they're all new at some point and they don't come from the factory with junk yard parts. Also not everyone needs a second job to have expendable money.

New cars are a good thing, helps populate a class with good used equipment in the future, I agree with Denton.... And being honest sometimes you spend less when you buy good equipment at the start.. It cost a lot to travel to a track and have breakdowns...

If you decide to go the 1000cc route do yourself a favor and spend some time in the pits at the track you plan to run most often. Talk to people......see what types off chassis, shocks, engines, etc they are running. A little bit of pre work will save you time, money and heartache down the road. You might run into someone who has a good program that is looking to sell their car to buy a new one. If you can get something like that you will have loads of info and a resource at the track if you have questions. Good luck.