late model or sprint
 

On a recent thread, someone posted "and we wonder why late models are more popular?"
Are you kidding me? I enjoy late models, and go whenever I can. But in my world it ain't even close. If you think late models are more popular, and want an answer why, ask yourself why nascar is so popular? That should tell you that popularity ain't got **** to do with quality racing!

Re: late model or sprint
 

Ive seen amazing races in both Sprint Cars and Late Models..

Hence why I am a fan of both.

This seems like a disaster thread waiting to happen

Re: late model or sprint
 

I've never met a race car I didn't like!

If your balls aren't big enough for a sprint just run a late model instead. Lol.
I run a modified now by the way.... Haha

Both are great. Why limit yourself? Love all motor sports, you'll be surprised by what you're missing 😎

Re: late model or sprint
 

If you're lucky enough to like sprints, midgets, mods, late models and most anything on dirt as I do, there is always a good race close by.

Well since I made the post referred to in the OP I might as well respond. From when I started in the sport to now, I have seen the LM's over take sprint cars in popularity. Look at the number of high paying LM races vs sprint cars any more. The way that the sprint car world has become fragmented has certainly helped this along with the high cost. For me personally, I am not a huge fan of them. They lack the explosiveness and agility of a sprint car. To me, they appear to be lumbering around the track. Plus when you need to stand between the fender and engine to work on it, some is not right :D. Don't get me wrong, I'm not taking anything away from the drivers, crews, or the technology in that form of motorsports. I will take the late models any day of the week over nascar.

This website isn't called indianatintop.com .....LOL

Re: late model or sprint
 

I will take Sprint Car's over Late Models any day! But I love racing and I will go watch lawnmowers race if that's all there was! :):6::32:

Re: late model or sprint
 

Two different entities...as a whole Late model racing across the nation is way more properly then sprint cars...sprint cars are more regional UNFORTUNATELY!!!

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by rclaridge:
This website isn't called indianatintop.com .....LOL

Now that's funny lol bright spot of my day :5:

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by flagboy55:
But in my world it ain't even close. If you think late models are more popular, and want an answer why, ask yourself why NASCAR is so popular? That should tell you that popularity ain't got **** to do with quality racing!

Dirt late models popularity has NOTHING to do with NASCAR's popularity. Not even close. The DLM crowd is FAR more knowledgeable and faithful to the sport than 20% of the modern NASCAR crowd. DLM's are great cars and great racing. I would like to strap one on some day!:22:

Re: late model or sprint
 

It's all in the promotion.

I can tune in periodically and watch the Lucas Oil Dirt Late Models on the tube. I can't tune in and watch any sprint car racing, though. A far difference from 10 years ago when the WoO was on every week on the Outdoor Channel tape delayed. But since then with the advances provided by the internet, one can pick and choose races from here and there. I personally cannot wait to watch the WSS from down under when they start up for their season.

Late Models..... Sprints..... Both are good, but I prefer the latter.

I for one like racing across the board..i have tended to get more into midgets than sprint cars the last year or so. The 10 race deal Montpelier does is pretty cool. I also like sprint car racing. We are very lucky to have what we do across the state. You could also find me at a latemodel race. Everyone has there preferences on what they like/don't like.. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with liking latemodels, mods, or stocks. I am just a race fan :).

Tk

Puppy, you totally didn't get my sarcasm.

Re: late model or sprint
 

i started my racing in a late model back in 1984 85 86 then got married lol started in sprints in 1990 back then late models where not as popular and sprints where gaining popularity thats why i changed both are alot of fun to drive i would say on big tracks late models on short tracks sprint cars for sure but i loved both. plus if u think sprint car racing is expensive go late model racing lol

Brian.... That is an interesting statement about cost. In what areas are late models more costly to run than sprint cars? I always thought that sprints had a higher cost per race to run.

The tire bill is much much higher on a Late Model, but if you notice they have a lot more higher paying shows than Sprint Cars for whatever reason.

Re: late model or sprint
 

How much sheet metal is replaced on a sprint car each year. Add to that extra wraps, decals or paint, Also a lot more 50 lap plus races.

I don't know what everyone spends on what, But I did look up the Roush LM motor that Bloomer was running a couple years ago and it was 52k

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by flagboy55:
Puppy, you totally didn't get my sarcasm.

Oh, I didnt realize thats what it was.... ALL GOOD! :5:

Originally Posted by treecitytornado:
The tire bill is much much higher on a Late Model, but if you notice they have a lot more higher paying shows than Sprint Cars for whatever reason.

Yeah figured tire bill had to be higher but was thinking overall motor cost should be even if not a little lower if compared to a winged car. Absolutely no clue on cost in regards to the chassis. And yes it sucks that they have a lot more higher paying shows.

What's a late model?

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by JMA1181:
What's a late model?

Ahhhh! A NASCAR fan!

I think pretty much everything on a late model is more expensive. That's why LM racing in IN and IL has been declining for many years. Many stock car people have switched to sprints for that reason.

Re: late model or sprint
 

I'm a die hard sprint car guy, but the Late Models must be doing something right because there are many many more of them out there.

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by Bstev33x:
I'm a die hard sprint car guy, but the Late Models must be doing something right because there are many many more of them out there.

It's been said by guys who have driven and won in both sprint cars and dirt late models that the late models take less talent and are easier to drive and more experience to figure out the set up and tire selection as opposed to a sprint car.

A driver of a dirt late model is less apt to be injured, or worse, than a sprint car driver in the event of crash and that no doubt influences participation. I was told by a well known Midwest dirt late model driver who also is a very good friend that he drove a sprinter one time and never wanted to drive one again. His exact words were that "a sprint car is way too violent" and he never wrecked, it was just too violent for his taste.

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by Stevensville Mike:
Ahhhh! A NASCAR fan!

Work as a sports editor at a newspaper. Lots of stick & ball people ask me what my favorite sports is. I always say sprint car racing. This isn't what they expect and they always say .... Ahhhh! A NASCAR fan! :19:

Re: late model or sprint
 

it also takes twice as much money at the car wash lol. as far as the talent statement it takes talent to be a good drive in any division! the thing to me about sprint cars is the drivers abilty to make a bad set up work by changing ur line or just hustling the car. not that u cant in a stock car but ur a little more limited like pavement racing. but the driver still has to be talented or the best set ups will just be mid pack. i love all types of racing just a fan of passing and good hard racing :D

Late models cost way more than a sprint car to run weekly. Maybe a WoO wing sprint costs as much as a late model, but I highly doubt it costs more. There is just more to a late model. There is more technology and technology means more $$$. And please don't try to argue that fact. Go to the Indy museum and look at the 1920's Indy cars. Sprint cars are running the same style suspension that they ran nearly 100 years ago. Now that's all fine and dandy and they put on great races, but from a technology and engineering aspect, sprint cars are boring. Maybe that's a small part of the popularity difference.

And for reference a brand new Club 29 (a popular chassis brand) with good parts is around $45,000 for a roller. A brand new wide bore engine is around $45,000 as well. It costs around $90,000 or so to build a brand new top of the line late model capable of winning the big races.

But I think the main problem in sprint car racing is the level of envolvement on the fan's part. Late model racing fans know everything about the drivers and their chassis, engines, etc. I know people who love sprint car racing but they couldn't tell you what kind of chassis Darland runs. In late model racing that's a huge rivalry. And also sprint car drivers play an ongoing game of musical racing seats. It makes it hard for fans to identify with drivers when they are in a different car and different number every other race. Sprint car racing as a whole needs to get better at building brands. Drivers need to stick with the same numbers and need to keep the same general car look to allow fans to build a bond with that driver and car. The old school Indy style of numbering and lettering the cars to identify with the team isn't as effective as identifying with the drivers. It may be good for those of us who are hardcore fans, but to the average fan they just care about the drivers.

Great post, Dustin. I think you nailed it about branding the sport. Big time LM racing does a good job of that.

Re: late model or sprint
 

If a sprint car driver, especially a wingless sprint car driver, is really good he almost always moves up the racing totem pole to where the money and fame is. Just take inventory of the how many really great drivers that have left sprint car racing the past 25 years or so because they earned the opportunity to make the big bucks and be on live national TV well over 30 weekends a year.

If all or most of those drivers had stayed in open wheel short track racing the racing landscape in regards to drivers and the popularity of sprint car racing would be vastly different. Kinser, Sammy, Darland and Hewitt among others, are good examples of guys who stayed racing sprint cars and how popular they were in the sprint car ranks.

Very few dirt late model drivers have made the transition up the racing totem pole over the same 25 year time period. I remember well when Billy Moyer and Scott Bloomquist, arguably the biggest 2 names in dirt late model racing were the youngsters and here we are 30 years later and they are still the 2 biggest marque names. Neither ever really had a shot at the big time.

Dirt track open wheel racing has been a feeder system for NASCAR for a long time and still is to a certain extent. Dirt late model racing, not nearly so much. It's been fun over the years to watch guys like Kenny Schrader, Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Ricky Stenhouse Jr., Ryan Newman, Carl Edwards, JJ Yeley, Kasey Kahne and Kyle Larson go to NASCAR and win a bunch of races and championships. Christopher Bell and Rico are beginning to make their move towards the money and fame, as well. The vacuum those guys left opened the door for youngsters to move into sprint car racing but it took time for the name recognition to become reality.

Again, how different would the open wheel racing landscape be if all those guys had not got the chance to move up the ladder and spent their entire driving careers in short track open wheel cars? Quite a bit, I reckon.

Most of the big name dirt late model drivers have, or will, end their career's in dirt late models which has bred decades of familiarity and rivalries which probably has had an impact on popularity.

Re: late model or sprint
 

Originally Posted by fish:
Work as a sports editor at a newspaper. Lots of stick & ball people ask me what my favorite sports is. I always say sprint car racing. This isn't what they expect and they always say .... Ahhhh! A NASCAR fan! :19:

Somehow that does not surprise me one bit. You 'MIGHT' have had a better chance if it was still Winston Cup vice Sprint Cup, fish. They hear "Sprint" and the ears tune out.

But yes..... try explaining sprint cars or late models to a non-race fan and they tend to look at you like a deer looking at headlights. Not only are we fans these days, we have to be promoters of the sport.

A lot of interesting posts. Ultimately, for me, there is no problem with spin the car racing. It's the fans that like late models more. I grew up in one of 2 spots in Indiana where late model were king. I have been to a ton of lm races, and I love them. But all things equal, travel, cost, etc, anyone that would go to a late model race before a sprint car race, needs to reevaluate why you go to the races at all.

Re: late model or sprint
 

"But all things equal, travel, cost, etc, anyone that would go to a late model race before a sprint car race, needs to reevaluate why you go to the races at all."

That really is an unfair statement to make. Ive seen hundreds of amazing and great Late Model races. Ive seen hundreds of great Sprint Car races. Hell, ive seen hundreds of great Modified, and Street Stock races. Not sure that anyone has the right to tell me to reevaluate my fandom...

If its three wide racing, passing everywhere, and cars coming from the back to win, im going to love the hell out of it. Thats what makes this sport great.

Chris, I always appreciate your opinion. I was stirring the pot a little. But seriously in my opinion, a sprint car is the ultimate dirt track machine. Nothing takes you closer to the edge. And isn't racing a balance on the edge?
That said, your comments are always done tastefully even when in disagreement

Re: late model or sprint
 

I am above all a sprint car fan. Nothing against late models, but I spend enough money on sprint cars. I will agree that there are more late models nation wide, it seems to me like that number is slowly shrinking. Not too long ago big late model races like the World 100 would get over 200 cars. Some nights of the Hell Tour didn't have full fields. Still good racing and I can understand why people enjoy them.

Re: late model or sprint
 

As a crew guy, I hate working on Late Models. There is so much body work in the way it takes twice as long to do even the simplest tasks as it does on a Sprint Car or even a Modified. Cost and time of dealing with the body work alone is off-putting for me.

As a fan I've seen great races with about every possible variant of car out there and I consistently get a better experience from non-wing sprint cars than I do any other racecar, but both will put on a great show when they are in their element.

Re: late model or sprint
 

as a fan of both and been to over a thousand sprint and a thousand lm event's I look at it this way....I get to see a lot more racetracks. :6:

Re: late model or sprint
 

Being from the area of The Land O' Lincoln & crooked politicians where if it isn't a dirt late model it doesn't really exist the choices are very limited.

We grew up going to stock car/dirt late model races because that is all there was in regards to weekly shows after 1970 when Fairbury American Legion Speedway in Fairbury, IL dropped sprint cars/super modifieds on a weekly basis. For that reason stock cars/dirt late models were our first love.

However, when our discretionary income finally reached a point that we could afford to expand our racing horizon's beyond Fairbury, Kankakee, La Salle, et al, and the dirt lates they run/ran exclusively we found out there was something faster and much more exciting. No disrespect intended toward the dirt lates, their drivers and fans and we still go to a couple of the bigger DLM shows every season.

But, after we saw the light what really gets our heart pumpin, is watching midgets, wingless 410 sprinters and Silver Crown cars back 'em in on a dirt track!

I love late models, always have and always will. They will always be a favorite of mine having grown up going to Montpelier, which ran them weekly until the mid-90's. But living in northern Indiana, I rarely ever get to see them locally any more. I also really enjoy sprints, both winged and traditional. I loved watching them as I got older at Gas City and Kokomo. I am a huge fan of Modifieds, Super Stock, Street Stock, Bomber, and just about any class that runs at my local dirt track. I'll watch NASCAR, IndyCar, Formula 1, and just about anything I can find on tv that is in that wheelhouse. Honestly, I just freakin' love racing, period.

In my opinion, great racing is influenced a lot more by the track itself. This year, I went to Fairbury for a late model show. It was outstanding. One of the best tracks I've ever been to. I also went to a sprint show at Kokomo, and it was also outstanding. Those two tracks are very similar, and both put on an incredible show. What really helped me see how similar they were was the late model feature at the Kokomo Klash. It was almost exactly the same, tremendous race as what I saw at Fairbury. The only difference was Weaver held on for the win at Fairbury. Great racing in all classes is possible at a great track, and there are many of them right before our eyes.

The only problem is, some people can't see over the end of their nose to know that there are some really good races in classes other than the one they are primarily there to see. Our society has become so specialized and opinionated that we often don't even see the greatness of many things around us. That's ok though, I'll be the guy there to enjoy all of it.