Dumb Question about Indy
 

It's getting close to that time of the year again when every body's eyes starts to look to Indianapolis for the greatest spectacle in racing.

Would anybody besides me pay money to watch a bunch of front engined Roadsters or Champ cars race at the Old Speedway again. Things are always better in your memory, but I think it would be neat to watch a bunch of home grown racers racing back at 16th street again. One requirement would be the driver had to race at least 20 sprint and or champ races in the previous year. Can you imagine the sight of 33 front engine race cars with their drivers out in the wind going down that long front stretch at close to 200 mph. Us 1000cc racers call them upright racers no laying down with your feet way out in front. With the strides we have made in safety in the last few years it should be a doable deal.

If you have never seen these old cars at Indy, you sure don't know what you have missed. Like Phoenix to the tenth power. I just don't like watching these new slot cars race each other and I would bet there are a bunch of other people who don't either.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by DAD:
It's getting close to that time of the year again when every body's eyes starts to look to Indianapolis for the greatest spectacle in racing.

Would anybody besides me pay money to watch a bunch of front engined Roadsters or Champ cars race at the Old Speedway again. Things are always better in your memory, but I think it would be neat to watch a bunch of home grown racers racing back at 16th street again. One requirement would be the driver had to race at least 20 sprint and or champ races in the previous year. Can you imagine the sight of 33 front engine race cars with their drivers out in the wind going down that long front stretch at close to 200 mph. Us 1000cc racers call them upright racers no laying down with your feet way out in front. With the strides we have made in safety in the last few years it should be a doable deal.

If you have never seen these old cars at Indy, you sure don't know what you have missed. Like Phoenix to the tenth power. I just don't like watching these new slot cars race each other and I would bet there are a bunch of other people who don't either.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Might be fun to watch but those cars arent built to withstand a crash at the speeds they would be going there.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Stop being so serious John, since this is just a fantasy anyway, it will happen after the Speedway puts in the soft rubber walls, so instead of a crash they just bounce off and keep on going. My addition to this great idea is to make sure there are a few NOVI's in the field just to scare the kids. If they hold their ears for the Indy cars of today wait till they hear a NOVI. Thank God i got to see (& hear) them in their day. Maybe next year we can add NOVI power to the Chevy, Honda, and Lotus at the Speedway, bob:22:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by racefan20:
Might be fun to watch but those cars arent built to withstand a crash at the speeds they would be going there.

They did back in the day. Speed would not be a whole lot more than on the big tracks of today. It would just be on a bigger track. With all that wind you can just go so fast then you run out of horse power. You might say because of the configuration of the car it has it's own governor built in. About the slickest and fastest roadster belonged to guy named Jim Hurtubise it was powered by a cooler of Millers power plant. Sure did blow USAC's mind. It was plenty fast just not as fast as the lay down cars.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

With the "soft" walls, I doubt a crash would be as bad as it was back in the day, and, I have a feeling the drivers would have more respect for the cars they would be driving, rather than having a compound full of them. Bob!:)

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by HARFprez:
Stop being so serious John, since this is just a fantasy anyway, it will happen after the Speedway puts in the soft rubber walls, so instead of a crash they just bounce off and keep on going. My addition to this great idea is to make sure there are a few NOVI's in the field just to scare the kids. If they hold their ears for the Indy cars of today wait till they hear a NOVI. Thank God i got to see (& hear) them in their day. Maybe next year we can add NOVI power to the Chevy, Honda, and Lotus at the Speedway, bob:22:

You might not be able to see the Novi race car but you could sure follow it all the way around the race track and know where it was at any time. You could even tell when it blew up. Try that now. Now you need a TV. They could make a car sound like that again but the town of Speedway would probably give them a noise ticket.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

I wish everyone could be lucky enough to find "Ralphy the Racer" at Kellys Pub 2 some Monday night during DO's show and hear his story about blowing the bottom out of a Novi at the Speedway one year. I think he told me once that his ears are still ringing. One great idea someone had in the past few years was the Thunder Roadsters, i know they're more like legends cars underneath, but the look is still a classic, and we found out one night at IRP that they can go thru turn one 3 wide (and all 3 came out the other side fine). I'm afraid the roadsters are just a great memory for those of us old enough to have enjoyed them, and a classic thing to see on the throwback day at the Speedway. bob:31:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

I hope more people would go than attend sprint races. Plenty of empty seats at the races I went to last weekend. When we can sell out 3000 seats maybe we could sell out Indy.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by BrentTFunk:
I hope more people would go than attend sprint races. Plenty of empty seats at the races I went to last weekend. When we can sell out 3000 seats maybe we could sell out Indy.

When the rear engine cars came to Indy USAC started to loose their spot in the pecking order of things. It didn't require a driver of great skill to drive one of the new cars but he did need to be a driver with a great backing (MONEY). The guys with driving skills were no longer needed they just needed a guy who new a guy with a lot of money and had a good line of bull to go with it. It helped if he was too young to shave and available for the lady's.

Smoke was probably the last guy to make it on his skill and maybe just a little help of a rich guy that liked him. A race like this could be the savior of USAC. USAC does not have a top of the line series like it once had in the (Indy 500). When the cart thing started the USAC went down the tubes. I can remember going to watch AJ or Parnelli race just because they also ran the 500 mile race. When you get "Smoke" to race in one of your shows the crowd is just going to be bigger. True race people know the great drivers of today, but without the ultimate race the average Joe just never learns their names and does not build any intrest to see that driver race on the small bull rings.

This could be an all American deal and wouldn't cost an arm and a leg to do. It would also be a great way to spot light some of the tallent we got out there now and maybe keep some of them out of those danged Taxi cab things. It's a shame when a driver who started out to win the Indy 500 ends up going to NASCAR just because that is his only way up the ladder. It is a shame when car counts go down at local tracks because they can't come up with any big name driver to draw in a crowd.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

I was too young too see a Novi at the track but my Dad said you could be on the frontstretch with a car on the frontsretch and still hear the novi on the backstretch! I was in Novi Michigan a few years ago in a motel and they had a engine from a Indy car right in the convention center there..I never put the engine and the town in Michigan together till then...

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

"The guys with driving skills were no longer needed"

You mean a guy like Rick Mears had no "driving skills"? Gee, I thought he was pretty good.

This ship sailed years ago. Ain't coming back.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Although I would have loved to see the roadsters at Indy, I would say the glory years of the 500 were the 70's. That is when they added a lot of seats and the crowds were huge with new speed records every year. I was at Indy when Jack Hewitt, Steve Kinser, and Billy Boat ran. The crowds were bad. Like Vukie said That ship sailed years ago. Right or wrong its the way it is.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by BrentTFunk:
Although I would have loved to see the roadsters at Indy, I would say the glory years of the 500 were the 70's. That is when they added a lot of seats and the crowds were huge with new speed records every year. I was at Indy when Jack Hewitt, Steve Kinser, and Billy Boat ran. The crowds were bad. Like Vukie said That ship sailed years ago. Right or wrong its the way it is.

Like I said memory makes things seem better than they were . For you yonger guys that never saw the big cars race at Indy, before the drivers could all drive to the race track instead of having to sail on that old ship you keep talking about to get there. When they had short last names like Rose, Carter, Lagori, Volki (a little long so we shortened it), Foyt, Unser, Bryant, Jones . I forgot Tom Bigelow. You could go to Dayton, Winchester,Salem, Blomington, or any other little bullring in the midwest and watch these same guys pay their dues to get to that big race.

I can still see these guys coming out of turn 4 at Indy sitting straight up- right and fighting that big old race car just to keep it on the race track. They didn't have power stearing back then did they, they had a windshield too but they didn't do a lot of good either. It was worth the price of admision just to be able to watch a guy with sholders and arms work his craft to perection. I can't even see their helmets now and they could probably do a better job with a couple of joy sticks instead of a stearing wheel. They were the best of the best at the time and we could watch these same guys race on any weekend.

I think it would be great for you youngsters to watch the best of the best short trackers race in a race like this. It would still be a drivers race and one hell of a show.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

I'm 60, saw the Rex Mays Classic at Milwaukee in 1950's and 1960's, so I'm no youngster. I got the books, the Speed Age magazines and videos about the old days. The old days ain't coming back. Hell, the Silver Crown cars these days can't even sell out the Hoosier 100. Where are all of the fans?

Close to half of the drivers that raced the Indianapolis 500 back in the 1950's were killed racing. A point that is always forgotten in these discussions. Look forward or be left behind.

Modern Indy Cars don't have power steering.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

I’m just shy of 40 so I unfortunately didn’t get to see the 50’s, 60’s, and 70’s. I’m pretty sure I would have liked that timeframe more than today. I like today’s drivers just fine, I just don’t always like the racing arena they have to compete in. I wish guys could go drive anything they wanted, whenever they wanted to (Mario is a Hoosier 100 winner and a F1 World Champ…imagine that today). I also wish sponsorship wasn’t such a big deal. You’re not moving on to anything without it. I wish guys could just show up with their helmet and drive, best driver in the seat in all forms of racing. But, that’s not the way it is and it’s never going to be that way again. I love to read about history and think about what it would be like if… What I don’t understand is being so negative about how it is today. Is it what it is and it’s not going back. I wish half the 500 field was guys I watch Fridays, Saturdays, Sundays, but it’s not. I wish it was different on many levels, but it’s not. I still am interested and wouldn’t miss it.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by Vukie:
I'm 60, saw the Rex Mays Classic at Milwaukee in 1950's and 1960's, so I'm no youngster. I got the books, the Speed Age magazines and videos about the old days. The old days ain't coming back. Hell, the Silver Crown cars these days can't even sell out the Hoosier 100. Where are all of the fans?

Close to half of the drivers that raced the Indianapolis 500 back in the 1950's were killed racing. A point that is always forgotten in these discussions. Look forward or be left behind.

Modern Indy Cars don't have power steering.

You saw some real good racing back then, and I bet you loved it to. I can still remember going with my dad to see Vukie race, I think at Big Salem, he was truly great. Times were not all that great back then. But American racers did have something to shoot for. If we could have the Silver Crown cars driven by Indy 500 drivers (maybe NASCAR drivers would work better) it wouldn't be any problem to fill the grand stands. Back then drivers raced for another destination besides a NASCAR ride. They wanted a drive a Champ car or better yet an Indy ride. IN the 50's champ cars and Indy cars were the same thing, and a young fresh kid just was not going to get a ride in one. It was kinda of funny but they expected you to be twenty one years old to race one of them things back then. I guess that had something to do with the life expectency of a race driver back then. They did not know anything about "emancipation" back then sometimes they lied. Today daddy can go see a judge and put his teenager right in a silver crown car. Granted they are not as dangerous today as yesteryear but some people today might look at it as child abuse.

I guess what I'm saying is there is no place but NASCAR for a good open wheel driver to advance up the ladder today. I would say that most really good drivers today don't evet think about Indy anymore, and that is a shame.

Could ther be a new "CHAMP" car and could it be a destination onto itself today for open wheel drivers. I would guess there would not be many Indy drivers that could compete in this class. Left turns only, dirt and pavement racing. Make the rules so as to get only the best of the best and make it so money could not buy your way in no matter what.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

:deadhorse:

I've seen both types of cars run Indy, front engine roadsters & rear engine, and to be truthful I love them both.

But over the past 30 years, 1982-2011, we have seen more cars finish on the lead lap on average, 4 of the best finishes in Indy history (1982 Mears & Johncock, 1992 Al Unser Jr. & Scott Goodyear, 2006 Sam Hornish Jr. & Marco Andretti and 2011 JR and Dan Weldon).

You can't rewrite history, but if USAC bans rear engines cars in the mid 60's, or doesn't ban rear engine sprint cars in the 70's, maybe we would be seeing something different at 16th. & Georgetown.

Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Ryan Newman, Mike Bliss and all the other open wheel drivers that have gone on to run with the taxi cabs would be multi time starters or even multi time winners by now.

Re: Dumb Question about Indy
 

Originally Posted by Danny Williams Sr.:
:deadhorse:

I've seen both types of cars run Indy, front engine roadsters & rear engine, and to be truthful I love them both.

But over the past 30 years, 1982-2011, we have seen more cars finish on the lead lap on average, 4 of the best finishes in Indy history (1982 Mears & Johncock, 1992 Al Unser Jr. & Scott Goodyear, 2006 Sam Hornish Jr. & Marco Andretti and 2011 JR and Dan Weldon).

You can't rewrite history, but if USAC bans rear engines cars in the mid 60's, or doesn't ban rear engine sprint cars in the 70's, maybe we would be seeing something different at 16th. & Georgetown.

Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Ryan Newman, Mike Bliss and all the other open wheel drivers that have gone on to run with the taxi cabs would be multi time starters or even multi time winners by now.

Hell if they all run the same car and motor they should all finish together. We sure missed out on some good racing and it's not the fault of NASCAR.

I guess after the fiasco at Indy when USAC lost the Indy cars they did not do a very good job of protecting their "brand". All of a sudden their drivers did't have any place to advance to in their group anymore. Add this up with the rapid rise in the cost of building or buying an Indy car and all of a sudden the time of the small time race car owner was on that old boat sailing off into the sunset (he didn't miss it he got on it). We got run over by technology, wonder if that is why NASCAR held on to the carburetor for so long and is still holding on to the push rod motor?

The silver crown car is the last remaining bit of the "good old days" and the front engine Champ cars. What is USAC trying to do but kill it off, With new rules and regulations. It gets kinda of old watching people shoot themselves in the foot over and over again. Silver Crown is suppose to be the best of the best not the guinea pig. I think this time they will probably end up killing it.

Honest Dad himself:6::6: