Indiana Open Wheel - Belleville

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Look and see if any looked big, :3:

Originally Posted by DonMoore10:
I think for this to work locally it first needs to be approved at a higher level. If you look at who has been showing up for USAC, POWRi and Badger races, you will notice that the events with high car counts are many times a result of interclub exchange. Most of the high car counts in POWRi have been when Badger is added to the event. Same with USAC midget week. Those shows were padded with ARDC teams. The USAC shows at Sun Prairie have bigger car counts since you really have two organizations supplying the cars. This is not the way it used to be. Badger on a good night would have 30-40 cars on the ground. The USAC midget division used to be somewhat independent and would run races against USAC sprint and Silver Crown events and still have an impressive group of cars. For example, Years ago, USAC would run a 100 lap midget race on Labor Day at the Ohio State Fair against a USAC Champ Car race at DuQuoin, IL and both races had full fields of cars. But now we have pseudo type car counts that look impressive but they are really the result of 2 or more organization supporting the event. POWRi seems to be the only organization that can consistently have 20 or more cars but only if the race is within about 80-100 miles of St. Louis. Then you will see a handful of regular POWRi cars plus cars from the region such as Kansas, OK and western Missouri. I have some additional comments about the Montpelier shows but those are for another thread. The conclusion I would draw is that almost every organization currently needs the other to get qa decent car count which is not a very healthy situation.

This is where you lose most people in your logic. The ASCS rules were developed because there was a demand for a lower cost sprint car rules for the owners that could not afford a 410. The 410 series continued to be the premier touring series. The 305 series were developed because there was a demand for a lower cost sprint car series for the owners that could not afford and ASCS 360. As observed last weekend, the 360 class is still going strong with the 305 series.

I believe that there is room for the national series (USAC/POWRi/Badger), and then room for another lower level of midgets with a spec motor and a spec tire. To ask the national series to change their rules because the local person cannot afford the series does not make sense. Having a local series where people could race on a more reasonable budget makes sense. By keeping the rules of the classes close, you would be able to have the more successful local teams purchasing a "national" motor and running both series. Just like the cars in Knoxville that are racing both the 360 nationals and the 410 nationals.

Trying to put all the people into your box does not make any sense. What makes more sense is to create a different box. This is why the ASCS series were created. This is why the 305 series were created, and this is why the WOO series is still the premier division.

I'm still waiting on at least one person to give me a dollars and cents reason why the exotic engines should be continued. Statistics don't lie. You people just cannot let go of the main reason cars are not showing up at races. Now, for example, the Bloomington USAC midget week race: I'm counting only 8 actual teams (one owner) :13: that showed up there that can afford to field a midget for all the National races and some of those are rent a rides funded by rich parents. The Sun Prairie USAC race had seven actual teams :13: show up. So out of the hundreds of midgets in the United States and maybe thousands we are down to single digit numbers of teams that can afford to race the entire circuit.

If the production engine midget class is the wave of the future, why are Focus and Ecotec midgets so short on cars all over the country? By your logic I would think teams would be scrambling to buy Ecotec and Focus engines, so they could afford to race all year.

Originally Posted by DonMoore10:
I'm still waiting on at least one person to give me a dollars and cents reason why the exotic engines should be continued. Statistics don't lie. You people just cannot let go of the main reason cars are not showing up at races. Now, for example, the Bloomington USAC midget week race: I'm counting only 8 actual teams (one owner) :13: that showed up there that can afford to field a midget for all the National races and some of those are rent a rides funded by rich parents. The Sun Prairie USAC race had seven actual teams :13: show up. So out of the hundreds of midgets in the United States and maybe thousands we are down to single digit numbers of teams that can afford to race the entire circuit.

I've presented a positive plan to drastically reduce the cost of running a midget. In fact if you follow what a few teams have done, you can get a junk yard engine for next to nothing that will in some cases out run an exotic engine. I'm still waiting here for someone to step forward and tell all of us why in dollar and cents that we should continue to run the exotic engines.

To answer your question, the original intent of the Ford Focus engine was for a new series, not as a replacement for an exotic engine. Call USAC if you want to know why they have low car counts.

The WOO, ASCS, Lucas Oil Late Models, USAC Sprints, and almost all national touring series only have up to a dozen teams who run the entire series. Why then do they have 30 to 50 cars a show? They have local tracks running 360s, 410s, late models, etc. Midgets dont have this and that is why I agree with Jonr.

If you compare the midget teams that run a full series schedule and compare that to the other series full series teams you will see midgets hold there own in car count.

That's sound great. Then just keep running the expensive engines till there are no midget races left. We are almost there, guys. Belleville is the latest victim.

We race minisprints (1000cc non wing) with midgets on a flat 1/4 mile all the time. Not enough midgets to fill a field, so the track allowed 1000 cc minisprints to run with them. Only problem- most of the features are won by the minisprints. So, they added a rule that makes the minisprints unable to shift gears once on the track. Minisprints still win quite often. When the track is heavy , the midgets win., When the track is slick, the mini sprints win. But......nobody has any high $$$ motors and all have a good time racing . When a high $$ midget comes, they have to start at the back of the feature. Funny thing is the fans don't care- they just want to see 20 cars racing. Midgets are the coolest race cars their is, but MOST middle class guys like me cannot afford the high $$$ motors and constant rebuilds. Thats why mini sprints are gaining popularity. No $9K rebuilds. Blow up a motor and $2000 buys another. With EFI on them, they rarely blow up. Just my thoughts.......and didnt midget racing start on small tracks?

I'm currently in the process of figuring out how to mount a Honda 1100xx into a spare chassis with a quick change for fielding a second midget for next year at Montpelier. I have the red and silver #13 that I debuted there Saturday for the wet weather with an oil cooled gsxr1100 and if I had geared it right, prolly would've kept pace instead of waving folks by in the heat race....;) anyways, I had a ball and I don't have a ton of $ in it. I agree with Don, (sharp car by the way) something needs to be done and I hope the paths of the midgets can be turned around and headed back to where it was growing up watching as a kid and there for the "working guy" such as myself. Thanks
Patrick Mead #13

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Thanks for the comp Patrick. Montpelier is a fun midget track. See you a week from Saturday.