mini sprint safty
 

I am new to this forum and would like some help I am going to step up to mini sprints this year but i had a guy tell me that it was more dangerous to run mini than a full size 305 what do you guys think your thoughts would be great

Re: mini sprint safty
 

What did this guy base his thoughts on?

Re: mini sprint safty
 

He just said that they was more dangerous and when they flip they pick up speed. He races a 305

Re: mini sprint safty
 

My thought would be it would really depend on what your top speed would be in a mini vs the 305 sprint.I am not sure why he would tell you that in a crash the mini would speed up,because as soon as you make any contact with anything you will start loosing speed.Then it turns into a calculation of speed vs mass.The heaver the mass the longer it takes to come to a stop.It would seem to me that a mini would weigh alot less than a sprint.Also from my point when I ran a mini and crashed it it was a hole hole hole lot less painfull than when I crashed my 410 sprint.From my point of view I would say the guy who gave you that info is NUTS.I would guess that he is trying to steer you 305 sprints to help with car count.If you are thinking of going to a sprint in a year or two I would skip the mini and go to the 305,just because of the cost and nothing on a mini will work on a sprint then in a couple of years you could switch up to a 360 then a 410.That way you have several years to put together alot of spares that you WILL need.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

maybe the person giving you this info, is reffering to the fact that theres alot less room inside a mini sprint and therefore u might get banged up a lil bit more than a full sprint car, just a thought! and with the short wheel base they do flip easier and sometimes faster, its still gonna be dangerous no matter what kind of open wheel car it is, it is still a racecar

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If you are worried about it being dangerous you don't need to be out there.

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well buck2 summed it up for you pretty well but are you talking about a mini sprint or a 600 micro sprint? Either way in our 600 I just taped foam padding all around the right side of the cockpit. Really making sure to get everything under the stearing and along the right leg all the way down to the gas pedal. Really as long as you keep your right leg protected from bouncing off anything your pretty good. I would also suggest a LaJoie full containment seat and safety belts with a sternum latch.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Did the person telling you this happen to have a 305 to sell?????

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Ya I think he is trying to sell it.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

with the above being said just go with what you want to do.I raced micros for 3 years and I personally really never seen anybody get hurt.Ive seen many people flip in a micro and depending on if anything was broke be flipped back over and resume racing.Theyare pretty safe but just trying to help out.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

a mini-sprint is about the same size and speed as a TQ. i've flipped my TQ many many times and been lucky not to get hurt and flipped my sprintcar once and got hurt so go figure. sprintcars carry alot more speed and momentum so the flips are alot more violent. i would, however, skip the mini-sprint and go straight to the sprintcar if thats what you plan on racing in a few years as you dont learn anything from the smaller cars (mini's, TQs). just my opinion.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

If your worried about your balls, put on a jock strap.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

I feel the mini is safer as long as you are running on mini tracks. In Indiana Peru and Logan are relativly safe. Putting them on Gas City, Kokomo, or bigger the foot box gets vulnerable. Never run one, but just my belief.

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There are no race cars or race tracks that are safe. Just like there are no bulls and rodeo arena's that are "safe". The only things you can do as a driver/owner is make your car as SAFE AS POSSIBLE given the equipment available and mechanical abilities that you posess. That and be smart about where you are racing. If there is no ambulance, don't race. If there isn't any insurance, don't race.

If you race once or 1000 times, you still run the same chance of getting into a crash be it your fault or not. Have there been as many people hurt in a mini as a sprinter, No, but that doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen.

As far as the argument between wheather to run a sprint or mini, in my opinion a mini only will get you laps, but it isn't anything like running a sprint car, even a 305.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by LEADERS EDGE:
There are no race cars or race tracks that are safe. Just like there are no bulls and rodeo arena's that are "safe". The only things you can do as a driver/owner is make your car as SAFE AS POSSIBLE given the equipment available and mechanical abilities that you posess. That and be smart about where you are racing. If there is no ambulance, don't race. If there isn't any insurance, don't race.

If you race once or 1000 times, you still run the same chance of getting into a crash be it your fault or not. Have there been as many people hurt in a mini as a sprinter, No, but that doesn't mean that it can't or won't happen.

As far as the argument between wheather to run a sprint or mini, in my opinion a mini only will get you laps, but it isn't anything like running a sprint car, even a 305.

I agree. No car or track is safe. This is an extreme sport. And this statement holds true no matter what type of racing you are looking into.

My suggestion to you would also be to check out the track you plan to run at. Do they have visible fire extinguishers (and know how to use them)? Do they have an EMT on site? Take a good look at the track and area around it.

You can have a great car with the best safely equipment available but if the track you are racing isn't equipped for an accident you are still in a bad spot. Talk to those who have raced it and find out how the owners/promoters/crew handle safety issues. Talk to someone who has had a crash there and find out what they think. How was the accident handled? Were there medical bills? Were they paid on time and hassle free? Nobody wants to think they will need the insurance aspect of racing but lets be realistic.

Just a few thoughts for you.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Thanks for the replys.My brother and I have been into racing gokarts for 5-6 years now and our in the process of selling it all and buying a upright 600 mini sprint to run waynsfield in ohio. I dont think we will ever move up to a full size sprint in the near future anyway. I know all racing is dangerous but some types are more than others, just like gokarts on dirt our safer than running them indoors on concrete with coke down, even know i have seen people get hurt on both

Re: mini sprint safty
 

I think you will find the move from karts to mini's pretty easy. i went from karts to TQ's. Some guys have went from karts directly to sprints. just have to learn how to get the car sideways. you'll be alright :thumb

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Mini-Sprints.

I have been helping a team and have attended three "multi" 600 micro-sprint races.

a) My first impression is yes, they are indeed fast. Those little cars zoom around
small tracks at blistering speeds. I sense that the wing, helps make the car
very stable to be able to run them almost full speed without lifting.

b) I feel since you sit in them, like in a go cart the car has a very low
center of gravity making them very stable.

c) In the "multi" class, you can use very soft tires making the car stick more.

d) The engines are offset to the left, causing the car to handle better than
a TQ, or Sprint car where the engine is more in line with the center-line of the
car.

e) Most mini-sprint mfgs make cars with the side bars that protect the driver, just
like in a modern day sprint car.

In general I feel the minisprints are very fast. They probably cost a bundle too,
but don't use much fuel to race. That is all I know at present. And yes I think
they are "safe".


TQ's. I have only race a TQ a few times and I think they are very dangerous!

I have race a 360 sprint car and I feel they are safe as long as you are not
stupid. I have seen a few stupid sprint car drivers and they have landed in
the hospital with very serious injuries, causing the few I have seen to quit racing.
Sprint cars are not toys and they can kill you. Some racers think it's a big game and don't realize you can die in one. After they get seriously hurt once or twice they usually quit. Even the good ones. You only get so many hard wrecks before
you die.

The main thing I would think about a sprint car, like a 360 is they have a lot
of mass. Maybe 1400 lbs. Just be prepared to hit a concrete wall at full speed
and come to a stop. If you think you can take those kind of "G"s and survive,'
then I would say "let's go racing". If you think you would rather not get hurt,
I would not drive one or suggest you go racing in one.

I would put the cars in this kind of order.

1) Minisprints very safe and fast.

2) TQ's dangerous and fast.

3) 360 sprint cars, dangerous, fast, easy to get out of control, but forgiving
if you're are not stupid. The question is how smart are you? I would say
you have the most likihood of getting killed in a sprint car.

My thoughts,

Sincerely,

Larry Otani
:applaud:

Re: mini sprint safty
 

I went from go karts to micros myself.Once you get over the aw of the faster speeds at first youll be fine.They seem cramped at first but youll discover they get real comfortable and seem cozy in a way.Keep the rubber side down and good luck to you guys.If you have any other questions I can help with fire away.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Not to sound stupid but what are tq's

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by Larryoracing:

In general I feel the minisprints are very fast. They probably cost a bundle too,
but don't use much fuel to race. That is all I know at present. And yes I think
they are "safe".

I have race a 360 sprint car and I feel they are safe as long as you are not
stupid.

1) Minisprints very safe and fast.

My thoughts,
Sincerely,
Larry Otani

In the above quote , I have condensed Larry's comments to focus solely on the proclamations of what Larry see's as "safe" ... and Iam somewhat surprised. While Larry may often qualify his opinions as to his personal experiences or what he feels he has some knowledge of , Larry is actually very intelligent in many aspects of motor racing. And therein lies my "surprise".

No race car should be seen as "safe" in it's intended purpose. Whether it be karts , 600's , mini , micro , tq , 360 , 410 or otherwise , research will reveal that someone has lost their life in all of them. Racing has never been a "safe" activity in any of it's forms. And that is perhaps why everyone is not doing it.

Over time many improvements in safety can be seen. To those of us that can go back and take a look at the cars we drove 20 or more years ago serves to bring realization to just how dangerous those things were ! We did not recognize it to be so much back then. Today's race cars of all descriptions are dangerous and serious injury or loss of life should always be considered as extremely possible.

I believe that those who choose to participate know these things and accept the dangers but hope for the best !

I would ask my good friend Larry Otani from California to re-think "safe" as related to motorsports. :)

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Mini-sprints as with all racing carry some risk. Maybe not as much as a 360 sprint car, but i wouldn't want to hit the wall at Lawrenceburg with one. They are not toys though, a guy in Missouri a few weeks ago was badly injured and i believe is still in a coma, and a driver at Waynesfield last year broke his back;\

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by konger10:
Not to sound stupid but what are tq's

TQ is a Three-Quarter midget. My TQ has Midget Winter's rear-end and drive-line. We just run 750 honda engine bored to 836. No wangs on top of our cars. Pic of mine is my profile pic. They arent anything like driving a 410 sprinter but they are fun and easy to drive and alot of cars at each race and get to race on some cool tracks :thumb

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by speidel21:
TQ is a Three-Quarter midget. My TQ has Midget Winter's rear-end and drive-line. We just run 750 honda engine bored to 836. No wangs on top of our cars. Pic of mine is my profile pic. They arent anything like driving a 410 sprinter but they are fun and easy to drive and alot of cars at each race and get to race on some cool tracks :thumb

do they run tqs with "wangs" anywhere or jus non-"wangs":confused:

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by #1Brad Kuhn Fan:
do they run tqs with "wangs" anywhere or jus non-"wangs":confused:

East Coast TQ's run wings, but they more resemble a super modified than a midget.

Check out www.atqmra.com

Re: mini sprint safty
 

I think the word "safe/safety" is being used in the wrong context here. To say that anything is safe, and putting your name on it, is foolish. Be it a battery powered whatever, for your child, a Monster truck, or whatever, your chair at your confuser, your TV recliner, can all be "hazardus to your health"! What needs to be done, is to look at making whatever it is, as "safe as possible", within realistic reason. You have to consider a lot of factors, and I doubt any two "professional people", will agree on everything. I have seen a lot of what I would consider "unsafe" race cars", the integrity of the material goes away with age, some quicker than others. Putting a date on seat belt/harness replacement helps, but if they aren't mounted correctly, is a factor. Like I said earlier, you just have to be realistic, and make it as safe as you can, we all know "open wheel cars" are just that, you are strapped to a missile, that at any moment could, malfunction, or collect a rock, or a piece of a junk car from a demo derby, and put your lights out. One night at Vernon, one of our Tq drivers saw a BATTERY coming end over end at him, and as luck would have it, it bounced up as he neared it, luckily it hit the uprite on his left downtube, and glanced off, but that would not have been pleasant, had it hit him. To say one is any safer than the other, is foolish, had he had a rock guard, it would have helped, but if it were mounted with wire ties, it would probably not helped much, that battery weighed close to 10lbs, so I doubt the rock guard would have slowed it much, but having the battery properly mounted, would have gone a long way in "preventing" this from happening. Like has been said before, in other posts, you take the risk, and share the responsibility, when you strap in. Bob

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by #1Brad Kuhn Fan:
do they run tqs with "wangs" anywhere or jus non-"wangs":confused:

there use to be a group that ran in Illinois few years ago, dont know if they still run or not, they never really had many cars, but i think they ran with wangs.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

The Illinois series is non wing. http://www.imratqseries.com/ is their website. 20-25 cars I think is about average. I ran last month with them at Macomb IL 5th mile track and at E Moline IL 1/4 Mi. Good group of people and pay well.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Thanksfor replying. What is your guys opinion in full containment seats lajoy kirkey ultrashield is there a big difference the lajoy is alot more money and seems like it would add alittle more support overall. What is the best head and neck restraint money is know option when it comes to my brothers safety. if we make the jump I just wont to give him the safest car possible. Any help or advise would be great Thanks Again Mark

Re: mini sprint safty
 

i would suggest an Ultrashield containment seat, most comfortable and favorite seat ive ever had.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

I know I'm going to ruffle some feathers, but there has been a lot of talk on here about safety and I'm all for trying to keep the driver safe if it's possible. But the reality of sprints, midgets, mini sprints, any open wheel car is this.. if you want to race, it is not if you get hurt, it is when. If you choose to go fast and hussel a race car to try and win, eventually it will bite you. You have to find the limits, take chances and by doing so, you either make the pass or these open wheel cars will hurt you.

You tell me, if not almost of all the drivers you root for, that have raced for 10 years or so, win and run in the top 5, 15 or 20, have not spent some sheet time in the crash house. (Hospital) It is a part of our sport. I remember hearing a story that Mario Andretti was complaining when they put roll cages on the cars... I believe he said something like.. "Man don't put a roll cage on these things, now everyone will think they are brave enough to do it." Somebody else will find the real quote, but I don't think I'm too far off.

I do in fact, hate to hear about young drivers and the recent number of head injuries. But I also miss watching Robbie Stanley and Rich Vogler, Pepi Marchese running his own #5, Mack McCullen(sp) who got hurt at IRP, my list could go on and on of names of guys who I raced with who are no longer here, can't think clearly, see clearly, walk without a limp, etc.

But the fact remains, if you want to race - GO FOR IT! However, if you are worried about getting hurt, then read a book and watch NASCAR on TV.

George Wilkins

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:checkered:Hi my son has raced Quarter midgets, Mini Sprints, midgets,sprinters and Silver Crown. He has managed to get all of them upside down except for silver crown, so far. All are dangerous and if you run up front, and drive hard you will have a accident. Speed is the thing I worried about if you get a quarter midget on a 1/4 mile thats fast and not what they were made for. Midgets on a 3/4 or mile your pushing it, that thing of speed, weight, mass is right on. If you keep your race car on tracks that they were designed for you are better off.
Racing is dangerous and its like shooting a arrow out of a bow, if you have feathers on the arrow you pretty much know where it is going, some of the younger drivers that dont back off and have no fear becase they have unlimited money, are like arrows without feathers they are fast but were not sure where they are going to end up. Mini Sprints were the cheapest racing we ever done and lots of fun. Race close to home and have fun, get a hans device for your driver and a known chassie for your series.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

What the sprint guy was talking about probably was that on a track 3/8 or smaller the minisprints usually are about 1 to 2 seconds faster per lap than a regular old 410 non wing car. Clock them some times that is scarry! That being said a minisprint is just a midget frame with chain drive m/c motor. Wev'e raced them for about 15 years or so. I call the wing my $500.00 crush proof box. when you flip that big old wings take a whole lot of energy out it, much better than non wing, that chrome moly bounces like a ball.

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I think with a HANS you definately are better off with a full containment or nets on both sides. I ran a simpson dcell for a few years and ran a hans for the first time this past season. We only have a headrest on the right side and the nets are not really tight on my head on the left side. I noticed a lot of head movement side to side with the hans that I did not have with the dcell. I was talking with a rep from ISP seats at bristol and they make a net with padding made onto it for open wheel cars for easier entering and exiting of the car. You definately should get one of the head and neck restraints just like you said you cant put a price on life.

Racing is dangerous thats just how it is. Rolling out of bed and going to work everyday is dangerous to but nobody talks about that. Its a choice to accept that danger or not. It sure is a good time though.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by konger10:
Thanksfor replying. What is your guys opinion in full containment seats lajoy kirkey ultrashield is there a big difference the lajoy is alot more money and seems like it would add alittle more support overall. What is the best head and neck restraint money is know option when it comes to my brothers safety. if we make the jump I just wont to give him the safest car possible. Any help or advise would be great Thanks Again Mark

The Kirkey and Ultra sheild are a great starting point for containment seats. However, they are not strong enough to help you through the big wrecks. This is where many racers go wrong. Those seats have no development time in the test lab or in through the appropriate certifications. The LaJoie, ISP are seat manufacturers that do this. The money will be well spent and last for years. I'm sure someone will jump on here wondering how I can prove this. So let me take care of that.

The new SFI spec for aluminum seats is the seat is not allowed more than 1/4 inch and has to return .300 with 4000lbs of load on hip, 3000lb on shoulder and 2000lbs on the head.

I hope this helps.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

Originally Posted by safer1:
The Kirkey and Ultra sheild are a great starting point for containment seats. However, they are not strong enough to help you through the big wrecks. This is where many racers go wrong. Those seats have no development time in the test lab or in through the appropriate certifications. The LaJoie, ISP are seat manufacturers that do this. The money will be well spent and last for years. I'm sure someone will jump on here wondering how I can prove this. So let me take care of that.

The new SFI spec for aluminum seats is the seat is not allowed more than 1/4 inch and has to return .300 with 4000lbs of load on hip, 3000lb on shoulder and 2000lbs on the head.

I hope this helps.

I'm not so sure about that... I've had my Ultrashield seat for 3 seasons now, and had 2 pretty horrific crashes.. other than being sore, I haven't had any problems with it. Any containment seat is better than none though..

Originally Posted by safer1:
The Kirkey and Ultra sheild are a great starting point for containment seats. However, they are not strong enough to help you through the big wrecks. This is where many racers go wrong. Those seats have no development time in the test lab or in through the appropriate certifications. The LaJoie, ISP are seat manufacturers that do this. The money will be well spent and last for years. I'm sure someone will jump on here wondering how I can prove this. So let me take care of that.

The new SFI spec for aluminum seats is the seat is not allowed more than 1/4 inch and has to return .300 with 4000lbs of load on hip, 3000lb on shoulder and 2000lbs on the head.

I hope this helps.

Joss Moffatt had a couple big wrecks this year and he uses the LaJoie seat. He is sold on the safety of it. Yea its expensive but what cost do you put on your safety?
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Re: mini sprint safty
 

www.stida.com


if you have any questions on safety please do not hesitate to contact me. Will do my best to steer you in the right direction.

Re: mini sprint safty
 

There are a few words being tossed around here that can be left up to interpretation.
Fast- All cars can be fast in their respective worlds.
Safety- Is a goal most try to achieve and is not obtained thru a single factor.

Quarter midgets were not designed to have 200cc+ engines running on 1/4 mile tracks and being driven by an 8 year old, but I have seen it.
Micro sprints are not intended to race on 3/8 asphalt surface / concrete wall tracks at over 80mph
Mini sprints (or any cage/chassis) made by someone's brother-in-law using undersized tubing and only fair welding skills should be disallowed before they ever hit the track.

As for personal safety, err to the side of caution is the sensible answer. Being a car owner, I live by the belief: "I can replace any nut on my car but the one that straps into the seat." I have spent money that would have made my car faster or handle better and ended up spending the money on the "safety upgrade"
Yea, I believe in quality personal gear, restraints, seat, etc. but as stated in an earlier post If you do not have proper safety precautions in place at the facility, you are essentially on your own in the event of a incident. A qualified safety team is priceless.

The bottom line: Invest in quality, do your homework, don't forget to use BOTH heads, don't forget to have fun.

$.02

J.R.