usac nat midgets
 

does anybody have an idea when usac is going to release there national midget schedule?

They're probably trying to find a way of announcing that they're killing the pavement races.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

its horrible to see usac going down hill.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

They're still brainstorming trying to find a way to compete with POWRi.

They could still be trying to add races..i known of a track trying to get a date..hopefully they can :)

Tk

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Nate:
They're still brainstorming trying to find a way to compete with POWRi.

You mean the series that only competes in the shadow of the Arch and is afraid of big tracks?

Id like to see Brownstown on the schedule

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Jonr:
You mean the series that only competes in the shadow of the Arch and is afraid of big tracks?

USAC needs to stay away from the big tracks........To run them and win a team needs Horsepower and that stuff is expensive. PowrI on the other hand have a lot of small although fast 1/5 th and 1/4 miles to compete on. This helps some in equalizing the horsepower disparage between the haves and have not's. Pavement racing is a horsepower eater and they can not find enough haves to put on a good show. A guy told me recently that Hoosier was a big reason behind the demise of pavement racing. The tire bill alone for a pavement race can run up close to a thousand dollars, That would make everyone but the top cars losers. USAC has no control over Hoosier other than opening up their tire rule and allowing competition to do what competition usually does, and that is make things better. I am sure they must weigh their compensation that they receive from Hoosier over the gain they might receive in the form of extra cars for their races. Maybe changing compounds would also help some. Back in the Bad old days a fan could watch the sprint cars running at Salem and it was not unusual to see one of them big bad "302 Chevy" powered Sprint Cars with blue smoke coming off of both rear wheels when coming off of turn 4. Blistered tires were also very common in those days also>> and it was the driver that had the moxie to manage his tires that usually won. Advancement in tire design has added greatly to traction and cost of the tires. Maybe if we want more pavement races and also in the future more dirt track racing we need to also look carefully at tires and tire company's also.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Originally Posted by cwfan08:
They could still be trying to add races..i known of a track trying to get a date..hopefully they can :)

Tk

What's the hold up? I've heard for the last 2 years Montpelier was trying to get a USAC race and was told this year it is a sure thing they will have one.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Jonr:
You mean the series that only competes in the shadow of the Arch and is afraid of big tracks?

They still run 5 states and have nearly 40 shows this season. Thats what? 15-20 more events than USAC had last year and probably will have this year?

Additionally, not sure what kind of big tracks you're looking for? Half miles?
Angell Park, Wheatland, Jacksonville, Grain Valley, St. Francois, Fayatte County, Fairbury, Pontoon Beach, I-55, Lincoln, Lasalle, Spoon River, Haubstadt...all 1/4 or bigger. Those aren't big enough? The only tracks USAC ran last year that were bigger than any of those was Eldora for the 4-Crown, the race they fielded a whopping 13 cars in and Perris for Turkey Night.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

My hope is that the delay is being caused by negotiations which are taking some time to finalize for a real blockbuster event or events. My fear is that it is being caused by trying to convince enough tracks to have a race to have a decent schedule.

I know tri city said they we're announcing their schedule on the 18th, I believe it is... And they do the Gold Crown which has been a USAC national midget show in the past

If USAC was smart, (which I would never accuse them of being), they should break their ties with Hoosier Tire Co. and open the tire rules up to any brand. Or go to a cheaper harder tire.
Stars runs national midgets at Grundy Co. on pavement and last year changed to American Racers. I believe that all their competitors are happy with that decision. Then I would suggest putting a new tire limit per night on all competitors to keep the price of attending down. Maybe 2 a night or something. And as its been mentioned, leave the midgets to race on smaller tracks until the base of cars is built back up. Big HP to go fast on big tracks means big $ and people will quit attending when they have no chance to compete. And I would suggest limiting the travel radius from Indy as well. No Phoenix or Irwindale races on the schedule. There are plenty of really nice race track in the midwest that would work nicely.
But, USAC will kill the pavement series before they'll do something proactive like that.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by team3521:
If USAC was smart, (which I would never accuse them of being), they should break their ties with Hoosier Tire Co. and open the tire rules up to any brand. Or go to a cheaper harder tire.
Stars runs national midgets at Grundy Co. on pavement and last year changed to American Racers. I believe that all their competitors are happy with that decision. Then I would suggest putting a new tire limit per night on all competitors to keep the price of attending down. Maybe 2 a night or something. And as its been mentioned, leave the midgets to race on smaller tracks until the base of cars is built back up. Big HP to go fast on big tracks means big $ and people will quit attending when they have no chance to compete. And I would suggest limiting the travel radius from Indy as well. No Phoenix or Irwindale races on the schedule. There are plenty of really nice race track in the midwest that would work nicely.
But, USAC will kill the pavement series before they'll do something proactive like that.

How many cars did Grundy get last year. I was there the year before and it wasn't real good the night I was there. I still think it is a cool track.

It should be clear by now that USAC's goal is to first eliminate the Silver Crown series, then work on destroying the National Midgets, and after accomplishing this they kill the sprint division. This will eliminate jobs for all those officials making the exorbitant salaries. Seems like a reasonable plan.

Sarcasm should be noted.

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I'm looking forward to the show at Plymouth in May!:6:

Re: usac nat midgets
 

That is like the only thing announced so far, right?

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by team3521:
If USAC was smart, (which I would never accuse them of being), they should break their ties with Hoosier Tire Co. and open the tire rules up to any brand. Or go to a cheaper harder tire.
Stars runs national midgets at Grundy Co. on pavement and last year changed to American Racers. I believe that all their competitors are happy with that decision. Then I would suggest putting a new tire limit per night on all competitors to keep the price of attending down. Maybe 2 a night or something. And as its been mentioned, leave the midgets to race on smaller tracks until the base of cars is built back up. Big HP to go fast on big tracks means big $ and people will quit attending when they have no chance to compete. And I would suggest limiting the travel radius from Indy as well. No Phoenix or Irwindale races on the schedule. There are plenty of really nice race track in the midwest that would work nicely.
But, USAC will kill the pavement series before they'll do something proactive like that.

Almost everything you said here makes WAY too much sense to ever be discussed on a midget racing forum! LOL. I just can't understand why my local "NASCAR" track has such tire limits, but the only place I am aware of such a rule in OW cars is at Ft Wayne...

Just announced 3 dates in PA.August 18-20 Lincoln,Path Valley,Susquehanna.Should be good fields with strong ARDC support.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by wolfpack58:
Just announced 3 dates in PA.August 18-20 Lincoln,Path Valley,Susquehanna.Should be good fields with strong ARDC support.

Were did you see this? That's a Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

LPS's Midget week dates is on, so they're panning on at least having that.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester:
LPS's Midget week dates is on, so they're panning on at least having that.

Bloomington also has it on their Schedule the following night after LPS.

davidm I saw it on twitter courtesy of @livedirtupdates.Also on Facebook at Pennslyvania sprint car photos.

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ok I came up with a theory. a lot of you might think this is crazy. here it is. combine races. say for instance the action track. if you have sprints racing maybe bring in the silver crown cars for a fifty lapper or the midgets. start combining more races. like for instance during midget week the local tracks host sprint cars! BAM right there involve sprint week. I believe if usac would do that it will draw more sponsors more teams which means more cars and some damn good racing. now the tire issue I have to say make it an open tire. run what you bring just like they did back in the day. I understand that hoosier tire has been around for many many years, but its time for a change. I hate to say but usac is dying. I believe if a lot of the race teams got together and set down with usac and bring back pavement racing, the series can rebuild its self. its obvious they have a few bugs to work out. but only time will tell. I know a lot of people don't care much for the pavement racing and that's your choice but it has been a part of the series since I can remember. I have grown up watching races at orp Anderson mt lawn salem Winchester. its also good racing too. so I think usac needs to sit down with the drivers and owners and see what type of plans they can come up with to rebuild the three divisions.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Obviously I haven't been around the sport a long time..but even when Gas City got their first Usac race..the local support was amazing..had around 42 cars for that..then the next year had an Indiana Sprint week race and there was around 55-60 cars with weather around all day. The locals used to show up in droves when usac came into the local tracks..thats just not there anymore. Sure you still get a handful or so of locals but Usac needs to find out how to get cars back. Still going to the shows you know the racing is going to be awesome..but the midget shows you don't get a stellar car count unless its co sanctioned with Powri, or its midget week.

Tk

Midget wars 2015

Re: usac nat midgets
 

I'd like to see USAC work with POWRi or vice versa in order to get an event(s) together like the Kokomo Grand Prix last year. They had something like 45 cars both nights at Kokomo which was more than any one night of Indiana Midget Week. That would help get more fans out to see them, more attention to the track(s) and midget racing as a whole.

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Didn't they use some sort of rivalry deal at the Hoosier Dome to get the crowd to be enthused and to get them to brave that usually God forbidding cold weather to watch a race? You could freeze to death walking from your parking spot to the Dome. Nothing like a rivalry between drivers or teams to add to the hype when advertising a race.

Seems to me like one year "Old Smoke" was supposed to parachute out of an airplane and land in the infield to race. ;):5:

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by DAD:
Didn't they use some sort of rivalry deal at the Hoosier Dome to get the crowd to be enthused and to get them to brave that usually God forbidding cold weather to watch a race? You could freeze to death walking from your parking spot to the Dome. Nothing like a rivalry between drivers or teams to add to the hype when advertising a race.

Seems to me like one year "Old Smoke" was supposed to parachute out of an airplane and land in the infield to race. ;):5:

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

They had Team USA vs Team Indiana in the Hoosier Dome. Twelve cars represented each team.

Isaac's INDIANA tribute car for CB.

Check it out on Twitter@isaacchapple52 and Facebook, Isaac Chapple Racing.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Nate:
I'd like to see USAC work with POWRi or vice versa in order to get an event(s) together like the Kokomo Grand Prix last year. They had something like 45 cars both nights at Kokomo which was more than any one night of Indiana Midget Week. That would help get more fans out to see them, more attention to the track(s) and midget racing as a whole.

From my view,the Indiana fans like midget racing as long as there are sprint cars on the same card. No sprint cars, not to many fans.

There were plenty of midgets last year at the Kokomo Gran Prix. It was early in the season so no conflicting races with anyplace else, but not a good crowd at all. I wish they would have it again, but I don't blame them for not scheduling it either.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Andrew S. Quinn:
From my view,the Indiana fans like midget racing as long as there are sprint cars on the same card. No sprint cars, not to many fans.

There were plenty of midgets last year at the Kokomo Grand Prix. It was early in the season so no conflicting races with anyplace else, but not a good crowd at all. I wish they would have it again, but I don't blame them for not scheduling it either.

I 100% agree, but an event(s) such as the Kokomo GP last season that is co-sanctioned would still draw more cars and fans than a POWRi or USAC event by themselves. The Kokomo GP in 2014 drew 10-15 more cars each night than the Turkey Night GP and far more than Belleville and both only had so-so crowds at those two events as well.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

If guys could run their dirt cars on pavement maybe you could rebuild the pavement series but with needing two different cars I don't see it being viable. Not enough bucks to go around.

I miss the parity and fairness of NAMARS. Look at this partial press release from 14years ago.

" With an astonishing 18 different winners in NAMARS Championship Midget Car Series competition in 1999 including Baumgartner, Boice, Darland, Drake, Drinan, Elliot, Fisher, Flesher, Fuller, Gibson, Hatton, Herb, Hines, Klepper, Koch, Malone, Newman, and Welpott, a stout, competitive field is assured for the NAMARS Shoot-Out. These winners from the previous season are invited to participate in a special race to kick off the new season and give the fans great entertainment as the best drivers battle for top honors. The 12-lap Shoot-Out will pay over $3,000 in posted awards. "

Kokomo Grand Prix. Apr 10th-11th 2015.

Originally Posted by Hot Rod K.:
Kokomo Grand Prix. Apr 10th-11th 2015.

POWRi won't be there they have races that weekend.Won't be the car count we had last year....

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Glad I read through it before commenting.

Quinn is exactly right. We love midgets. The problem is, There hasn't been steady midget racing in indiana since 16th closed and Nammars folded. There hasn't been several shows at each track since the mid 70s. Honestly, If you don't follow them regularly, Your only going to know the sprint drivers who are driving midgets. Even if you do keep up. You haven't seen the stars much, How often in Indiana/OH do you see the Felkers and other Powri Guys running? Only if they hold a show and only if that show gets run (Weather)

What Im saying is, Scheduling a midget show and expecting both good car count and fan count is at minimal A RISKY move in areas that don't have it regularly.
Each track has a core group of fans probably 40% each for their top two classes and maybe 20% mostly family and friends for the third class.

Myself I don't usually go without the Sprints, Midgets have become a crap shoot anymore. One show will have 40 plus, the next 14. Midget weeks have been great, Sprints are on the card and I can't blame a track for bringing its second class in on it as well. Thats a quarter of the fans!, Sprints are a quarter of the fans and Midget week followers half.

Same goes for LM's unless your a normal LM track, You show up and your lucky to know who a quarter of the cars are. I used to know em all because they raced weekly at my local track and a couple bigger shows a year brought in the stars from elsewhere. In reality Mods have taken the place of LM's in Indiana except maybe brownstown and they are getting cost prohibitive as well.

I don't know what to do with the cost of Midget racing, Some say the small tracks are the answer, I say a compression limit. You need to be able to have motors last 20-30 races between overhauls and not go bang a couple times a year. They could race the bigger tracks with that model as well.

I think Montpelier has a good start, If someone would pick up and set a series schedule with maybe two Montpelier and one or two other IN/Western Ohio tracks per month such as what Nammars did, I think it could grow.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester:
Glad I read through it before commenting.

Quinn is exactly right. We love midgets. The problem is, There hasn't been steady midget racing in indiana since 16th closed and Nammars folded. There hasn't been several shows at each track since the mid 70s. Honestly, If you don't follow them regularly, Your only going to know the sprint drivers who are driving midgets. Even if you do keep up. You haven't seen the stars much, How often in Indiana/OH do you see the Felkers and other Powri Guys running? Only if they hold a show and only if that show gets run (Weather)

What Im saying is, Scheduling a midget show and expecting both good car count and fan count is at minimal A RISKY move in areas that don't have it regularly.
Each track has a core group of fans probably 40% each for their top two classes and maybe 20% mostly family and friends for the third class.

Myself I don't usually go without the Sprints, Midgets have become a crap shoot anymore. One show will have 40 plus, the next 14. Midget weeks have been great, Sprints are on the card and I can't blame a track for bringing its second class in on it as well. Thats a quarter of the fans!, Sprints are a quarter of the fans and Midget week followers half.

Same goes for LM's unless your a normal LM track, You show up and your lucky to know who a quarter of the cars are. I used to know em all because they raced weekly at my local track and a couple bigger shows a year brought in the stars from elsewhere. In reality Mods have taken the place of LM's in Indiana except maybe brownstown and they are getting cost prohibitive as well.

I don't know what to do with the cost of Midget racing, Some say the small tracks are the answer, I say a compression limit. You need to be able to have motors last 20-30 races between overhauls and not go bang a couple times a year. They could race the bigger tracks with that model as well.

I think Montpelier has a good start, If someone would pick up and set a series schedule with maybe two Montpelier and one or two other IN/Western Ohio tracks per month such as what Nammars did, I think it could grow.

We may have been headed that direction last season with Gas City scheduled for around 10 Fridays and Montpelier 10 Saturdays Charles, but we all know how GC turned out. Car counts weren't stellar the 2 or 3 nights GC ran Midgets but I think if it hadn't been shuttered we may have gained traction, although weather played havoc with MMS' schedule as well.

Not that it's an answer for the "National" Midget dilemma, except to build a driver-fan base.

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester:
Glad I read through it before commenting.

Quinn is exactly right. We love midgets. The problem is, There hasn't been steady midget racing in indiana since 16th closed and Nammars folded. There hasn't been several shows at each track since the mid 70s. Honestly, If you don't follow them regularly, Your only going to know the sprint drivers who are driving midgets. Even if you do keep up. You haven't seen the stars much, How often in Indiana/OH do you see the Felkers and other Powri Guys running? Only if they hold a show and only if that show gets run (Weather)

What Im saying is, Scheduling a midget show and expecting both good car count and fan count is at minimal A RISKY move in areas that don't have it regularly.
Each track has a core group of fans probably 40% each for their top two classes and maybe 20% mostly family and friends for the third class.

Myself I don't usually go without the Sprints, Midgets have become a crap shoot anymore. One show will have 40 plus, the next 14. Midget weeks have been great, Sprints are on the card and I can't blame a track for bringing its second class in on it as well. Thats a quarter of the fans!, Sprints are a quarter of the fans and Midget week followers half.

Same goes for LM's unless your a normal LM track, You show up and your lucky to know who a quarter of the cars are. I used to know em all because they raced weekly at my local track and a couple bigger shows a year brought in the stars from elsewhere. In reality Mods have taken the place of LM's in Indiana except maybe brownstown and they are getting cost prohibitive as well.

I don't know what to do with the cost of Midget racing, Some say the small tracks are the answer, I say a compression limit. You need to be able to have motors last 20-30 races between overhauls and not go bang a couple times a year. They could race the bigger tracks with that model as well.

I think Montpelier has a good start, If someone would pick up and set a series schedule with maybe two Montpelier and one or two other IN/Western Ohio tracks per month such as what Nammars did, I think it could grow.

Charles

The resurgence of Midget Racing is all in your head. Head design that is. Guys keep getting more and more horsepower out of these little old antique boat anchors by putting bigger and bigger valves in their heads to the point that they had to make a bigger bore (increase bore spacing) to get even larger valve in them. The only problem is as these valves grow their mass grows also even when made out of un-obtanium they require very stiff valve springs to keep them in time with the camshaft and away from the piston.

There are some 2.5 liter through 3.5 liter motors out their right now that could fill the requirements of midget racing. The only problem is manufactures have moved on from the ancient 2 valve heads to 4 valve heads. The paranoid racers and ruling bodies have placed unfair limitations on them I guess out of fear of the future. That little Echotec is one example. The head on that thing won't win any awards for design but it is light years ahead of a stock Pinto head. The little v6 Ford Duratec has a head that could produce exceptional air flow with just a little massaging on a stock head casting.

It still won't be cheap but at least a few more "sane and prudent" owners might stay in the game of Midget Racing.

Honest Dad himself:6::6::6:

Re: usac nat midgets
 

Originally Posted by jjones752:
We may have been headed that direction last season with Gas City scheduled for around 10 Fridays and Montpelier 10 Saturdays Charles, but we all know how GC turned out. Car counts weren't stellar the 2 or 3 nights GC ran Midgets but I think if it hadn't been shuttered we may have gained traction

Gas City had 19 midgets (w/ Montpelier running the next night) when I was there the last week in July, and it rained all the way up I-69. For late in the first year of the experiment I hardly believe that car count disappointed anybody.