Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

Reading the Gas City thread there was one reacquiring idea: Running Sprint and Midgets together at a weekly show. A promoter would be looking at $10,000 purse if he paid $2000 to win Sprints $200 to start and Midgets $1000 to win $100 to start. That equals 833 spectators at $12 per at the gate (666 at $15 per). Lets do a little break down of the costs to run a weekly show, jump in and correct or add any thing I might forget. I am guessing at these cost, lets use this thread to come up with a final number.Not to take shots at my over sites or poor estimates, just a starting place!

Lease: $40,000 by 18 weeks= $2222

Insurance $800 per night

Employees 1 Full time $400 per week/ nightly 20 at $40 per= 800 for a total of $1200

Equipment maintenance $500 per week (we will call that gas, oil, fixing, ect... this number is most likely low)

Ambulance/staff $750

Advertisement $3,000

Sprint/midget purse $10,000

Utility bills $500 (again on the low end)

Permits for the season ? lets guess $1800 per year or $100 per night


We are over $19,000

Now lets say we get 22 sprints and 18 midgets for a total of 40 cars, lets average 4 people per car (some bring more, many bring less) that is 160 at $25 per pit pass for a total of $4000. I would guess for a weekly show around 800 spectators per night, keep in mind the low turn out for bad weather could bring this number down just as good weather could make the number go up. 800 x $15 per is $12,000. We are only $3000 short of breaking even.

I have no guess what is made off concessions, I know it is not even close to what most people think it is, there is a huge cost in refrigeration, oils to fry in, and loss of product to waist. But if we are looking at concessions to make up the loss to profit ratio why not open a restaurant instead of a race track?

Obviously there are other ways to generate revenue, selling sponsorship is one that comes to mind, but most local small tracks do a lot of trading....

Would a support class or dare I say two pad the back gate enough to make it profitable?

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

How many midgets does Mont. get? 18 sounds optimistic to me.

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

Originally Posted by brsteg:
How many midgets does Mont. get? 18 sounds optimistic to me.

Averages in the mid-twenties

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

Originally Posted by jjones752:
Averages in the mid-twenties

Ok then...

Don't forget, mother nature might have a thing or two to say. 2 weekends of rain out's would set you way back.

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

I don't think your purse number is correct. I think that you are 4-5k light in the purse. I did a quick google search and most $2000 to win and $200 to start were in the 8k to 9K range. While I don't have a point of reference, I think that both your insurance and utility numbers are low.

I also think that your employee costs are way low. There are some both high risk (flagger, track workers) and high skilled (announcer, judges, Pit steward/line up, pit steward/pit shack) that will not work for $40 a night. There are kids working fast food that make more than $40 a night. Finally, you haven't paid the tax man anything to this point.

I forget the exact numbers but the length of years that someone is a promoter is not very promising. I think it was something like 50% of them quit after one season and 75% quit after three years. If promoting a race track was a great way to make money, more people would be doing it.

However, if there was a track that ran sprints and midgets every week, I would definitely attend their races.

You are right. I remember KC raceway,
owner Elanor telling. If she has
One rain out. It takes 2 good weekends to break even. How do you factor that in?

Lynn

Originally Posted by Jonr:
I don't think your purse number is correct. I think that you are 4-5k light in the purse. I did a quick google search and most $2000 to win and $200 to start were in the 8k to 9K range. While I don't have a point of reference, I think that both your insurance and utility numbers are low.

I also think that your employee costs are way low. There are some both high risk (flagger, track workers) and high skilled (announcer, judges, Pit steward/line up, pit steward/pit shack) that will not work for $40 a night. There are kids working fast food that make more than $40 a night. Finally, you haven't paid the tax man anything to this point.

I forget the exact numbers but the length of years that someone is a promoter is not very promising. I think it was something like 50% of them quit after one season and 75% quit after three years. If promoting a race track was a great way to make money, more people would be doing it.

However, if there was a track that ran sprints and midgets every week, I would definitely attend their races.

You are correct on the track staff. Officials, Flag Man, Scoring, Good Push Trucks, and Maintenance Guy. None of them work for $40 a night. I know what I make per night at each track and what most officials and flagmen make. The operating cost is very high per night and believe it or not concessions and back gate will make for covering the purse and basic operating cost. Front gate and sponsors is where the profit comes in per show. A wise man once said you don't own/lease A track to get rich but to make it a self supporting week to week business while making enough for off season repairs and upgrades. I've looked into leasing a track and came close to doing it this off season but family came first so it will have to wait.

Originally Posted by Blackduce:
You are right. I remember KC raceway,
owner Elanor telling. If she has
One rain out. It takes 2 good weekends to break even. How do you factor that in?

Lynn

That is factored in with track insurance. Most tracks now have a clause in them that allows them to claim (X) number of rainouts per season to help offset the missed revenue.

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

Originally Posted by ossuks:
Reading the Gas City thread there was one reacquiring idea: Running Sprint and Midgets together at a weekly show. A promoter would be looking at $10,000 purse if he paid $2000 to win Sprints $200 to start and Midgets $1000 to win $100 to start. That equals 833 spectators at $12 per at the gate (666 at $15 per). Lets do a little break down of the costs to run a weekly show, jump in and correct or add any thing I might forget. I am guessing at these cost, lets use this thread to come up with a final number.Not to take shots at my over sites or poor estimates, just a starting place!

Lease: $40,000 by 18 weeks= $2222

Insurance $800 per night

Employees 1 Full time $400 per week/ nightly 20 at $40 per= 800 for a total of $1200

Equipment maintenance $500 per week (we will call that gas, oil, fixing, ect... this number is most likely low)

Ambulance/staff $750

Advertisement $3,000

Sprint/midget purse $10,000

Utility bills $500 (again on the low end)

Permits for the season ? lets guess $1800 per year or $100 per night


We are over $19,000

Now lets say we get 22 sprints and 18 midgets for a total of 40 cars, lets average 4 people per car (some bring more, many bring less) that is 160 at $25 per pit pass for a total of $4000. I would guess for a weekly show around 800 spectators per night, keep in mind the low turn out for bad weather could bring this number down just as good weather could make the number go up. 800 x $15 per is $12,000. We are only $3000 short of breaking even.

I have no guess what is made off concessions, I know it is not even close to what most people think it is, there is a huge cost in refrigeration, oils to fry in, and loss of product to waist. But if we are looking at concessions to make up the loss to profit ratio why not open a restaurant instead of a race track?

Obviously there are other ways to generate revenue, selling sponsorship is one that comes to mind, but most local small tracks do a lot of trading....

Thanks I am glad someone started a reality based thread on this subject.

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

Looking at your employee costs, do you really think that is accurate? Employees working for $40 per night? And I think you forgot the most important employee cost. What is the promoter getting paid? He certainly deserves to make a profit for his efforts and to invest some $$$ back into the track.

I want to see Gas City make it, but we need to be realistic about their business model.

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

SO, we all agree the employee cost is low (I was actually factoring in that some of the smaller tracks have some employee's that work for a pit pass and their family gets in free). The purse is low , other cost are low, so, we are up to $25,000 ish? NOW we need another 400 spectators which pits us at 1200.....Would sure like to know the average spectator count at local tracks for a weekly show, not the number on the 2-3 nights the weather is perfect , but the average for the season???

I started this thread because so many casual spectators, fans, ect... keep bashing support classes, I for one am not a fan of any stocker on dirt ( but do enjoy any class on pavement with ample car count). But do realize they are needed to boost up the cash intake as they pay the same pit fee for a much smaller purse and bring a few spectators with them. A midget purse will pay for maybe three support classes with 3 times the participants.

I would love to go to any track that had Sprint/midget only shows, how cool would that be? But, not very realistic....:32:

Re: Sprint / Midget Combo Show
 

You did a great job coming up with this thread and a realistic look at what it takes to operate a regular season night at any track. It made many of us stop and think just how hard it is to operate a dirt track in this era. We all agree the drivers need a bigger purse, but how does a promoter get to that pay off and still make a profit.

Another good thing.....all the answers to your suggestions were very professional. We can all see that a racing message board can quickly get off topic. Nice job trying to figure out the combo show. :6: