Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

A few months ago my sprint car team ran a URC race in Georgetwon, Delaware. The track was rough and alot of equipment was tore up. Luckily no one was hurt. Last week there was another URC race at Georgetwon. Myself, My Driver, and entire team decided that the track surface was to bad to race on and we decided not to risk our equipment and bodily injury..........WE STAYED HOME. URC ran the race and alot of equipment was again torn up.

Racers are not 7 years old and hopefully all of them are capable of making a decision that serves their best interests. All the drivers said TH was not fit to race on......yet everyone of them lined up to race.

Why not forgo the points & big crash..........push your car into the trailer and go home in one safe piece.

Mez stated it was USAC's fault. Why didn't he not race? It is an option.

Point being.............if a track is unft or unsafe to race on, and you go out there and race, the fault is youirs not theirs. Driver / Owners need to make their own decisions and quit blaming others.

I'll bet there'd be alot of injured drivers today if USAC told all those guys to stick thier index finger into a pencil sharpener instead of lining up on a dangerous track.

NEVER LET PEOPLE DUMBER THAN YOU MAKE DECISIONS FOR YOU !!!

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

the fact remains that it should not have been that bad. If nothing else put all the water you can get on it and everything with wheels to iron it and see if you can bring it in. Seriously they were ironing with tractor and fertilizer truck.

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I don't know if I agree with everything in the post, but the last part is classic. It should me a mantra for all of us.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

The other factor is some of the drivers race for a living. Given that factor how many people would just walk out on their job? Then you would also have to throw in what if you lose the point championship for not racing that one race? Its really USACs fault for putting the drivers in this position.

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You can't race for a living if you're layed up in the crash house.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

First.........how can you race for a living if you allow yourself to be hurt ? I would think if one races for a living, he is able to determine the difference between calculated danger and stupidity.

Second.......it is USAC fault for carrying on with the race, but it is not their fault that the drivers made the decision to race in unsafe conditions.

It is the American way today not to accept responsibility for decisions we make but rather blame someone else for the decision we made.

Bottom line, Brass tacks.............if you CHOOSE to do something, it is not someone else's fault if there is an unhappy ending.

We can argue about this all week.........there is no right or wrong answer......just good common sense decision making.

If I owned a Silver Crown car, it would have been loaded up and not raced.....period. I stopped letting stupid people make decisions with my money a long time ago.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Gene; I agree whole heartedly that MANY in our country have the "It's not my fault, I'll blame someone else mentality". Apparently, some of those folks work for USAC. As proved by his earlier post, Tom Hansing is NOT one of them.

No doubt USAC gets hammered for a lot of things that aren't their fault, but IMO this dusty debacle rests on their shoulders.

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Gene, We've talked. I know you love sprint car racing and it's awesome you're helping a USAC team. What I find a lot of people don't get is that racers are special people. Not every driver was born to do this. All the money in the world might get a driver to the top, but they won't stay there for long without having a certain 'something'. There is a certain fear factor missing in some extremely talented drivers. I like to call these guys 'real racers' and they need sanctioning bodies who will keep the safety of all drivers as their NUMBER ONE goal. People keep asking me what my connection to racing is and why I'm so disturbed by the words 'profitability' and 'racing' in the same sentence, so here's the short version:
My father's uncle died at Bunker Hill dragstrip. My father decided to race sprint cars and was part of the original Indiana Sprint Week and several non-USAC wingless sprint shows in the late 70s and early 80s. My brother also ran at Bunker Hill like his great uncle. Outside of my family, I had the honor of helping to care for a legendary midget driver who now resides in a nursing facility, having had several head injuries. Throughout the years, I haven't met many drivers that didn't appear to have a screw loose (and I mean that in the most affectionate way), but that's what makes them what they are and they need protected from themselves at times.

I'm not one who goes to the shows for crashes. I go to see guys like Dave Darland take the young guys 'to school' like he did at Putnamville last Saturday night, for example. I go to feel the engines and the dirt - the sensory experience.

You acknowledged that I'm looking for a place in racing, but I think I already found it. If I'm the very last voice in the world that puts driver safety over money, then that will be my place. Nobody has to pay me to do it. Sprint car racing has already given me some of the best memories of my life, so I would work for free so other folks can walk away from the track with great memories, too. In fact, the sport needs a voice that has no financial interest. USAC used to be that voice. As you know, I am deeply concerned with USAC's decision to focus on the revenue from Monster trucks and snowmobiles. The Sunday fiasco is further evidence of USAC's neglect of the circle tracks and the drivers that built USAC racing. Everybody else can stay on the USAC bandwagon and throw insults at me for caring more about the drivers than the fans. My skin just keeps getting thicker.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

First, did USAC prepare the track ? If not, the track promoter should have pulled the plug, If so, USAC should have pulled the plug.......if neither party was smart enough to pull the plug........the racers should have gotten together to discuss it.......if none of the above took place......the decision now rests with each individual competitor if he or she is going to follow the fool into the dust bowl. My point is..........We all have choices. No one forces us to do anytihng we don't want to do.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

That's how I see this situation. I think USAC gets a lot of things laid at their feet that shouldn't be. In this case though, the whole deals falls on them IMO. I understand the point of putting the car in the trailer and heading down the road. A choice could have been made by all. T Mez said it, he should have done that, but the racer in those guys sometimes overrules.

In the end as others have said, it's one day. Move on or stay home I guess. I'll move on and go again.

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Tracks don't get prepared in one morning. Nobody had touched the track before the weekend. I don't know if they were out there Saturday or not. I don't know why calcium wasn't used. Everybody knew it was going to be dusty. If anyone could have predicted it was going to be that bad, USAC would not have listened to them anyway. I don't know who USAC is accountable to, but I hope they ask what steps were taken to prepare the track and make arrangements to prevent this from happening in the future.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Not sure I agree with you on this subject, but this place needs more people like you that will stand by their guns and not be swayed by the "mob." :6:

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

The drivers are not going to pull off. We had this discussion at my track when another driver made a poor decision not to pull off and got another driver hospitalized. Speaking as a driver myself, I can tell you that you cannot rely on drivers to make rational decisions when they are on the track. Their judgment is clouded by their adrenaline, their anxiety not knowing if their going to have a ride next week, finishing well enough to feed their kids, etc.

T-Mez stated that he knew he should have pulled off but chose not too. He accepted part of the blame for that, but in the end his decision was based on the fact that there are a lot more race car drivers than there are race cars. He was hired to do a job and he felt he had to do it. I hope that this experience has taught all the drivers, as well as USAC, a valuable lesson.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Last week, someone told me to go screw myself..........I guess if I was a real racer, I'd have a sore ass this week but I chose not to take this persons advise..........there its broken down real simple....we have choices. you said it........T-Mez said he should have not raced which leads me to believe the thought ran through his head.........and he made the wrong decision. no harm no foul.........racers need to think clearly and for themselves..........you should never trust anyone to look out for your best interests except yourself. The track wanted to have the race, USAC wanted to get the show in.........I doubt they gave any consideration at all to driver safety as they both were looking out for their own best interest............Attention Racers............no one will care more about your safety than you !!!! CHOOSE WISELY

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

e.p.a.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Here is something I find interesting.

I'm not saying this to start anything, just an observation, and this is something I really find interesting.

From everything that I've read (I wasn't there), it was dusty from the time the cars took the track, and the way the track was watered, it was going to be dusty for the 100 lapper.

All the drivers knowing that still belted in to go race.

But yet... a few years ago, at Union County Speedway, drivers weren't happy about a road grader 100 feet past the turn 2 wall, and every USAC driver pretty much loaded up and left everybody stranded before even firing a motor.

Why did they throw a fit about one thing and load up and leave, but not something in my opinion that is FAR FAR worse.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

A racer's decision to race can be a wrong one made for what are essentially almost all the right reasons. Almost. A sanctioning body's decision to self-promote an event (and thus accept responsibility for setting everything right in order to provide the best possible event experience and race) should be held to an even higher standard. If you choose to promote an event, and you aren't either prepared, capable or committed to making it the best event it can be--and the safest--then what did you take on that duty for? Just for the money? In order to box out a rival? Hubris? A whim?
I can accept, as many of the drivers have done since, that some responsibility for saying "No!" rests with them. And the car owners. But was there more than just the implied threat of losing ground in a points battle for refusing to race? I'm not saying that there was, but in a division that races as few times as Silver Crown, fewer yet on dirt, and fewer still on genuinely racy half-miles, does there even need to be? You want to win the points, you don't take a knee and give every other competitor who doesn't trailer his ride the upper hand. It would have been understandable (and preferable) if the whole field just said the show will have to wait until changes are made, but then we would be reading and listening to the same "Modern Day Spoiled Wimps"-posturing that was leveled at teams in the past for demanding safer conditions. And who would actually believe that the same folks who botched the track conditioning initially would quickly undo and satisfactorily redo what was already a mess?
We've seen on another thread that the flagman, in a move I simply have neither seen nor ever heard of before, has offered his apologies to every driver for not being the final arbiter and insisting on aborting the start until conditions were improved. Is there anyone among us who would have insisted, had he not offered that apology, that he deserved any blame? And heaven forbid that the drivers form a union, or union-like coalition in order to effect positive change. The hue and cry in this day and age would make national news.
I doubt it will take another wreck on the first lap for the drivers to say "No" next time. I'd expect that if there is another abomination of a racing surface forced upon them, not only will some of the more outspoken drivers refuse to push off, they will collectively resign from the event. And if a track is that bad again, under USAC's oversight, I'd certainly expect that the fallout for the organization will be lasting and will doom some persons in that brand-provider. USAC is nothing without the deeply-talented pool of exceptional regulars who deserve better than they are receiving.
I'll give the drivers one pass for not doing what in hindsight is obviously the right thing, and saying "I refuse", but I will NOT extend that pass to the entity that forced the conditions that those drivers should have balked at upon them.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Was this the first time they tried to do a day race since calcium was banned?

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The fact that T-Mez was willing to look into the camera and admit that he made a bad decision earned him a lot of respect in my book. :9:

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One other thing: In this modern world, is there no such thing as an affordable and environmentally-approved substance that can limit dust in a racetrack-type of application? Couldn't one of us with some farming know-how (rules me out) make a fortune introducing such a solution? I understand that the calcium chloride that helped numerous tracks in the past, has been banned, but in this age when toxins that can cause birth defects are routinely sprayed on food crops anyway, isn't somebody on the cusp of creating a soluble dust-deterrent?

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Best Silver Crown finish I ever saw. Daytime race, and it wasn't that long ago.

http://fscpictorial.smugmug.com/2010...11342522_dB3Uh

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Ain't gonna happen in a race car! That's why there are yellow and red and black flags - race car drivers hardly ever slow down or stop on their own, that's what makes these guys what they are. They are conditioned to focus on getting up front and staying there. Green means go. Especially in a Silver Crown race, who can be expected to NOT take the chance they did on Sunday? Any guy who wouldn't have taken that chance would never have made it to the Silver Crown in the first place. Hind sight is 20/20, but you can't blame a guy for racing. You CAN blame USAC for NOT listening to the right people on Sunday morning. They haven't been listening for years, and I'm concerned it's going to get uglier before it gets better.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Absolutely there is. Our oil partner is a chemist, and the creator of our oil, and some of the awesome things that are keeping our troops safe from chemical warfare, among many other things has told me before it's definitely possible, and if there was a market for it, he would do it in a heartbeat. He said he knows how to do it, and will not hurt the environment as well.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Useing Calcium is against the law now per EPA

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I just wonder about that, they sure use a lot in farming, but, what happened to using liquid soap, they used that after oil, and calcium were "banned"! Bob!:)

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

I have also heard of tracks useing dish water soap like dawn and the EPA stopped that too

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We used to use car wash soap, at a Fairgrounds track, had no problems! Bob! :)

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:6::8:Problem solved,on to Sprintweek.

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I do have farming knowledge, can't help with a dust deterrent but can clarify that "toxins" that cause birth defects are not used on crops. You think EPA would ban CaCl, a simple salt, and allow chemicals which cause birth defects to be used on food? Now back to the racing discussion...

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Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Man the calcium works so well, it was amazing how the moisture rises back up thru. The stuff we were thru as kids I'm surprised I'm still kickin. I was just telling my wife today how as kids we used to follow the mosquito fogging trucks as they went thru town. They threw of the coolest huge white smoke screen and nobody ever thought to tell us not to do it. probley still used ddt then too, lol. now days everything is dangerous. Lets make a deal they can keep the ddt, we just want our calcum back.

This quote fits so many places in life. I'm afraid racing is one of those places.
Posted via Mobile Device

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

I'm all for safety, but there will always be danger in racing. I've lost a couple close friends on the race track, but lets not ruin one of the last good racing sports by letting nothing but safety dictate what and how we race. Nothing kills me more then someone complaining that racing without a wing is dangerous "because you dont have the wing to cushion a flip" next time someone says it to me they better be wearing their wings. I honestly wouldnt want to race a completely safe vehicle, wheres the fun in that when theirs not that feeling of being right on the edge of disaster. You real racers (and fans of racing) out there know exactly what I mean and the rest of you would never get it anyhow.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

I have no idea but I would suspect that Tom Helfrich or Reece O'Connor would have an answer.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Here ya go. Water works for me but track prep needs to know how to use it but here are some alternatives

http://www.snisolutions.com/?id=products&cid=6

http://www.arenadust.com/?gclid=CIiV...FRHGKgodqzzPZg

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

Well actually, I believe it was a USAC sprint week show last year at THAT, which was redone completely at like 5-6pm..and racing didn't even get started (heat races mind you) until almost 9pm (if my memory is correct). The night was worth it though..too bad they couldn't have had the sense to do this sunday, especially with it being a day show and Kokomo seemed to have a small car count anyway. I hope ISW goes better at THAT..sure is a great track.


Great post again Gene. It makes me think of Damion Gardner? that left Kokomo the other sunday because of no hot laps..much more odd circumstances though considering the track was safe..owell.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

I'm sure everyone on this board plus most who were in the stands have an after the fact opinion on what happened and what should have happened. What would really be sad is to let this situation go by without taking a lesson from it and taking action to prevent similar future fiascos . I've never been a fan of group decisions, but perhaps USAC should form an advisory board of officials and participants (drivers and owners) to make recommendations before they elevate to the seriousness of Sunday's mess. Maybe they already have this or maybe USAC sought participant opinions before the start and just arrived at a bad decision. However, if it was solely USAC's decision, the participants certainly had adequate time to protest and/or withdraw. I was there and sat through the 7 or so hours of preliminary stuff but like many others I was never convinced that there would be a 100 lap race. We can complain and whine and blame whoever we want, but if we, USAC, and the participants learn nothing from it and take no corrective action, history is bound to repeat. If something good comes from this, regardless of what happened in the past, I'm willing to give everyone a pass and thank God that no serious injuries resulted.

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http://redgreenandblue.org/2011/06/0...birth-defects/
This begs to differ. I believe the EPA is being gutted of its moral authority from within...but we digress.
"TrackMoist" sounds phenomenal.

Re: Terre Haute Blame is Misplaced
 

"It's the racers fault" ........... righhhhhhhhhhhht

"USAC needs more boards" ......... righhhhhhhhhhhht

anybody else notice how's Gene's command of the keyboard improved once this thread caught traction?