USAC tire rule
 

I heard a rumor tonight that USAC was going to the ASCS tire on the sprintcars. Has anyone else heard this? I sure hope this isn't true I hate that tire!

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Be best to find out throught he www.usacracing.com website, It's there in PDF form somewhere.

Straight from the Rulebook. If they are changing, I'd call USAC
NOTE IT SAYS 2013 RULEBOOK

SPRINT CAR SERIES
2013 Rule Book
4
313
Tires
A.
Hoosier HT2, HTW (same as HT2), hard F55 and DT3 are the only approved Right rear tires; LR, RF and LF are open.
The HTW is a west coast tire that is identical to HT2
B.
Any solvents or chemicals applied in any way to a tire that alter the chemical makeup of the compound or have the
effect of altering tire durometer or construction is prohibited. Any tire can be confiscated at any time. Tire found to
deviate from the original factory specifications, the maximum penalty is a one year suspension from competition and
loss of all points earned for the season

Re: USAC tire rule
 

i been told it is the 105/16 hoosier medium.
this rule is nationwide i been told.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

what local tracks here are going to apply this rule to thier weekly show is the question? ..Really gonna be a punch to the wallets of local racers.....:15:

Re: USAC tire rule
 

they don't care about our wallets,they only care about their wallets.

How is that going to hurt their wallets exactly?

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I have the same question? If your track/series is a mandatory Hoosier series all that is changing is compound you buy....far as I know the price is the same for all RR tires. The only time a team would be out money is if they already have a huge stockpile of tires for the upcoming season. I doubt most teams do, I know we don't.

Everyone understands just because this new tire is a 16" that does not mean you have to buy all new right rear wheels? You can mount them on a 17" or 18" wheel they will just roll out a little smaller. Should not cost anyone anymore money. If you run used tires get ahold of some USAC teams the season starts in February that should get some supply of used ones on the market.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Guess i was the only one who seen the picture of RR's after Bubba Raceway Park.

there was nothing left to use LOL

Re: USAC tire rule
 

So if one side rolls out a little smaller as you say how are you going to get the stagger you want and or need without changing something??

We do have tires we planned on using to start the season at our local tracks, if they do not go with these rules we should be ok as we only run a handfull of U.S.A.C. shows.

It is my opinion that this is going to cost racers money one way or another it is also my opinion that rules are not there to help low budget teams, just my opinion and as I have been told before what do I know.

Jerry

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Yes you can run them on any rim including 8in rims. They will not work right on any of them but for all you low budget teams like me sorry.

Run smaller left rears? Wheels are expensive and that's why I said you could run them on the wider wheels. The little guys are always going to be at a disadvantage and that's just the way it will always be but everyone will find a way to race. Tires are not cheap but I can't see someone having a whole stock pile of ht2's or dt3's that they can't sell and this would be the reason they can't race. Good news is though if this tire rule is true and some tracks still allow the ht2 the local teams should be able to get a discount on new ones now.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I would prefer a durometer rule, other wise tire must be round & black:10:. Buddy I crewed for used to get his tires for a season for what 1 "Spec" tire cost now, so he no longer races. Got tired of rules changing every yr it seemed:15:. Keep it up & racings gonna be as exciting as walking into a room & flip'n a switch. To me tires are killing this sport. Need one that last, 1 tire per race on RR from qualifying to feature.:6: What's your thoughts:16

Sorry in my opinion if you have 18 inch wheels and they make you run 16 inch tires you need to buy wheels. Sidewalls play a factor and you change that putting a 16 on an 18

For what it's worth they switched us from 18" Goodyears to the 16" Hoosiers with our wing car last year. I had the same concerns and was pissed I had to buy wheels. I went to FL last year with 3 18" wheels a 17" and an 16". I tryed both the 18" and 17" and never even had to try the 16". We use the 18" 90% of the times, it just didn't seem to much difference. Also they measured up about the same. A 109" chalk mark came up at 106" with the old 18" wide Sc12 and now a 109" chalk mark with the new 16" tire is still 106". I guess what trying to say is don't go buy a bunch of wheels or get discouraged till you run a few races.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Ding,Ding,Ding we have a winner now I have to buy smaller left rears.

Jerry

Re: USAC tire rule
 

:8::8::8::8: :6:

Re: USAC tire rule
 

If guys find that they don't work as well on an 18" wheel, there are solutions besides buying all new wheels. Swap the outer third from a 4 off onto your 3 off and now you have a 17x3. 5 off onto the 4 off and 6 off onto your 5. Sorry but you would have to buy a new outer third, or complete 6 off wheel. Good thing the wing guys run a lot of 6 off RR's and they are available used.

I see a lot of teams running wheels that should probably be replaced or at least have new centers. I had three cracked centers over the course of last year and our wheels were not that old. Fortunate to catch them during my weekly inspection and not after they had caused a crash.

Like any other change, this will take some experimenting and a little creativity to get the most out of what we have to work with.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Gary has a good point as I see many more than usual wheel centers breaking last year. Im not a mechanic or even on a team but I know stress fractures don't get any better. Check em close and check em often.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

As a fan who pays $$$ to watch our sport, I have been following this thread. Let me see if I have this right:

If USAC goes to a spec 16" RR tire in 2014, why are they doing that? To cut costs for their competitors? The spec tire, bought in abundance, will lower the price for all? And, in theory, it will level the playing field and probably be easier to police in the tech inspection. Sounds like a good idea. Especially if you only ran USAC events.

BUT, the tracks in and around the area with a weekly sprint show have a more lenient RR tire rule, wherein a 17" or 18" RR tire would be a better ticket than a smaller 16" RR tire. So, all teams with 16" RR tires would use them only in the USAC sanctioned races.

If most teams have been running the larger tires, if USAC changes their tire rule for 2014, to run USAC races they would now need to stock up on 16" wheels. The subject of the debate is the cost of the wheels moreso than the cost of the 16" spec tires?

What is the average price of a top shelf wheel and just for my own notes, how many RR wheels did you guys go through this past season, Jerry? You guys ran weekly this past year. Anyone else who also runs weekly, please chime in for that matter. I am just trying to get my head around how much you guys spend on that one specific item annually - RR wheels.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Weekly tracks were involved in this decision. At least three of them are the ones who got this ball rolling. Can't imagine all Indiana tracks not going with the same tire rule to keep things consistent. Paragon being the exception because they are an open tire track. This new tire is a little harder than an HT2 so it should hold edges better and be able to run a few times. It is also not a cambered tire so it can be flipped, according to the Hoosier rep I spoke to at PRI. Maybe with a narrower and harder tire the tracks won't seal over and rubber up. Trying to look on the bright side of this change. There will be positives to come out of it!

Re: USAC tire rule
 

This should answer anyone's questions IMO.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

You know we bought our first new right rear wheel this year since Josh started in a sprint car, I had a page and a half typed out on what I thought about the tire rule, then I thought I busted my a^% today at work for people that could care less about me our my family then I thought U.S.A.C. could care less weather we sign in or not so why waste my time making people mad.

When we park the #66 I will tell you this I will never walk past another gate at a race track because I am sick of the ******** that goes with racing.

Sorry if I offended anybody and by the way we trashed the new wheel on june 16th at Kokomo.

Open the rules and let the people that have money spend it, let the people like us that do not catch up a little at a time just stop changing the rules so that everything we have worked hard to catch up with is no longer any good.

I also know we will more than likely stay home for the local U.S.A.C. shows and watch tv, Sprint week and the Smackdown will be a few days off to ride or relax and who knows we might just get used to it.

And just so you know I have not had a drop to drink

Jerry

Buy a cheap midget, u can rent it out at the bowl and buy all the Sprint tires ul need

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I love BW3 Wild Wings, last time I went it cost me $58 for 2 people, 3 beers, 12 wings, 1 sandwich, 2 fries..... That was a year ago... I can afford it, but, there comes a time when if customers do not respond, then they will continue to take advantage of you! Everybody stay home till someone looks after their customers or they will continue to stick it in you!!!! Last night I went to Wing n it , had same meal for $33! And yes, I have been drinking since noon!

Re: USAC tire rule
 

The cambered tire can be flipped and ran I've done it and won with it. Also we run on dryslick tracks and the HT2 holds up fine we have gotten 3-4 nights out of them easy. We even ran USAC take offs last year and they lasted a few night apiece easy.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

And be part of the problem, no thanks

Jerry

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I dont consider myself part of the problem, im doing what i gotta do to make it work, i dont see the world of motorsports changing because i want it too unfortunately thanks.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Drinking? Yes
Confused? Yes

Nobody has responded to Tracy Hines' question yet.

I thought that whole point of a 'tire rule' was to prevent the 'little guy' from complaining about the 'big guys' going out with brand new soft tires every time on the track except for the feature (maybe). I sorta think that the tire rule thing levels the playing field at least a little bit. On pavement, we are restricted to how many we may purchase. What if that migrates to the dirt? I once heard Phil Poor say, about tires, that the best deal, is no deal. I am almost certain that he meant that from a competitor's standpoint. Meaning, that we should have the freedom to run whatever is fastest. So, while having choices is nice, it ain't necessarily cheaper. If we could, we'd burn through as many tires as we could. But maybe, just maybe, a compound rule helps a little. But just a little. :32::32:

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Not really the point in my opinion, the price of wheels. its the constant changes and all the stupid local tracks always following suit. Just open it back up locally to all goes. And you should see the car counts come back somewhat. Let USAC have their own stupid rules and let the locals do as they should. Build a sprint car, bring it and race it.
If locals are going to police tire's and next well you can't have this and that and this and that.
I'm tired of Hoosier controlling everything, OPEN it up and get it over with. Let the car counts try to come back. Locals is supposed to be open competition, not with this and that rule. You will see a USAC million dollar team show up and beat guys no matter what tire rule you have . Its just another way for Hoosier to make some more money, and USAC to get some extra with following along with what Hoosier wants. It would be different if they said well it will save you money. Here's a tire that will last 3 or 4 nites and only cost ya a 100 dollar bill but no it will not last that long and it sure won't be that cheap. All Gas City the Burg and Rutnumville and the others have to do is say hey enough is enough. USAC we'll race your rules and use what you want when your at our track but otherwise stay out of our business. And if Hoosier is going to continue to pay people off then I guess American Racer and Good Year better step up their game. JMO Sorry if you disagree with me. But I am really tired of the monopoly that has been taking place. this is America and we are not supposed to have monopoly's, even though we turn a blind eye all the time in other places does not mean the racing community has to follow suit. AGAIN JMO. JEFF

This is what I've learned from my time involved in racing...

Tire rules... People complain.
No tire rules... People complain.

It really doesn't matter what the rules are when people cant be satisfied by anything.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I am starting to catch on now. :6:

Great post. The other truth that I have learned is that the people that complain about rules to help the costs are the teams that the rules are trying to help the most.

I love this new rule for two reasons. This narrower, harder tire should unhook the cars somewhat and provide better racing. It should also help the lower budget teams stay more competitive once they get past the idea of having to buy a couple wheel halves they can probably find used for cheap. USAC could do one simple thing to curb the whiners by gaurunteeing the rule for a number of years, not just one!

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I think it was mentioned earlier, but this is the tire that basically every winged series in the country runs now, starting last year-ASCS has been on this tire for probably 5 or 6 years. When all the 410 series and all the other local winged 410 tracks signed with Hoosier, the universal stipulation was that it is to be a 5 year contract and the price is locked in @ $198 plus tax for each year.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

I would imagine there will be a grace period and hoping there is, as we still have a few extra HT2 tires. If not that's fine to, we are going to keep racing and doing the best we can. I know everyone thinks open tire rules saves money, but if you ever raced karts you know it does not. The biggest expense in kart racing is tires! You literally have 20 plus sets of wheels and tires just to compete. I will not complain either way. I just want to race!!!!!!

Re: USAC tire rule
 

Just my .02 from a winged Sprint crewchief. If you don't already have a tire grinder, you better invest in one. The ASCS medium has a tendency to seal over, on a winged car anyhow. Good tire otherwise. And yes we run them on a 18" wheel also.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

[QUOTE=nathan48moore;361495]I know everyone thinks open tire rules saves money, but if you ever raced karts you know it does not. The biggest expense in kart racing is tires! You literally have 20 plus sets of wheels and tires just to compete.QUOTE]

Ain't that the truth? That is the exact reason that I am selling all my karting stuff and leaving all that nonsense behind me.

Re: USAC tire rule
 

There is a locked in price on the tire for the first year but then there is always small print that allows a 3-5% increase per year due to raw material costs and before you know it in 5 years the tires are $220-$230 a piece. I know the majority of the ASCS tire distributors are well above $200 now going to be intersting to see if you see some of those guys come shopping in Indy to pick up tires when they are in the area if they are cheaper for the USAC teams. The ASCS tire is different then the 410 winged tires.

If anyone wants to sell any new leftover tires they can no longer run, private message me and I may take them off your hands.