[DonRacer]

Originally Posted by D.O. USAC Dirt Road Course Racing with Champ Dirt cars. Ugly isn't it?

Look's like the new Gold Crown car without the side pods and front fairings.
Maybe Ashmore has a dirt conversion on drawing board.

The real bottom line on this, or any racing division, is will it generate enough money to pay the bills and show a profit.

First, a promoter must earn enough to make it worth his while to schedule another race. If not, it doesn't matter if winning pays $1 or $1 million. It doesn't matter if finishing sixth, seventh or eighth pays enough to cover expenses of a race team. If a promoter fails to make money off of a racing division -- or at the very least break even -- there will be no next time.

Next, the costs must be kept reasonable enough that those interested in this division can form a team and be successful in generating enough money to make it to the race track.

I am not one to believe that a series' success can be hinged on obtaining a sponsor to pay the bills. Too many people make that, or a television deal, the holy grail. It isn't.
If you lose that sponsor, or TV contract, your series is in the hurt shop pretty fast. The success must hinge upon attracting race fans that purchase $10 or $20 tickets. Full grandstands make it easier to attract sponsors -- for the series, the race track and individual race teams.

If there are no race fans, any series in the world cannot survive.

Jim Morrison
Editor
Hawkeye Racing News

Originally Posted by bigmojo5 The real bottom line on this, or any racing division, is will it generate enough money to pay the bills and show a profit. First, a promoter must earn enough to make it worth his while to schedule another race. If not, it doesn't matter if winning pays $1 or $1 million. It doesn't matter if finishing sixth, seventh or eighth pays enough to cover expenses of a race team. If a promoter fails to make money off of a racing division -- or at the very least break even -- there will be no next time. Next, the costs must be kept reasonable enough that those interested in this division can form a team and be successful in generating enough money to make it to the race track. I am not one to believe that a series' success can be hinged on obtaining a sponsor to pay the bills. Too many people make that, or a television deal, the holy grail. It isn't. If you lose that sponsor, or TV contract, your series is in the hurt shop pretty fast. The success must hinge upon attracting race fans that purchase $10 or $20 tickets. Full grandstands make it easier to attract sponsors -- for the series, the race track and individual race teams. If there are no race fans, any series in the world cannot survive. Jim Morrison Editor Hawkeye Racing News

That is the absolute GOSPEL right there folks. I had this same discussion with the idiots that post at trackforum and they kept saying I was off base and out of touch.

Jim, thank you for posting this. It's great to see someone else who gets it.

That is the

[sprntr]

[QUOTE=D.O.;145708]
For those who wonder where this design came from? This is a post from Ashmore asking IOW's posters opinions of what nose and body changes you wanted to see ! The car above came from GM and input from IOW posters.
It is the same new generation silver crown car that ran, with the new body on it getting ready for the Indy show.

Here is what they are considering. What do you think?
I like cars #1 and #6 for their old school roadster look.
I also like the #14 for it's modern look.
Your opinions?
David.


Just a few personal observations/Hopes/dreams. Realize that I have NOTHING INVESTED except my ticket money:
1. Dirt Champ Cars run on dirt.
2. Pavement Champ Cars have REAR ENGINES & run in the Indy 500, not at ORP.
3. Bring back the Championship Trail. Dirt Champ Cars & Indy cars, One National Championship. like it was meant to be!
4. If you must fix the Pavement Silver Crown series, BAN PAVEMENT CHASSIS. One chassis for all tracks. Or just cancel the Pavement Races.
5. If the Gold Clown series is to help drivers get to the IRL, the ENGINE IS IN THE WRONG END.
6. "Stepping up to NACRAP" is an oxymoron.
7. IF you must have an NASCRAP feeder series, bring back the USAC Stock Car Division.
8. The Gold Crown Series is simply an effort by the current "New & Improved' Pavement Silver Crown Car owners to hide that fact that they got sold a PIG-IN-A-POKE!

Let the BASHING begin.

Don't bother telling me that I'm a JERK. My wife already covered that today!

[QUOTE=sprntr;146653]

Originally Posted by D.O. For those who wonder where this design came from? This is a post from Ashmore asking IOW's posters opinions of what nose and body changes you wanted to see ! The car above came from GM and input from IOW posters. It is the same new generation silver crown car that ran, with the new body on it getting ready for the Indy show. Here is what they are considering. What do you think? I like cars #1 and #6 for their old school roadster look. I also like the #14 for it's modern look. Your opinions? David. Just a few personal observations/Hopes/dreams. Realize that I have NOTHING INVESTED except my ticket money: 1. Dirt Champ Cars run on dirt. 2. Pavement Champ Cars have REAR ENGINES & run in the Indy 500, not at ORP. 3. Bring back the Championship Trail. Dirt Champ Cars & Indy cars, One National Championship. like it was meant to be! 4. If you must fix the Pavement Silver Crown series, BAN PAVEMENT CHASSIS. One chassis for all tracks. Or just cancel the Pavement Races. 5. If the Gold Clown series is to help drivers get to the IRL, the ENGINE IS IN THE WRONG END. 6. "Stepping up to NACRAP" is an oxymoron. 7. IF you must have an NASCRAP feeder series, bring back the USAC Stock Car Division. 8. The Gold Crown Series is simply an effort by the current "New & Improved' Pavement Silver Crown Car owners to hide that fact that they got sold a PIG-IN-A-POKE! Let the BASHING begin. Don't bother telling me that I'm a JERK. My wife already covered that today!

Another post by some OLD GUY who actually has working knowledge of what racing should be.

Sorry sprntr, you said let the bashing begin and when someone leaves that door open, hell I'll take a shot.

[SpfldMile]

I certainly would love to see this series come to be and thrive. I do have a couple of concerns, though. If road courses are on the schedule, doesn't that mean there will have to be some sort of transmissions on these cars that wouldn't be needed on the ovals? I realize they would have them anyway, but road courses would need something different, which means more expense for a race or two. I still don't think I'm crazy about these cars on super speedways. The driver compartment is small and there is no room for encroachment. Anytime there is an accident, it is going to be high speed. I just don't know if I trust this style tube frame in that situation. Finally if it did succeed, I could see a couple of things happening. The Silver Crown cars would definitely be gone, I don't think both could survive. I also think that with success, a lot of outsiders would jump in and crowd out the guys that we want to see. By outsiders I mean people that don't have any idea where Putnamville, or Granite City, or Perris even is. I don't mean to be negative because I would like to see this work. I have my doubts, though.

[Lucky161]

Originally Posted by SpfldMile I certainly would love to see this series come to be and thrive. I do have a couple of concerns, though. If road courses are on the schedule, doesn't that mean there will have to be some sort of transmissions on these cars that wouldn't be needed on the ovals? I realize they would have them anyway, but road courses would need something different, which means more expense for a race or two. I still don't think I'm crazy about these cars on super speedways. The driver compartment is small and there is no room for encroachment. Anytime there is an accident, it is going to be high speed. I just don't know if I trust this style tube frame in that situation. Finally if it did succeed, I could see a couple of things happening. The Silver Crown cars would definitely be gone, I don't think both could survive. I also think that with success, a lot of outsiders would jump in and crowd out the guys that we want to see. By outsiders I mean people that don't have any idea where Putnamville, or Granite City, or Perris even is. I don't mean to be negative because I would like to see this work. I have my doubts, though.

I'm a little confused by some of the things you mentioned. And just because I have questions about it doesn't mean you are wrong. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I have my concerns about why they are even condsidering road courses, but I don't think the cost of transmissions are significant. And I could be wrong, but I was assuming they already used transmissions on the longer tracks.

Why are you concerned about tube framed cars on superspeedways? Bruce Ashmore is an experienced and successful designer of race cars many of which were carbon fiber. If there was a "real" safety issue with tube frames, why would be be proposing a tube framed car. Many people including myself at one time have bought into what I think is a myth, that is tube framed cars cannot be built as safely as carbon fiber ones. The facts are that a tube framed car cannot be built as light as a carbon fiber car with the same strength. That's not the same thing.

And finally, why would the success of the Gold Crown car automatically mean the demise of the Silver Crown series? I know a few dirt people that don't like pavement and there are probably a few pavement types that don't like dirt, but I think most people that are or would be fans of either of these types of racing would most likely be fans of both. Speaking for myself, I would.

[v8j]

it was pointed out to me that we are all a bunch of%^&**&^%$ #@)(*&^$!@#$^* negative people.bruce ashmore is doing more for pavement racing than any one has in a long time.if we can not be supportive shout the h%#*$ up. Or start a new series.do something to help racing with out opening your mouth.thank you

[sc96]

Originally Posted by SpfldMile I certainly would love to see this series come to be and thrive. I do have a couple of concerns, though. If road courses are on the schedule, doesn't that mean there will have to be some sort of transmissions on these cars that wouldn't be needed on the ovals? I realize they would have them anyway, but road courses would need something different, which means more expense for a race or two. I still don't think I'm crazy about these cars on super speedways. The driver compartment is small and there is no room for encroachment. Anytime there is an accident, it is going to be high speed. I just don't know if I trust this style tube frame in that situation. Finally if it did succeed, I could see a couple of things happening. The Silver Crown cars would definitely be gone, I don't think both could survive. I also think that with success, a lot of outsiders would jump in and crowd out the guys that we want to see. By outsiders I mean people that don't have any idea where Putnamville, or Granite City, or Perris even is. I don't mean to be negative because I would like to see this work. I have my doubts, though.

The transmissions are the same ones used for ovals, The driver compartment is plenty big and when they did the origional design it was for crash safety at well over 200 mph. The SilverCrown series is not tied to Gold Crown that series will continue on with GC being another step up.

[WRP]

...sorry