Only one for the short tracks chuck Ed carpenter

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

:22: The Indy 500 will be around long after we are gone. :31:

Wonder about the museum, was it a part of the purchase, or a separate entity, most of the items in there are on loan, I would guess that could be another negotiable part of the purchase, but might be a little bit more complicated. There is some strange wording in some of the agreements.

Originally Posted by Jerry Shaw:
To me, the bottom line is that if the track must change hands, it's not going to fall into the hands of someone who loves and reveres the place more than Roger does.

I concur. I would rather Penske buy IMS than some foreign entity that doesn't truly understand or respect what the place means. You think everybody's up in arms now, can you imagine if the track was rechristened "Barclays Brickyard", or if Etihad Airlines was painted across the yard of bricks?

I heard $2 billion thrown around. Which seems like a lot until you realize Penske Corp. generates $32 billion annually.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by jdull99:
If Tony had failed as bad as u make it sound, the last few years of the 500 would not have had full grandstands, the series itself would not be on perpetual rise (ratings, attendance at other tracks, car owners, etc), and there would be nothing left to sell...but ya, I didn't really think Tony would "invest" in USAC and I think most of "us" believe the dirt track on the infield is there to say; but I'm afraid Roger won't do much more than drive by the USAC office building...time will tell...

I think he means "the Split"...
I for one was all for the IRL and its supposed mission, I couldn't understand why someone like Robin Miller was so against it. But now looking back in hindsight, it was a terrible thing for our beloved top level of open wheel racing in this country. I can see now how STRONG Cart was just before the split and how even now it hasn't regained that level of following.

Penske Auto Group is a publicly traded company so I would imagine that amount could be found

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by Puppy:
I think he means "the Split"...
I for one was all for the IRL and its supposed mission, I couldn't understand why someone like Robin Miller was so against it. But now looking back in hindsight, it was a terrible thing for our beloved top level of open wheel racing in this country. I can see now how STRONG Cart was just before the split and how even now it hasn't regained that level of following.

I liked the IRL deal. Grass roots racers had a chance at The 500. That is what American TV viewers wanted and still want to see....Grass roots racers in the Big One, The 500. Not Penelope Pitstop with the checkbook. I like Roger but I wish he would have tried to get some American short track racers into a development program for indy cars, its not like he didn't have the cash, and it would have paid off in bigger dividends just through the fan base that would have been created.
I like The 500 , but that's the only Indy car race that I'll watch.
Now I'm waiting for that brickyard dude to come on here and tell me that I'm not a real American because I don't like progress.
Sorry (not really) for the rant:5:


,

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by Joe Schaub:
Penske Auto Group is a publicly traded company so I would imagine that amount could be found

Penske Auto Group may be a publicly traded company, but the buyer in this transaction was Penske Entertainment, which I assume is privately held, since at the press conference they specifically said this was a transaction between 2 privately owned companies.

Jerry

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by Puppy:
I think he means "the Split"...
I for one was all for the IRL and its supposed mission, I couldn't understand why someone like Robin Miller was so against it. But now looking back in hindsight, it was a terrible thing for our beloved top level of open wheel racing in this country. I can see now how STRONG Cart was just before the split and how even now it hasn't regained that level of following.

I know what he meant...& I realize how strong CART was; but for every F-1 driver (most who came AFTER their days there were done - like Emmo, Teo, Roberto, Danny, Eddie, etc - I know Nigel was here right at the end of this prime) there were plenty of Hiros, Dean Halls, Dennis Vitolos, etc...if CART's plan (some international) was sustainable and so good, it shoulda withstood the IRL's 11 oval races. AND they had the opportunity to take Tony George in, on their board or whatever it was - BEFORE he started the IRL, and THEY did not!

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by jonboat15:
I liked the IRL deal. Grass roots racers had a chance at The 500. That is what American TV viewers wanted and still want to see....Grass roots racers in the Big One, The 500. Not Penelope Pitstop with the checkbook. I like Roger but I wish he would have tried to get some American short track racers into a development program for indy cars, its not like he didn't have the cash, and it would have paid off in bigger dividends just through the fan base that would have been created.
I like The 500 , but that's the only Indy car race that I'll watch.
Now I'm waiting for that brickyard dude to come on here and tell me that I'm not a real American because I don't like progress.
Sorry (not really) for the rant:5:


,

I loved the IRL back in the early days for all the reasons you mentioned, but in hindsight it was a huge mistake!
You should do yourself a favor and watch more IndyCar races, they are usually the best race of the weekend...

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Thanks for the advice but I'd rather watch my short tracks on the weekends. I like Indy cars at Indy not many other places.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

I haven't commented on this thread yet because I guess I have been recovering from the surprise of the initial announcement.
Having attended every 500 since 1965 (55 consecutive) and with the goal of at least 20 more (which will put me at age 100), I feel that Roger Penske is best suited of all potential owners to preserve and carry on the traditions of the Speedway and begin new ones.
The 500 has changed much since 1965, but it is still the greatest race in the world. The drivers come from different backgrounds than they did in past decades, but the racing is the best it has ever been. I think Mr. Penske is the best bet to return Formula One to IMS also, and it would be so cool to see a 24-hour race at Indy as well.
I have attended every Brickyard 400 as well but decided to not renew for next year. This year's race wasn't that bad, but my interest has dwindled.
Here's hoping the next 100 years ago are as exciting as the last at Indianapolis! :11;

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by ronmil:
I haven't commented on this thread yet because I guess I have been recovering from the surprise of the initial announcement.
Having attended every 500 since 1965 (55 consecutive) and with the goal of at least 20 more (which will put me at age 100), I feel that Roger Penske is best suited of all potential owners to preserve and carry on the traditions of the Speedway and begin new ones.
The 500 has changed much since 1965, but it is still the greatest race in the world. The drivers come from different backgrounds than they did in past decades, but the racing is the best it has ever been. I think Mr. Penske is the best bet to return Formula One to IMS also, and it would be so cool to see a 24-hour race at Indy as well.
I have attended every Brickyard 400 as well but decided to not renew for next year. This year's race wasn't that bad, but my interest has dwindled.
Here's hoping the next 100 years ago are as exciting as the last at Indianapolis! :11;

Amen to that.... I'd love to see a 24 Hour race there. Maybe redesign the road course a bit. That would be a good race. I would imagine some of the high profile European teams would come or try to enter as Indy has a lot of prestige and influence in different parts of the world. Maybe cap the entries at 48 or so cars it the pit lane can hold than many.

Originally Posted by TQ29m:
Wonder about the museum, was it a part of the purchase, or a separate entity, most of the items in there are on loan, I would guess that could be another negotiable part of the purchase, but might be a little bit more complicated. There is some strange wording in some of the agreements.

Per something I read, the Museum is NOT included in the purchase of the Speedway. A statement from the museum said the museum operates as an independent entity and as a Not for Profit and will continue to do so.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by THS:
Just hope he listens to the fans and we don't have "locked in spots" for full time teams. Call me old school but I want the fastest 33. We finally have a bump day again! Don't screw that up!!

He didn't listen to the fans when he fired Gary B. Pretty sure he will listen to big money on this one.

If my great grand kids are still hearing Back Home Again it won’t likely be because of RP, unless he pulls a Methuselah.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by Puppy:
I think he means "the Split"...
I for one was all for the IRL and its supposed mission, I couldn't understand why someone like Robin Miller was so against it. But now looking back in hindsight, it was a terrible thing for our beloved top level of open wheel racing in this country. I can see now how STRONG Cart was just before the split and how even now it hasn't regained that level of following.

Exactly what I meant, it was a pyrrhic victory. While I don't hold either side totally blameless, that whole deal set off a chain of events that the series has not recovered from. We'll never know how much family money was spent in support of the IRL. His own family removed him from the CEO position in 2009. The uptick we've seen as of recent hasn't been under his direct leadership, that's been Boles, Miles, and Frye.

If 1996 doesn't happen, I don't think we are sitting here today watching IMS change hands. While the series needs the 500 and it is the big one, as Gurney eluded to, it benefits everyone if we don't treat this as one big race surrounded by a bunch of small support events. A strong series means an even stronger 500 and makes everyone money.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by jonboat15:
I liked the IRL deal. Grass roots racers had a chance at The 500. That is what American TV viewers wanted and still want to see....Grass roots racers in the Big One, The 500. Not Penelope Pitstop with the checkbook.

Because Racin Gardner and Dr. Jack Teeth Miller were names fans could get behind.....the point is those types are going to exist regardless of who's running the show.

But back to grass roots, if anything the split made it tougher. You got what you wanted for a brief time, but it wasn't long term. With the weakening of the series financially there are less people willing to take a chance on a one off, no more older chassis and engines laying around to purchase. You hope you can get your hands on a Dallara, maybe Honda or Chevy have an open lease, and pony up at minimum a cool million for the one race.

Originally Posted by jonboat15:
I like The 500 , but that's the only Indy car race that I'll watch.
Now I'm waiting for that brickyard dude to come on here and tell me that I'm not a real American because I don't like progress.

Well, it is a bit tough for me to take people seriously when they'd rather burn everything down around them just to get what they want rather than work with what they have in hopes of building something stronger with the potential to maintain or get more of what they want if the cards fall in their direction.

That whole 500 or bust, screw the rest, mentality is exactly what Gurney, Penske, and Patrick, etc. set out to end. A stronger series means an even stronger 500. But, I guess some would rather have a series no one gives a rat's rear about as long as they get 33 American heroes, over half of which the rest of world has never heard of, layin' it all out on da line for da fans(never mind that they aren't layin' out on da line for the fans as much as they are layin' out on da line for their own bank account).

Brickyard, with respect: your posts would be more positively viewed if they had less of the following-

1. Condescension

2. Unneeded sarcasm

3. Derogatory labels and names

But, of course maybe you are only interested in being disruptive as opposed to constructive dialog.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

This guys' dialog consistently smacks heavily of a disgruntled former employee of an entity that was left behind due to the decisions made back in 1995-96.

Personally, I'm quite happy and content with the fact that a gentleman who is a friend, along with some other drivers, got the opportunity to fulfill a dream, a dream shared by literally a few thousand supporters, to qualify for the Indy 500. The timing was nearly perfect and it worked out very well. I really don't care how much of the Hulman fortune was spent. I really don't care if the split and the ultimate disregard of those precious white papers caused what is perceived as irreparable damage to rear engine open wheel racing. None of that has any significant impact on myself or my familys' quality of life. However, seeing a well deserving friend give a very good account of himself and fulfill a huge dream actually does add just a smidgen to the quality of my life.

If all that makes me a short sighted xenophobe in the judgemental eyes of some who would believe themselves to be just a bit more "enlightened", then I reckon I plead guilty as charged.:6::27:

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by ISF:
This guys' dialog consistently smacks heavily of a disgruntled former employee of an entity that was left behind due to the decisions made back in 1995-96.

When I get accused of being a former or current member of the CART/Penske payroll it's always a good indicator of that individual not having legs to stand on so they resort to straw man arguments.

Riddle me this? How many original IRL teams are left? What happened to the grassroots save the oval campaign?

As much as I enjoyed seeing Kinser and Hewitt get the chance it was a bit hollow. Competition was watered down. If both are the competitors they seem to be, I think they would both agree they would have rather shown off their talents against a field that included Unser, Jr, Rahal, Vasser, Zanardi, Tracy, De Ferran, Andretti, Franchitti, Castroneves, Moore, and those teams they were associated with.

Like I said, Pyrrhic victory. In the quest to get 100% what you wanted you ended up with near next to nothing at a great cost in loss of fans and teams and a once strong series with world wide attention rebuilding itself after being burnt to the ground. That's fine if you want the Greatest Race in the Whole Wide World of Indiana with a support series no one gives three rat's rears about, but don't complain when no one watches, teams leave because they can't garner the financial support needed, and your hero can't get a ride because of lack of said funds. For the rest of us living in the world of reality, we'll continue on the quest to return the race and series to one of the world's greatest without you, oh and drivers and teams from any place that so desires to be a part of it.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

This well explains the intrigue and the Victories that the IRL did bring! -

https://racer.com/2019/11/22/mickey-...-builder-dies/

What happened to the IRL teams? (Stated before); The Internet boom crashed, Tabaco Companies and corporate America didn't get behind grass-roots racers and teams. It's about the same thing happening in NASCAR right now...(only about 20 or so well-funded teams/household names drivers actly...).

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by Brickyard:
When I get accused of being a former or current member of the CART/Penske payroll it's always a good indicator of that individual not having legs to stand on so they resort to straw man arguments.

Riddle me this? How many original IRL teams are left? What happened to the grassroots save the oval campaign?

As much as I enjoyed seeing Kinser and Hewitt get the chance it was a bit hollow. Competition was watered down. If both are the competitors they seem to be, I think they would both agree they would have rather shown off their talents against a field that included Unser, Jr, Rahal, Vasser, Zanardi, Tracy, De Ferran, Andretti, Franchitti, Castroneves, Moore, and those teams they were associated with.

Like I said, Pyrrhic victory. In the quest to get 100% what you wanted you ended up with near next to nothing at a great cost in loss of fans and teams and a once strong series with world wide attention rebuilding itself after being burnt to the ground. That's fine if you want the Greatest Race in the Whole Wide World of Indiana with a support series no one gives three rat's rears about, but don't complain when no one watches, teams leave because they can't garner the financial support needed, and your hero can't get a ride because of lack of said funds. For the rest of us living in the world of reality, we'll continue on the quest to return the race and series to one of the world's greatest without you, oh and drivers and teams from any place that so desires to be a part of it.

Let it indicate anything you want. It's meaningless to me. I don't really need a leg to stand on 'cause the disgruntled employee part was a mere musing, definitely not an accusation. The evidence speaks for itself.

As for the rest of the drivel, I repeat, I don't care! LOL!:5::27:

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by jdull99:
This well explains the intrigue and the Victories that the IRL did bring! -

https://racer.com/2019/11/22/mickey-...-builder-dies/

What happened to the IRL teams? (Stated before); The Internet boom crashed, Tabaco Companies and corporate America didn't get behind grass-roots racers and teams. It's about the same thing happening in NASCAR right now...(only about 20 or so well-funded teams/household names drivers actly...).

A strong series could have weathered those events much better. Splitting the series, running off fans, strong teams, and proven top level talent....pretty much the equivalent of not boarding up your windows and latching down everything that can be blown away before the hurricane hits.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

Originally Posted by ISF:
Let it indicate anything you want. It's meaningless to me. I don't really need a leg to stand on 'cause the disgruntled employee part was a mere musing, definitely not an accusation. The evidence speaks for itself.

As for the rest of the drivel, I repeat, I don't care! LOL!:5::27:

You cared enough to post.....

But, yea, if a person has a problem with foreign talent competing in this series, then they are exactly that....a xenophobe.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

What most people who think Tony George and the IRL destroyed open wheel racing fail to remember the beginning of the split was started with the Gurney's white paper and the way the USAC Board was set up with non Championship owners/drivers having some say into how the Championship division would operate. I still believe that Gurney, Hall, Patrick, Roger P, and other owners had legitimate concerns about the direction of Championship Division of USAC, BUT with the death of Tony Hulman and the loss of almost all USAC officials from the plane crash on the return the Trenton race gave the CART people an opening that those two events provided. When the young stars of the open wheel cars could not get a ride because they "lacked rear-engine, ground effects experience" and Emmo F. refused to drink the milk but push orange juice in victory lane, the IMS people needed to do something to protect their "brand identity." Least people forget CART put the "500" on their schedule even though it was a USAC event, why? Because it was and still is the single most important race in the world. The CART people started the verbal war of "who are these guys" racing in the 500 without us! When CART ran against the Indy 500 with their own 500 at Michigan and had the massive wreck before the start and then allowed the teams to bring out their backup cars they lost the ability to show how good they were. I have always felt that you do not advance your agenda by tearing down your competition because when you do people may think the the overall product may be flawed. I think the advance of NASCAR was open wheel fans looking for competition on the track, not in the board rooms of sanctioning groups. I still find it hard to believe that grass root drivers, if given the chance, could not become qualified Indy car drivers, especially if there are more ovals on the tour. The track and the series are in good hands as of now, but no one can foresee what changes will be made and if they will bring an upswing, stay basically the same, or cause a demise in the event and series we love

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

I don't see this as a positive but my real concerns are if the Captain goes away,
who stands next in line at Penske and where do they stand on all things involved?????
Mainly because Roger will turn 83 in February!!!

So as time passes then will we be looking at a Foreign owner?
I mean I would have bet you $100 that of all the mile tracks, the Indy State Fairgrounds would have been the last standing with Racing.
So all bets are off on what may actually happen when the time comes.

Re: IMS Sold to Penske
 

With the benefit of Covid-influenced hindsight I think we can safely say that the Hulman George family had the good fortune to sell at the top of the market when they did.