New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

What are your feelings on MSCS, Bloomington, Lawrenceburg, and Putnamville going to the all 4 Hoosier rule? Is this good for the car owners and drivers or just the tracks or sanctioning bodies? Will this increase Point Funds with the added money paid to the tracks and sanctioning bodies? What about pricing? Will prices go up more after the market only has one tire manufacturer? Why weren't the racers given a lead in time to use up other tires? Is this good for Sprint Car racing for the future?
I am surprised nobody has discussed this intelligently already, but here's our chance. If you are for the Rule Change give reasons why and if against it, please do the same. Let's have a respectful, intelligent discussion about a Rule Change that may change the face of local Non-Wing Sprint Car racing forever.

Was not aware of this JT.. On one hand if Hoosier tires is gonna "pony-up" more money towards races and sponsorship of MSCS then "might" not b a bad thing... On the other hand I feel for all the guys that just wanna race and can't because of rule... I dunno pal I'm torn..... I think this blows unless there's a reason &we aren't getting the lowdown on it yet??? Just my 2cents... I would rather see all guys that wanna run MSCS run -minus the rule!! Almost seems like monopoly to me... Just sayin....I think we'd ALL like some clarity as to why???? Especially the tracks...I could see MSCS doing this.. But tracks??!!

There's never nothing good come of having only one manufacturer in a competition. That's part of competition, brands going head to head against each other. NASCAR has went to spec racing, I just hope we as local racer haven't been forced into it. No good.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Originally Posted by DirtHawk92:
Was not aware of this JT.. On one hand if Hoosier tires is gonna "pony-up" more money towards races and sponsorship of MSCS then "might" not b a bad thing... On the other hand I feel for all the guys that just wanna race and can't because of rule... I dunno pal I'm torn..... I think this blows unless there's a reason &we aren't getting the lowdown on it yet??? Just my 2cents... I would rather see all guys that wanna run MSCS run -minus the rule!! Almost seems like monopoly to me... Just sayin....I think we'd ALL like some clarity as to why???? Especially the tracks...I could see MSCS doing this.. But tracks??!!

Almost seems like a monopoly? Monopoly. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service. Quack, quack, quack, quack. :(

I can't believe it has taken this long. Tire manufactures don't want competition because it cuts into profits and promotors are looking for ways to increase revenue. There is no incentive for promotors, clubs and sanctioning bodies to help the racers because the racers won't help themselves. It's not going to keep teams from going because they will do whatever it takes to race. Smart financial moves for Hoosier and the tracks.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

This is a very sad deal to see happening. I formed the BOSS series in an effort to help fight some of the bad trends in short track racing. I think many of my teams will tell you how hard I've fought against "fees" and stupid rules that cost teams money.

Our open tire rule last year produced GREAT racing with 2 photo finishes where the 2 cars in question were on opposite brands of tires. We have proven that the competition is very equal and the BOSS series is sponsored equally by both tire manufacturers for a total dollar amount of MORE than what some tracks got to have a tire rule.

The tracks may feel that they are in a position where they have no choice. I felt that way once upon a time too.

The BOSS series will remain OPEN tire rule proudly supported equally by BOTH manufacturers.

Aaron Fry
BOSS

I think that is a great way to do it myself, but I don't know what tracks and clubs are offered to do these deals.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

I don't want anyone to take it personally, But this BLOWS!

Next thing all the sprint cars will be running Maxim, Hoosier, Gaertes infinitys with absolutely no choice of anything.

Call it indycar for lack of a better name. See where that went.................

Will not support any place with this rule! Period.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

#gyatk

Not necessarily a fan of the all 4 tire rule. But I have always likd a spec rr. The spec rr reduces the amount of variables for new and learning teams and drivers, plus big money teams don't have the opportunity to buy an extremely soft rr and put a new one on each race. The real question is, will this rule actually be enforced. I have never seen a local weekly show event that checks tire compound.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Does this mean we have to run the same 4 tires all nite. Would that make it cheaper.

Lynn

Is USAC still open tire other than RR . Or did the National Sprint Cars cave into the Hoosier garbage monopoly also .

As of this moment, USAC, Kokomo, and Gas City are still open on the other 3 corners. BOSS, Twin Cities Raceway Park, Paragon, and Vermilion County Speedway are OPEN all the way around.

I will be supporting those tracks and series that don't cave into the Communist tire rule.

Patrick Budde

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Money, Money, MONEY.

Money.... they say............is the root of all evil today.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

"....Communist tire rule."

Patrick Budde[/QUOTE]

I like that!:)

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Last year Bloomington did check right rear tire compounds with a durometer on several occasions. This was done pre and post heat cycle's. After checking a couple hundred tire's at different stage's of the race program they all "appeared" to be in compliance. I am for an open tire rule. I chose not to return to Bloomington as an inspector this year. I would have a hard time as a racer not to let a racer compete due to an A/R on the front.

Originally Posted by nonwing77:
Will not support any place with this rule! Period.

This is the only way the tracks will stop doing this is for the racers to boycott. I'm afraid though when the time comes, everyone who is passionate about this now will roll over, run the required tires, and the tracks/organizations will not be affected. Only way they will get the message is if open tire/organization car counts increase, and those restricting it will lose a lot of cars count.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

n/a

I agree to open tire rules.maybe they should've considered incentives to use the Hoosier.although tqs are a smaller animal,we have open tire rule.however,we had a club with A/R as a series sponsor.A/R offered a free tire to the feature winner IF the car had A/R on all four corners.seems like there should be a compromise.

Originally Posted by winged and non-winged:
I will be supporting those tracks and series that don't cave into the Communist tire rule.


Patrick Budde

I will be doing this also.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

We should not be surprised at a major change happening right before the season starts. The tracks do not and have not cared about the racers for a long time going back to the beginning of the spec tire mess in 2007. I all boils down to all of the tracks becoming greedy and what is in it for them. They say its for the points fund, well I don't points race any longer and when a track only pays the top 5 where is the incentive to race under this type of rule every week. At this point in the year teams are ready for the season and have set a budget for what they need to run the year. Now you say well now you have to buy specific brand tires to be able to run is crazy. I just priced tires at Hoosier and almost passed out at the price. For a team running a limited schedule they are ridiculous in price. This rule would make me have to buy tires that at this time I do not need, how stupid can they be. I can say if this is what they want to do it will hopefully bite them in the rear. In 17 years of racing a sprintcar I have never seen a change this late in the year right before season starts. It seems very underhanded and insulting to smaller teams that want to race but do not get to spend someone else's money and have a budget to run the season on. If they do not want the local small teams they are doing everything they can to not have them. It is sad that what was a hot bed of outlaw non wing racing has turned into NASCAR.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Originally Posted by Leohr46:
I will be doing this also.

I imagine than that you guys that wont support a series or tracks with a tire rule also will boycott Nascar, Indycar and all that other crap.
They are way more towards the "communists" way of doing things.
Especially Indycar, inless they're on a oval might as well be F1 :29:

Absolutely. Never did have any interest in those series.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Well... all of you that run those purple required tracks just got steam rolled. And the reason these track promoters do deals like this is because the drivers and owners are not organized.... unionized would be the politically correct term. So until this happens they can $%^& you all they want and in the meantime their wallets get bigger and bigger. :7:

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Originally Posted by Backitin:
I imagine than that you guys that wont support a series or tracks with a tire rule also will boycott Nascar, Indycar and all that other crap.
They are way more towards the "communists" way of doing things.
Especially Indycar, inless they're on a oval might as well be F1 :29:

You see were that went, Indycar can't carry 15 cars its whole series and now Nascar can't fill a reduced to 40 car starting field.

Nevermind the fact that some Nascar Tracks have reduced seating by almost half.

If tracks want to help themselves, THE BEST THING THEY CAN DO IS HAVE FULL FIELDS OF THE HEADLINER CLASS and the fans, reputation and $$$ will follow.

Does the rule help teams or not? I know teams that would slap the hardest damn A/R RR they could get just so they could race it 5-10-15 races or buy top teams throwaways at pennies on the dollar and save that 2-3-5k to put into motor rebuilds but they'd BE THERE EVERY WEEK vs racing whenever they can afford a set of tires that if a certain track condition occurs puts them out another 1500 in tires in ONE NIGHT.

You want to make it more affordable and equalize it a bit, Make that hardest RR the rule and quit tinkering every year. Setup and driver ability is still going to win but the thumper motor might not.

Just found out that Lawrenceburg is willing to do the first 3 regular shows or May 15th, whatever comes first to allow us to use up any American Racers. That's not the point! Point is, it's going to take all that care about Sprint Car racing and the eventual prices if it becomes Purple Tires only everywhere! I'm talking not just for us American Racer supporters;I'm talking about all you Guys that run purple tires all the time too! If we ban together and only support tracks or sanctioning bodies that are OPEN Tire or Right Rear Only Rule, then something will change!

The sad part is JT you can't get enough teams to stand up and show the tracks that we are not going to be pushed around anymore. I was going to run Bloomington on the nights my daughter wasn't racing but that went out the window. I will not buy tires I don't need just to make them happy. I will run the open tire tracks when I can.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Originally Posted by treecitytornado:
Just found out that Lawrenceburg is willing to do the first 3 regular shows or May 15th, whatever comes first to allow us to use up any American Racers. That's not the point! Point is, it's going to take all that care about Sprint Car racing and the eventual prices if it becomes Purple Tires only everywhere! I'm talking not just for us American Racer supporters;I'm talking about all you Guys that run purple tires all the time too! If we ban together and only support tracks or sanctioning bodies that are OPEN Tire or Right Rear Only Rule, then something will change!

Lawrenceburg's first race is less then 2 weeks away and still changing the rules.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

The best rule book when you open it up says there are no rules.
Except for keeping the cars looking traditional and safety aspects.
Now I'm talking nonwing sprintcars. I don't give a crap about anything else.
That's what I miss the most about the early modified days, there was no rule book. We ran on used tires and parts, its amazing what well off folks consider used up.
That being said inless your a car owner or buy tires for one, I'd just not worry about the details and enjoy what you have. Say Kokomo decided to have a tire rule, would you still boycott the best racing going ?
Makes no sense to me.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

JT, I have question. Do you get a deal on American Racer tires or do they cost the same for you and you just prefer them? When racers get a discount on tires, other racers pay for them.

Here is the thing about a tire rule. From the stands you cannot tell the difference from a race with one to one without. The people affected are the teams putting on the show. We take the brunt of the deals and let me tell you it has not helped at all.

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Not going to complain. Lived with a right rear spec tire back in the 1990's. Don't like it but lived with it then and can now. But as soon as they say left rear or all four, ain't gonna complain. Gonna retire.:D

I have no deal with anyone and can tell you this screws the racers

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

As of today's website Waynesfield has the following tire rules. Welcome to WRP and only a RR Hoosier.
WAYNESFIELD RACEWAY PARK
2016 Non Wing Rules
The following specifications prepared by Waynesfield Raceway Park are guidelines for a NonWing (traditional) Sprint Car entry. No expressed or implied warranty of safety shall result from publication of, or compliance with these rules. They are intended as a guide and are in no way a guarantee against injury or death to participants, spectators, or others.
These specifications are for the 2016 Racing Season at Waynesfield Raceway Park. Management reserves the right to change them at any time.
I. TIRES: A. Right Rear tire must be a Hoosier Medium 105-16.
B. During sanctioned events (i.e. BOSS, MTS) teams will be permitted to run the sanctioning tire rules.
C. Tires may be grooved and siped as needed.

Originally Posted by trecraft:
Almost seems like a monopoly? Monopoly. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service. Quack, quack, quack, quack. :(

Winner, winner......chicken dinner. Only two groups that this deal works for and that doesn't include the nut behind the wheel. If they really wanted to control cost tire wise have a spec hardness rule that could be checked with a duramator and let the racers have a say in what goes on their car.

I agree with JT and Don. Its going to take all the owners to make a stand!! Maybe its just me but its pretty obvious where the money comes from to give to the tracks, from the owners and drivers. Taking different options away does not create a competitive environment. If the tracks would have negotiated a set price that was competitive then they could possibly say they are helping us. It doesnt matter what tire you choose to run or for what reason. Im not saying one tire is better than the other let the racers and owners decide what is best. The amount of money in the point fund will not offset the difference in cost for us. Secondly, what if your not chasing points. I would wven be fine with you were not eligible for point money unless you ran hoosiers if they are giving money. If american racer can build a RR tire and sell it for 175. Im positive hoosier could to if they weren't giving the tracks thousands of dollars. I will support the open tire rule tracks also. I hate to say that since I live 6 miles from Bloomington. I will also support Montpeiler in the midget as they have an open tire rule there. Just as it seems to be a money thing for the tracks its a money thing for me as well.

Michael Koontz

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Well I'm not surprised and will continue to support Keith and Paragon Speedway and as much as it sucks will not be running any of the tracks that support this deal of Hoosier bullying racers into buying their tires and USAC bullying tracks into going along with this by holding Sprint Week and Midget Week shows over the track owners and promoters heads. The key is that all the racers that are saying they will not run and support this deal have to stick to your word. I love racing but I don't see where this deal helps me as a driver owner in any way. Hoosier Tires cost more than American Racers and if they were competitively priced it may be a different story. The reason this happened is more and more guys were running American Racers on the other 3 corners and instead of making a better and price comparative tire Hoosier and USAC just broke it off in all of the track owners and racers. Looks like the tracks with open tire rules will get my pit pass money and I'm sure my brothers as well. Trust me I will stick to my word even if it means parking the car! Sad to see this happening....

David Hair

Re: New Hoosier All 4 Rule
 

Was at a race last yr & a driver won a race w/ an American Racer tire:8:, it was the 2nd race on the tire & it still looked good, owner said he was gonna use it again at another race:6:. Another racer said if only Hoosiers lasted like that. This was the 2nd race this car had won on the same tire, do Hoosiers last like that? :31: