Traction control
 

How could someone tech a car if you suspected that they had traction control? Is it possible? Just wondering.

Re: Traction control
 

More than likely it would be in the ignition box. Usually take the cover off and you can tell. I don't know if they're getting more creative or not with their dirty dirty cheating.

Re: Traction control
 

Are there ways of watching/listening to a car and being able to tell if it is running traction control?

I have had people tell me things to listen to on certain cars they've suspected of having it......things that don't sound normal.

I am not that familar with it so I am not sure what I should be paying attention to.

Re: Traction control
 

Good luck catching them now these days you would have to completely take apart a box to find it and still may not find it Look at all the technology that's in a cell Phone and the size of the parts! It sucks but it's expensive and motor sputters when traction control kicks in you can tell by hearing that! I have seen video's on youtube talking about how it works!

Danny 24

Not in the box boys
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Re: Traction control
 

Originally Posted by cshuman:
Not in the box boys
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How is it now?

Re: Traction control
 

There's a club here that runs midgets with the Pontiac Iron Duke engine. After every race, you turn in the ignition box. Next week you get one back. Probably not the same one. Therefore, no one can monkey with the chips.

Maybe they should start checking inside the torque tubes...just sayin'
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Re: Traction control
 

TRACTION CONTROL?
For $4000.00 you can buy a wireless unit that you can cary in your pocket to do your traction control, all it does is notices how quickly your engine is accelerating and when the point that it determins is too fast it retards the timeing or kills a few cylinders to help the tires keep traction, you don,t want to buzz your tires. When you buzz them you think you are flying but everybody else is driving around you.
CSHUMAN uses another type of device, it is much more expensive and harder to detect. You can find it at the base of his spine it was given to him by his father and has taken years to get dialed in, the thing is so precise that it can detect even before the tires are wanting break loose and it adjust with the use of brake and throttle to keep the tires biteing and moving forward. You generally won't find this type of device in your lower classes and that is why "he is who he is" A race driver can actually be faster by going slower?
We race 1000 cc mini sprints. These engine run so well that the manufactuers were having problems with dumping riders when they got on them too hard in the lower 3 gears, to tame them down they use a different ign and fuel map for each gear with 3rd gear having the least amount of retard built in, so you might say that any minisprint with a 2004 or newer motor has traction control.
I play with these things more than I race them and I am having a real good time doing it. In 2008 suzuki and kawasaki decided they could sell more bikes if they advertised active traction control but because of insurance regs. they couldn't call them tracton control because they would be liable when some numbn=t dumped their bike. We got a new 08 zx10r converted it over to alky and went racing. My driver said it was like having a 10 lb flywheel on the motor coming out of turn but when it straightened out it was like a rocket ship. It probably would help on a dry slick track, however the CSHUMAN device seems to work as well or better. We also play with data acquisition on our race car because it's fun and I can't hear my damned motor running. Well we went to tulsa with another driver, I explained the traction control to him and asked what he wanted to do. He chose the CSHUMAN device that he had raced with for years over the traction control by box. WE watched his laps and sure enough his highest rpm was about 15 feet before turn exit it would then drop down 1500 rpm's and accelerate down the straight until the next turn lap after lap and he was really hooked up. If you check we now have a spl rule in MMSA rules just for us. Traction is a secret, speed through the turn is "the" secret the cars that run through the turns the fastest will be the car that wins. Sure hope this helps out. Don't worry about tc, make the car and driver do it, that is what we are all striving to do.

BILL JONES

---------- Post added at 06:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------

Am i wrong?

Re: Traction control
 

My son runs the 1000cc AMSA. We enjoy it a lot, but much like when we ran quarter midgets I have never understood spending a lot of money to win a very little bit of money.....or in the case of quarter midgets, no money at all.

Like racing a $50k car to win $1400? I don't have an answer but I'm glad there are people who find it worth their while because I love it!!
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Re: Traction control
 

You can't outlaw money. The more rules you make the more expensive it gets. Your son needs needs to work on the CSHUMAN traction control system it is no doubt the best. My son calls it modulation of the throttle pedal Lynn Ambrose calls it backpeddling whatever you want to call it it is a step to becoming a race driver. Sometimes faster is slower.

Re: Traction control
 

Originally Posted by CTtoPA:
Like racing a $50k car to win $1400? I don't have an answer but I'm glad there are people who find it worth their while because I love it!!
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In this economy those numbers are getting smaller and smaller. Your average small business is struggling to survive much less have the cash to sponsor a race team.

The current state of the economy and $4/gal gas has lead to miserable car counts.

Unfortunately I don't see that changing for the next 18 to 24 months.

Re: Traction control
 

There has only been one time that I thought that I could really hear a car with traction control. I was seating close to turn four, and the car sounded horrible coming off the turn but by the flag stand it was clear. By the end of the straight it was great. Every lap, it had the same pattern, but the sound coming off the turn was different each lap. Sometimes it sounded really rough. Sometimes it almost seemed normal. However, it always had power coming out of the turn.

It is possible that the driver was having some mechanical issue, and I was just being over creative. However, I really believe he had it in his car.

Odds are that he didn't, but I have seen dozens more with it that I never noticed.

Racing has never made "financial sense" anyway in my opinion. From go karts to F1 it isn't going to be a money making business, you just have to love it. Some are willing to spend anything to get an edge, especially in these days of nearly equal equipment. Like last night at TSS with 17 cars @ probably 10 or so with legitimate equipment to win. Reminds me of a go kart racer several years ago. They had a crew cab dually, lowered with custom wheels, 24 ft enclosed air conditioned trailer, 2 custom painted karts, about 50 wheels/tires, 3or4 motors, 3or4 custom driver suits @ 2or3 custom Simpson helmets. This kid ran Jr. Karts, unbelievable. Probably a $75,000 investment to run JR. KARTS on a dirt track for trophies.
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Re: Traction control
 

They only sputter or sound weird when you get greedy and take out too much timing...dont get greedy and it will sound just like it should and that is an easily applied throttle.

That was very creative way of saying the secret cshuman device is a good foot.
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Re: Traction control
 

Originally Posted by Phylo82:
In this economy those numbers are getting smaller and smaller. Your average small business is struggling to survive much less have the cash to sponsor a race team.

The current state of the economy and $4/gal gas has lead to miserable car counts.

Unfortunately I don't see that changing for the next 18 to 24 months.

That sucks you live in Ohio because I haven't seen a 'miserable' car count at an Indiana dirt track in years...... :31:

---------- Post added at 07:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:07 AM ----------

Originally Posted by CTtoPA:
Like racing a $50k car to win $1400? I don't have an answer but I'm glad there are people who find it worth their while because I love it!!
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I heard the annual write off for that is around $5500. Marion County biz is at least from what I understand. It's quality advertising, though so it's worth it in some markets.

---------- Post added at 07:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:07 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Jrp4554:
How could someone tech a car if you suspected that they had traction control? Is it possible? Just wondering.

Traction control? LOL! Well you can usually tell by looking cause it'll have a big wing on top. :5:

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You know i've known quite a few of these rich racers and the only thing I know for sure is they enjoy racing as much as we do they can just do it with more style. These guys are good people that love racing, when things look bad and you need a part don't be afraid to see if they have a spare most probably do and would be glad to get you back in the race Don't judge a book by it's cover.

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It is true, all the good "traction controls" retards the timing, in relation to "spinup", and is unnoticed outside the car. Mine has 4 timing curves, and doesn't cost 4k, it's built in the ign module, and is programable with a laptop, or netbook. For under $400.00 you get everything but the spark plugs, or you can buy it with a "recommended" set of curves, for less money, and send it back to have them changed. This is not for factory ign, but does work in conjunction with what Ambrose refers to. Bob:)

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[QUOTE=deannalynn;231215]That sucks you live in Ohio because I haven't seen a 'miserable' car count at an Indiana dirt track in years...... :31:[COLOR="Black"]

There were 13 sprint cars at L-Burg Friday evening.

Re: Traction control
 

[quote=Phylo82;231301]

Originally Posted by deannalynn:
That sucks you live in Ohio because I haven't seen a 'miserable' car count at an Indiana dirt track in years...... :31:[COLOR="Black"]

There were 13 sprint cars at L-Burg Friday evening.

My original quote holds true.... I didn't see it! LOL :5: Look, I'm not disagreeing about there being room for improvements, but the economy alone didn't cause poor car counts or decreased spectator attendance. I'm sure somebody on here has written a masters' thesis concerning the waxing and waning popularity of local racing over the years and the host of factors involved. The combination of these other factors (cultural attitudes, promotional tactics, excessive number of 'levels', competing tracks, etc) doesn't negate the money factor entirely, but those other things combined are just as important if you want to have a great show that people will drive and pay to see.

Haha! All this from a question about how to catch a cheater.

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It ain't cheatin, if it ain't ill eagle by the rule book, but I'll admit, it doesn't improve the driver ability, but, right now, it's legal, at least where I run. Bob:)

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"WELL YOU DIDN'T SAY YOU COULDN'T" Smokey Yunick

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Yeah, Ole Smokey had a real love afair with rule books, just like th guy that was the tech man for Nascar, the best cheater they ever had, so they offered him a job, he had done it all! Bob!:5:

Re: Traction control
 

The Bazzaz Z-Fi TC offers up traction control technology derived from the highest levels of professional racing to all levels of riders or racers desiring the ultimate in technology, pure fun and advantage over the competition. The Z-Fi TC does not require any additional sensors to be mounted to the bike or mini sprint. Because the Z-Fi TC provides such an advantage in performance it is not legal in some racing series but is legal for most competition.
$949 and it works very well on a mini sprint

Re: Traction control
 

Yea but you'll never get you'r cshuman device dialed in. By the way what precentage of slip do you dial in to make it work you need some slip to stay hooked up and that changes according to the dirt. Have you ever watched a good driver over power it just a little at the turn apex to duck under the car in front , for that you need intelegent traction control. Forget the add-on's and work on your driving.

Got one putting in car this weekend phil hope dry slick I need all help I can get.
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756 have you ever asked anyone about dry slick set up and driving. Why don't you come down to Brownstown on the 25 th. I can almost guarantee it will be dry slick. If you pit near us I'll try to get you some tips on set up. Hope the bazazz helps but experience is still what will help you the most.

Originally Posted by DAD:
756 have you ever asked anyone about dry slick set up and driving. Why don't you come down to Brownstown on the 25 th. I can almost guarantee it will be dry slick. If you pit near us I'll try to get you some tips on set up. Hope the bazazz helps but experience is still what will help you the most.

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---------- Post added at 06:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:18 PM ----------

I am just kidding I would screw up with it just the same.you are correct a good driver will get to the front no matter. What
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Re: Traction control
 

I just don't believe there's any circumstance where I would be happy about winning with such a device on the car, legal or not.

But to answer OP's question, there are devices that can detect it without even touching the car. I did a report about the negative effects of traction control in motorsports in high school and at the time someone had developed a device that could be pointed at a car and would analyze what percent chance that the car was using traction control. So, while rare, there are devices out there that don't even need to look at the car to determine if traction control is present.

While some people do run it to a degree that can be heard from the stands, the people winning with it aren't. You would never know because the line between good throttle control and electronic assistance can be very fine.

Re: Traction control
 

Originally Posted by Jrp4554:
How could someone tech a car if you suspected that they had traction control? Is it possible? Just wondering.

You can't tech a keen right foot.

Re: Traction control
 

Actually, we were doing some R&D for a new ignition system, for a manufacturer out of Iowa. He didn't come out and call it "traction" control, but you could say it was, however, it was a manual system, with 4 advance curves built in, and programable, however, you controlled it with 2 toggle switches, and it did have some effect on wheel spin, we ran it most of the season, and at the time, it was RPM limited, by a fault in the encoder wheel, which he later fixed, but I can't bring myself to try it again. Maybe someday. Bob:)

Traction Control Used??..& Short Fields??....
 

[quote=Phylo82;231301]

Originally Posted by deannalynn:
That sucks you live in Ohio because I haven't seen a 'miserable' car count at an Indiana dirt track in years...... :31:[COLOR="Black"]

There were 13 sprint cars at L-Burg Friday evening.

14 NW Sprint cars at new Az. Spdway Sat. in Apache Junction??...with some of the top "Local" front runners not supporting this new Phx. area track for one reason or another??...only Tucson "USA" was runing a wing show to conflict??.........
_____________
Brucer':32:

Re: Traction control
 

I decided to go to lawrenceburg for Indiana midget week show. The track was not in the best of shape when we got there just before the start of the midget heats. My back was still sore so I decided to sit in the grandstands on the front straight. The midgets came out for their heats, some of the younger drivers were buzzing the tires all the way around the big 3/8 mile track thinking they were flying, and the more experienced guys were working the throttle and hooking up their tires and passing tese kids like they were tied down. It was hot and as soon as the tires began to buzz (about 30 feet before turn exit) white smoke would come off the left rear for about 10-20 feet they would back off hook up and take-off. I would call that cshuman traction control.
The sprints came out next for their heats. The white smoke on the faster cars was just like the midgets, short burst back off then go, all except for one car I was watching this car made 10 or 15 little puffs of white smoke through the turn and was really hooked up and moving forward this looked more like Davis traction control to me. Later on in the show this same car busteed the cushion and instead of hitting the throttle and busting the tires to loosen the car up and run off the cushion the damed thing fell on its face just couldn't get those big old tires to break loose. Lawrenceburg doesn't out law this type of traction control only your wallet (about $7000.00) limits if put one of these thing on your car. If you intend to move past larenceburg sprints like USAC you need to work on the old cshuman device to move forward it's all in the butt.