OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Please don't shoot the messenger:8: but I was just wondering. Nobody commented on this yet that I noticed. Yesterday, Father's Day I noticed that The Lucas Oil Late Model series was on CBS of all things. I was happy to see dirt racing on network television and I thought the broadcast was great, but I wondered how did they accomplish this feat? I really don't want to start a big war more just how did they do it and why can't sprints do the same. Did anyone else see this? What's the deal? Those tin-tops are kicking our butts when it comes to popularity, payouts and crowd sizes.:34:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I have seen some of their shows on TV and they are normally an hour program that is a tape delay telecast on Versus, Speed or Mav TV (whatever that is?). I noticed on their schedule that this race was from Lucas Oil Speedway in Wheatland, MO from Memorial Day weekend.

What I have seen has been really good production and they normally show only parts of the race not the entire feature. This series is one of the top, if not the top late model series in the country. How they made this to CBS is beyond me.

Were you able to watch it? Give us a little insight into what your thoughts were. I know I will get slammed for asking, but I still enjoy the tin tops once in a while.:3:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

It's all that room on the hood and down the sides for sponsors...

I unfortunately missed it, as I was out for dinner with my family. I'll post if I see it is being replayed. I am fairly certain that Lucas Oil has their own studio to produce this race and the race was at Lucas Oil Speedway.

I read a few comments on facebook about it trying to hard to one up Nascar. I'd like to hear what anyone who watched it thinks.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

wasn't bad, they spent alot of time highlighting Steve Casebolt who comes from near me, in fact the only reason I knew about it was the big county seat sunday paper had an article about Steve/show. Is the first time they have shown LM's on a network channel and I would say they'll do it again. Too bad they don't show sprints like they use to way back when on ABC's Wide World of Sports.... of course back then you had to wait for them to show they 15 mins somewhere between ping pong and surfing.....

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I did watch it, actually I knew that I would be spending the day at my old man's house and they don't do cable or satellite so it was kinda perfect for me my brother and I kinda planned to watch it with Dad. I'm one of those who enjoy all forms of racing so I thought it was good coverage, they only showed the feature and not how someone would make it too the feature. It was similar to nascar coverage, driver interviews pre and post race even had aerial coverage. The racing was good too Jimmy Owens won it and they showed some of the shops the drivers raced out of and everything. They had a cut away car and walked your through the mechanics kind of to show what was underneath the cars such as suspension, shocks things like that.

Pretty informative for the casual fan I thought, they talked about Bloomer, showed the viewer Jimmy Owens old shop when he ran modifieds and then his new shop. It was good I thought. I really was just in Shock that it was on CBS and you can't see sprints hardly at all let alone something like that.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I watched the broadcast.

- The track was dust free (and I was very fearful of showing a dusty track on National TV)
- Everything was right to the point (no hour long prerace show, thankfully)
- They really promoted the drivers. I expected to see LUCAS, LUCAS, LUCAS, but did not, they really focused on the drivers by plugging the nick names (ie. "Real Deal" Don O'neal), doing brief interviews with the drivers showing their shops & family, and the sponsors.
- In victory lane the winner says "NASCAR ain't got nothin' on this!"

Overall a very good positive portrayal of dirt racing. Only thing I can think of that they really needed to do for the layman race fan tuning into dirt racing for the first time was explain how the drivers got into the show (heats, B's, etc), but I think this was left out due to time constraints.

On a technical side of the broadcast,
Wish they would have worked on the ambient sounds more. You really couldn't crank up the volume and hear the cars without getting your ears blown out by the announcers (and that's a pretty petty complaint to have IMO).

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

It was a pretty good race, actually. But, most of the super late model races I've seen, have been. It came down to Bloomquist getting a chance to make a run at Owens, on the last turn of the last lap. Only to come up short. They did a real good job of profiling some of the drivers and even interviewed Tyler Reddick, who Bloomington fans remember running a sprinter down there, a couple of years ago. Even though he's only 15 now!! This was just another example Forrest Lucas putting big bucks into racing.

Jerry

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Watched parts of it while flipping back and forth to the Indy race at Milwaukee.

From what I saw, they had super quality production values, great camera work of the race, and very interesting "behind the scenes,getting to know the drivers", feature reports.

Track and surroundings were striking on camera.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Dealing with the Lucas Oil Late Models Series myself, i have got to say, they have thier act together, very professional!! when they come to Lawrenceburg they are very serious about what they do. Our show at Lawrenceburg is on tv also, but on the SPEED Channel. They are the real deal, and a pleasure to work with. :6:

---------- Post added at 09:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:45 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Dave Rudisell:
Dealing with the Lucas Oil Late Models Series myself, i have got to say, they have thier act together, very professional!! when they come to Lawrenceburg they are very serious about what they do. Our show at Lawrenceburg is on tv also, but on the SPEED Channel. They are the real deal, and a pleasure to work with. :6:

The best part is seeing Dave Argabright!! (sp):8:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Is it really just because there is more room on the car to advertise? Is it that Mr. Lucas just favors that brand of racing more so he invests more money with them to get them exposure? Is the Lucas Oil Series any more 'professional' than USAC? It's just puzzling as to why I see more late model action televised vs. sprints. I've seen quite a few LM races on the tube and I believe a few WOO wing shows, but non-wing's...rarely. Seems to me all I hear about non-wings on TV was 'back in the day'. I know one thing my family discussed was the fact that they said in the broadcast most of their drivers have been running for almost 20 year's and they appear to have more older drivers vs. young

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

There was one major flaw

No Gus Johnson :(

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by Dave Rudisell:
The best part is seeing Dave Argabright!! (sp):8:

No way, Dave...you didn't even notice I was there, you were far more fascinated with the Rockstar girls in Victory Lane! :2:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I was really surprised that ABC didn't broadcast the Milwaukee race in high definition. They broadcast the 500 in high def and there certainly is a world of difference. VERSUS broadcasts in high def and theirs seems to be superior to some others.
I didn't really notice the late models being shown or I would have watched.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by Dave Argabright:
No way, Dave...you didn't even notice I was there, you were far more fascinated with the Rockstar girls in Victory Lane! :2:

Your are right Dave, Busted me, i did notice you on the TV broadcast though!!:2:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by OpenwheelRob:
Is it really just because there is more room on the car to advertise? Is it that Mr. Lucas just favors that brand of racing more so he invests more money with them to get them exposure? Is the Lucas Oil Series any more 'professional' than USAC? It's just puzzling as to why I see more late model action televised vs. sprints. I've seen quite a few LM races on the tube and I believe a few WOO wing shows, but non-wing's...rarely. Seems to me all I hear about non-wings on TV was 'back in the day'. I know one thing my family discussed was the fact that they said in the broadcast most of their drivers have been running for almost 20 year's and they appear to have more older drivers vs. young

I'm half serious on the "more room on the car". Doesn't Morgan Lucas race Top Fuel, and according to my logic he should be running Funny Car.

But you bring up a good point. A few years ago all of TSR's USAC teams had near identical car numbers and paint schemes when they ran two cars in each USAC division. To me thats a rarity in traditional open wheel. If you look at many of the LM racers who have just moved up from mods (Mike Spatola, Kent Robinson) they keep near identical paint schemes with the same number. I notice on here we need driver roster lists to keep up with what car any open wheel racer is in. To me thats not building brand loyalty. Sure my last sentence may sound dumb, but I would expect most of you who are on this board know what number and nickname Scott Bloomquist, Donnie Moran, Billy Moyer, Rick Eckert, Josh Richards or Jimmy Owens have.

Sure we (on this board) all know who the Deputy, the Madman, Modern Day Cowboy, Jerry Cooooooons Jr are. But Rick Eshelmann sp? (World of Outlaws late model announcer) has a name for every driver out there. I would love to see USAC on tv. I'm not placing an emphasis on catchy nicknames over quality racing. DLM do have several "crown jewels", which have quite a history and following all over the country.

I know an announcer isn't going to carry a whole series. I clam up and stammer whenever I get interviewed at my hometrack in front of a couple hundred farmers so I know I couldn't do a better job.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

While watching we debated the differences, familiarity was one thing like you mention. Then the whole it's a car vs. a dune buggy thing and people can identify with it. On one hand I like that there seems to be consistency with the same driver in the same car (which they mentioned on the broadcast $75,000 per car) which would build a 'Brand' but I also like the opportunities open wheels seem to have with drivers switching more often.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Was watching the late models on one set and the IRL on the other set side by side since the trip to the preferred race at Haubstadt was rained out.Nice to see Dave Argabright reporting on tv always does a standout job and they also had Rob Klepper doing the announcing also.Always great to see some dirt racing with tv coverage,looks like a great facility and also the drag strip lake they had built for boat racing right next to it hopefully one day they will make it to tv to.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I thought that it was a great broadcast and of a style that would work for open wheel racing. I prefer that kind of show to the "reality" type show like Dirt Knights.

On a side note, it was great to see local Houston area driver Chris Brown with a good run. He is a friend and a great competitor.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Lucas Oil has their own production company. They do several different types of racing that is sponsored by Lucas oil. They are kind of like a throwback to the old Diamond P Motorsports on TNN. With the Lucas association with POWRI, they are taping a few more midget races this year to show on SPEED.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I remember reading in the old Open Wheel that the guy who owned the nashville network David Hall I think his name was loved the outlaw sprints and made a deal with Ted Johnson about putting them on TV Was thinking he got a small percentage ownership of the outlaws. It turned out to be short lived cuz Hall then sold the channel to MTV and thats when we wind up with Spike TV and they did away with all the good stuff (racing Bull Rideing etc) and give us like a Pam Anderson cartoon lol like thats kool . But I watched the tin tops and thought it was a pretty good race . Thinking next time I go to races and there are late models I will stay in the stands and watch instead of going out to the car for a beer .

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I wished I would have known it was on. I would have preferred it over IndyCar at Milwaukee.

Tin tops or not, anytime they have a dirt race on TV it is a win-win for all of dirt track racing.:6:

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Given the right conditions, the late models can put on a very good show. It is just too often that they are "follow the leader". We had a WoO LM 100 lapper at Battleground Speedway the year before last, and it was a barn burner, several lead changes throughout the race, right up to the checkered flag. Too bad the track owner lost a whole bunch of money on the deal (crowd of only 300 to 400). The 50 lapper was a decent race last year, but after losing even more money (no advertising - "word of mouth" and a crowd of about 150-200) they won't be back.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by cmakin:
Given the right conditions, the late models can put on a very good show. It is just too often that they are "follow the leader". We had a WoO LM 100 lapper at Battleground Speedway the year before last, and it was a barn burner, several lead changes throughout the race, right up to the checkered flag. Too bad the track owner lost a whole bunch of money on the deal (crowd of only 300 to 400). The 50 lapper was a decent race last year, but after losing even more money (no advertising - "word of mouth" and a crowd of about 150-200) they won't be back.

That's exactly why there are almost no late model races in northern Indiana this year. The promotors were disappointed with the size of some of the crowds and have stopped scheduling any late model races. The races were fantastic, like the Summer Nationals race at Kokomo last year. But the promotors often put little effort into promoting the shows and usually give them a weeknight event which cuts into the crowd since the majority of fans have to work the next day. I know a large portion of the users on this board go to the parking lot when the sprints aren't racing, but they would realize that there is some great racing they are missing out on if they just get off their high horse long enough to see it.

I enjoyed the "reality" part of the show where the camera crews visited the race shops and talked about how these drivers have worked to get where they are. It reminded me a little bit of the "Dirt Knights" show that was just fantastic following the USMTS modified drivers on Versus. If they could get something like that going for late models, it would be great for the exposure of the sport. Last year I had no idea who the hell Ryan Gustin is. But now when I read his name winning a modified race at Cedar Lake, I know who he is and how talented he is.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Think back to when you were a kid and picking a car. Usually a kid will pick some car that is easily seen (back in the early 90's my guy was Davey Allison because i could pick out that big 'Texaco' logo anywhere.... just like the kids from the late 90's watched Jeff Gordon because of that rainbow scheme).

When you watch 20+ dirt LM's (or any other full body car class), every car has some identifying feature that makes it unique. When you watch 20+ non-wings on track there is so little room for sponsors and numbers that there isn't any space left to make a car unique.

Regardless of the quality of racing or class, the layman race fan needs something to relate to.

The diehards will always know the who's who and where the racing will be, but the diehards can't keep racing afloat by themselves.

Don't get me wrong... I would never give up the racing at a place like Kokomo for ANYTHING. One of the most positive things I see at Kokomo and gives me hope for the future, is when the Sprints are firing off is all the younger kids come running to the stands to watch. Obviously the kids are hooked on something beyond what we understand. Maybe one of these days someone will ask those kids why they come running to the stands instead of running out to the parking lot to throw the football around like you see at so many other tracks. Whatever it is... maybe someone needs to take notice and build on that. Tintop's or not.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by hoosier race fan:
I enjoyed the "reality" part of the show where the camera crews visited the race shops and talked about how these drivers have worked to get where they are. It reminded me a little bit of the "Dirt Knights" show that was just fantastic following the USMTS modified drivers on Versus. If they could get something like that going for late models, it would be great for the exposure of the sport. Last year I had no idea who the hell Ryan Gustin is. But now when I read his name winning a modified race at Cedar Lake, I know who he is and how talented he is.

The USMTS comes through this area a few times a year, and I am familiar with most of their folks. I also supply them with pictures for promotion and their website. The show (Dirt Knights) did a great job exposing the series (which offers some truly fantastic racing), but I think that the quality of the racing didn't really come across because of the format. That Gustin kid is something else. It is too bad that Kelly Shryock and Jason Hughes weren't part of the featured drivers. There is a huge rivalry between the two great drivers and car builders.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I watched it and thought it was really good. Good production, interviews, etc. While I would never pass up a sprint race for the late models, I have seen some very good late model races. I think its good to see any any form of dirt track racing on tv.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Guess they need TV more often at Wheatland. The local boards were blazing with how poor the track prep was the night was the night before for the qualifying night and how one lane the racing was (which is pretty much the norm for that track).
Every one was really buzzing that they opened up the track and watered for the Show Me, something they never ever do there. The lates put on a good show on a well prepped track, but you just don't see that very often, especially around here.
Glad they had a good one to show the non everyday fan dirt racing.

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

I watched it. Top knotch for short track racing. This series is light years ahead of USAC. Hope to see more on national TV. I watch them weekly on the cable stations

Re: OT-Tin Tops on CBS-Your Thoughts?
 

Originally Posted by 48modracer:
Lucas Oil has their own production company. They do several different types of racing that is sponsored by Lucas oil. They are kind of like a throwback to the old Diamond P Motorsports on TNN. With the Lucas association with POWRI, they are taping a few more midget races this year to show on SPEED.

Correct, in fact it is my understanding that MavTV was started and is owned by Lucas Oil. I know they have taped the Lucas Oil Modified Series that is played on that channel.

The only other top tier late model series is the WOO late models, but that series does not have the television time like the Lucas Oil series and that is obviously because Lucas Oil is investing in the series.

The reason this got on TV was money. If you look at anything Lucas Oil you will see a huge investment into the promotion end especially for TV. I do not know for sure what it cost but I guarantee there was a financial investment from Lucas to get it on network television. But as indicated, they make the investment worthwhile and professional. I have watched almost all the dirt late model televised shows and they are always very well done. Even though open wheel is my first like, I still enjoy the dirt late models since I grew up around that type of racing in the early 80's.

There is absolutely no reason why sprints or midgets could not do the same, but right now there is no sanctioning body or series sponsor like Lucas Oil to put forth the monry to take it to TV.

The area on the side of the cars is far from being the reason it is on TV.