UNION COUNTY - Midget Week

8/8/08, 10:58 AM

WOW! :confused:

:greenflag:That's alot of info and trash talking going on there. :loser:First off I went to the Brickyard this year and what a horrible diaster that was with all the cautions. Sure I stayed and walked out of there saying I'll never be back again. Will I? Of course it's the Brickyard and I live in Indy. **** happens we all screw up. Okay maybe not 767 or whoever he is but comeon people It happened and it's over. :thumbLet's look forward to an awesome show 2night at Bloomington. A track we know we have nothing to worry about. Alot of you have said you'll never go to a USAC show again. Okay I doubt that's true but if so then have fun watching whatever it is you watch. It's still USAC there gonna get the fans, the sponsors and the drivers. It's like saying I'm not racing NASCAR becuase there tires don't hold up... BE REAL PEOPLE..:rolling And last but not least to say that some of the best drivers in the world that were there last night and to go on the microphone and say they don't have the balls... Are you even kidding me?:kookoo We can obviously tell which people were the smartest out of that group.. Nice Call Union County Speedway. That's my opinion and let the ripping begin. :usac:I'm a USAC Fan proud and True..

Trenton Darland #9

SPRINTCAR · 8/8/08, 11:00 AM

I was there and the track was smooth and a grader was not needed. The track was a little dusty at first but it came around after the sun went down. I know one of the guys that work the track and said Usac was there weeks prior watching them do track prep. This race should have been canceled days in advance if there was a safety issue. This is Usac's fault for not giving the track time to correct the problem's. Usac=Usuck!

767 · 8/8/08, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tmack_9

WOW! :confused:

:greenflag:That's alot of info and trash talking going on there. :loser:First off I went to the Brickyard this year and what a horrible diaster that was with all the cautions. Sure I stayed and walked out of there saying I'll never be back again. Will I? Of course it's the Brickyard and I live in Indy. **** happens we all screw up. Okay maybe not 767 or whoever he is but comeon people It happened and it's over. :

Trenton Darland #9

yup i make mistakes too. this is way beyond a mistake.

itsanonwingthing · 8/8/08, 11:12 AM

When I pulled in and was directed to park over on the MotoX course, and I noticed right away that people had, or were in the process of, parking on the hillside outside turns 1 & 2. It immediately crossed my mind then, that this was 1) crazy for someone to park their vehicle there, and 2) what would happen if a race car went over the wall and clobbered one of these vehicles sitting there. This was all before I even paid to get in, or new anything about a possible safety situation.
I just happened to take this photo at that time.

What you can’t see in the picture is a 6 ft high pole that was among the cars parked there. There was also a set of bleachers sitting there, and at that time the track crew was using a tow truck to pull the bleachers way from the track/wall. They later would request that these cars be moved, and when I went out after the heat races to move my car from the MotoX whoop de Doo I was parked on, I noticed that there were still two vehicles that had not been moved from the area, and that the pole that was there had hay bales built up around it.
Here is a photo I took of that

These were some of the safety concerns, along with the aforementioned problems.

Some issues cropped up on race night (parking cars in harms way), and they were addressed, the other problems should have been taken car of weeks ago. The USAC office is only an hour drive to Liberty and someone from the USAC office should have visited the track, knowing that there had been questions about safety issues in the past. If the USAC officials had some questions at that time, they should have gone back to UCS with a few drivers to get their opinions. This should/could have been done weeks ago.

I, like everyone else, was disappointed that a majority of the cars pulled out, but as they say Poop Occurs, and its on to Bloomington tonight!!

Here is a photo of the facility. The calm before the Storm!!

sprinter25 · 8/8/08, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmakin

It would seem to me that it would be a simple thing for USAC to produce a document that would indicate their minimum safety standards for a facility,and then publish it. This way, any venue and/or promoter would be aware of the requirements well in advance. Now, I have no ideal how these events are brought about contractually, but I would find it surprising if there weren't some detail in such a document.

I guess you can tell that I do a fair amount of work with and for lawyers.

I'd have to believe that USAC's sanctioning agreement, like any other USAC paperwork, clear outlines the tracks' needing to mmet requirements for safety and insurance. But having said that, and having never seen a sanctioning agreement, I don't know whether USAC's contract was met, or even reviewed by the promoter at Union County. And did USAC ever inspect the track given its "history", as it were of being marginally safe.

While USAC and Kevin Miller have apologized for the debacle, all of this could have been avoided with proper preparation and investigation of the facility prior to the signing of the sanctioning agreement.

Does USAC have a competition director, or competition committee, that has the responsibility to ensure that any facility meets USAC standards and requirements? If it does, where was the breakdown? If it doesn't, well, I certainly hope that they learn from this incident and form a committee - quickly....

This is a black eye to all responsible - the promoter, USAC, and the owners/drivers. They ALL had on obligation to the fans to explain the reason forthe cancellation. And if the track announcer questioned the drivers' "manhood" for leaving, well. shame on him, too. Let's hope he was not justifying the track's position......

This is just sad, yet so preventable....Let's hope that everyone learns from it...including the fans. We are the reason that tracks hold races and that drivers/owners compete...if USAC loses us, well, it goes without saying what will happen next....

:thumbsdown::thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

thebus79h · 8/8/08, 11:34 AM

Thank you for the teams that stayed, and put on a race. Was it work the 20 bucks I paid to get in, no, it wasn't. I paid that much to watch a USAC race, and when that didn't happen, it was upsetting.

The biggest problem I have with the whole thing, the DRIVERS should have explained to the people at the track why they weren't racing. All of those people didn't even have a damned clue what was going on. When you're sitting in the stands, and you see haulers leaving, that's just wrong. You make an announcement before you even remotely let anyone leave. Those people in UC have never seen a midget race before (a lot of them haven't). We brought in at least 7 or 8 people by telling them how awesome it is. Well, now we look like idiots because of that.

Will I go back to a USAC race, who knows, but I really feel that everyone in the grandstands was cheated, and not even given a chance why. Put yourself in someones shoes that hasn't ever seen one of these races before, now how does everybody look? They race there every week (yes stock cars, whatever), but to the average joe fan that really honestly doesn't know, they can't understand why all these big time drivers won't race at their track. It was a slap in the face for how it was handled, and never should have went as far as it did.

8/8/08, 11:37 AM

Wow, those pictures make the story quite a bit clearer than it had been. Thanks for posting those, it sheds a lot of light on the deal.

It's an absolute travesty that USAC let this happen, obviously. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, USAC ought to have the process of going to new speedways down pat by now. They had months to send someone, even the janitor, an hour east. Just another chapter in their War and Peace-length book of screwups though, if you ask me.

As far as the drivers are concerned, I don't know who all stayed besides Christian, Shuman, Hess, Buckwalter and Ballou, but anyone who did gets big brownie points from me. That's what a racer does. Period. I do understand though that the majority of the guys probably wanted to stay but were left rideless by their owners leaving (although it's unclear just how USAC came to the decision to leave, whether it was a driver vote or an owner vote). Maybe the answer to that question will become more available in the coming days.

This does bring another question to my mind though, and that question is, just how consistent are USAC's race track safety standards? Anyone who's ever been to Kamp knows that the cars in the east parking lot are well within reach of a flipping sprinter, and that the frontstretch fence is way too low. Gas City's extended frontstretch guardrail is going to decapitate an open wheel driver at some point, unless steps are taken to correct it. Chad Boat found a grader out in the open off of turn two at Brownstown earlier this year, and even though it's my favorite race track in the world, Kokomo needs to do something to soften the angle of the pit entrance just shy of turn one.

My point is that USAC went ahead with planned races at all these places this season. Granted, the issues at a couple of those tracks are less glaring than what appeared to be the case last night, but still... It makes me wonder if there wasn't more going on behind the scenes at UCS.

Seadog · 8/8/08, 11:54 AM

Quote:

...This does bring another question to my mind though, and that question is, just how consistent are USAC's race track safety standards?...

I have been around long enough to remember when USAC/AAA would not run a sprint car on a 1/4 mile or even 3/8 mile track. And all tracks had to have a guadrail all the way around and a fence.

thebus79h · 8/8/08, 11:58 AM

And honestly, thinking about it. The midget race was actually very good I thought. Sprint car race wasn't bad, Bland had em covered, that's for sure.

Not many cars left, but the racing was fantastic for what it was. Slidejobs all over the place, would be a good track to race on.

cshuman · 8/8/08, 12:16 PM

While everyone is entitled to their opinion, I didnt see many owners or driver say anything here. First of all, the promotors should be ashamed of a FEW of the concerns that were brought up, some of them were very obvious. With that being said, and I hate sticking up for USAC, but Bill Carey and Jason McCord personally went out and fixed the two major concerns of the competitors which was the front stretch wall, and the rebar in turn three. After that, there was a meeting held to decide whether to run or not, after a small majority said we arent running, Bill Carey said, ok we wont run, and the statement will read, "the competitors decided the track was unsafe." I really believe the vast majority of the drivers wanted to run. Bill never said anything about USACs lack of checking this place out before we ever got there, which is my biggest problem with the whole thing, we pay USAC to represent us and make the moves and calls in our best interest which they obviously dropped the ball on this weeks ago. I do applaud the promotor for saying, look, the fans are here, you guys are here, if you wanna race we will race and run for the advertised purse. He tried to make the best of the situation and that was good. The racing surface really was not that bad, we have raced on MUCH worse in the past month. As far as the safety of the track, this sport is a dangerous sport, always has been, and I dont see that changing anytime soon. I know I have run at MANY tracks that were in the same category as Union County, did I feel I was putting myself in danger? Not anymore then I was at Gas City the night before, or Oskaloosa the night before that. It comes down to some people are in our sport to get somewhere else, and some of us are here to make a living at something we love to do, so if I am stupid for running last night so be it. I am going to Gas City tonight to do what I did last night, race, thats what we do.

shu

8/8/08, 11:12 AM	#54 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
itsanonwingthing Senior Member Race Count This Year: 4 Race Count Last Year: 51 Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 649	When I pulled in and was directed to park over on the MotoX course, and I noticed right away that people had, or were in the process of, parking on the hillside outside turns 1 & 2. It immediately crossed my mind then, that this was 1) crazy for someone to park their vehicle there, and 2) what would happen if a race car went over the wall and clobbered one of these vehicles sitting there. This was all before I even paid to get in, or new anything about a possible safety situation. I just happened to take this photo at that time. What you can’t see in the picture is a 6 ft high pole that was among the cars parked there. There was also a set of bleachers sitting there, and at that time the track crew was using a tow truck to pull the bleachers way from the track/wall. They later would request that these cars be moved, and when I went out after the heat races to move my car from the MotoX whoop de Doo I was parked on, I noticed that there were still two vehicles that had not been moved from the area, and that the pole that was there had hay bales built up around it. Here is a photo I took of that These were some of the safety concerns, along with the aforementioned problems. Some issues cropped up on race night (parking cars in harms way), and they were addressed, the other problems should have been taken car of weeks ago. The USAC office is only an hour drive to Liberty and someone from the USAC office should have visited the track, knowing that there had been questions about safety issues in the past. If the USAC officials had some questions at that time, they should have gone back to UCS with a few drivers to get their opinions. This should/could have been done weeks ago. I, like everyone else, was disappointed that a majority of the cars pulled out, but as they say Poop Occurs, and its on to Bloomington tonight!! Here is a photo of the facility. The calm before the Storm!! __________________ Keith Wendel It's a Non Wing thing,.......you wouldn't understand!

8/8/08, 10:58 AM	#51 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
Tmack_9 Posts: n/a	WOW! :confused: :greenflag:That's alot of info and trash talking going on there. :loser:First off I went to the Brickyard this year and what a horrible diaster that was with all the cautions. Sure I stayed and walked out of there saying I'll never be back again. Will I? Of course it's the Brickyard and I live in Indy. **** happens we all screw up. Okay maybe not 767 or whoever he is but comeon people It happened and it's over. :thumbLet's look forward to an awesome show 2night at Bloomington. A track we know we have nothing to worry about. Alot of you have said you'll never go to a USAC show again. Okay I doubt that's true but if so then have fun watching whatever it is you watch. It's still USAC there gonna get the fans, the sponsors and the drivers. It's like saying I'm not racing NASCAR becuase there tires don't hold up... BE REAL PEOPLE..:rolling And last but not least to say that some of the best drivers in the world that were there last night and to go on the microphone and say they don't have the balls... Are you even kidding me?:kookoo We can obviously tell which people were the smartest out of that group.. Nice Call Union County Speedway. That's my opinion and let the ripping begin. :usac:I'm a USAC Fan proud and True.. Trenton Darland #9

8/8/08, 11:00 AM	#52 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
SPRINTCAR Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,501	I was there and the track was smooth and a grader was not needed. The track was a little dusty at first but it came around after the sun went down. I know one of the guys that work the track and said Usac was there weeks prior watching them do track prep. This race should have been canceled days in advance if there was a safety issue. This is Usac's fault for not giving the track time to correct the problem's. Usac=Usuck!

8/8/08, 11:34 AM	#56 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
thebus79h Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 446	Thank you for the teams that stayed, and put on a race. Was it work the 20 bucks I paid to get in, no, it wasn't. I paid that much to watch a USAC race, and when that didn't happen, it was upsetting. The biggest problem I have with the whole thing, the DRIVERS should have explained to the people at the track why they weren't racing. All of those people didn't even have a damned clue what was going on. When you're sitting in the stands, and you see haulers leaving, that's just wrong. You make an announcement before you even remotely let anyone leave. Those people in UC have never seen a midget race before (a lot of them haven't). We brought in at least 7 or 8 people by telling them how awesome it is. Well, now we look like idiots because of that. Will I go back to a USAC race, who knows, but I really feel that everyone in the grandstands was cheated, and not even given a chance why. Put yourself in someones shoes that hasn't ever seen one of these races before, now how does everybody look? They race there every week (yes stock cars, whatever), but to the average joe fan that really honestly doesn't know, they can't understand why all these big time drivers won't race at their track. It was a slap in the face for how it was handled, and never should have went as far as it did.

8/8/08, 11:37 AM	#57 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
Fisher79 Posts: n/a	Wow, those pictures make the story quite a bit clearer than it had been. Thanks for posting those, it sheds a lot of light on the deal. It's an absolute travesty that USAC let this happen, obviously. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, USAC ought to have the process of going to new speedways down pat by now. They had months to send someone, even the janitor, an hour east. Just another chapter in their War and Peace-length book of screwups though, if you ask me. As far as the drivers are concerned, I don't know who all stayed besides Christian, Shuman, Hess, Buckwalter and Ballou, but anyone who did gets big brownie points from me. That's what a racer does. Period. I do understand though that the majority of the guys probably wanted to stay but were left rideless by their owners leaving (although it's unclear just how USAC came to the decision to leave, whether it was a driver vote or an owner vote). Maybe the answer to that question will become more available in the coming days. This does bring another question to my mind though, and that question is, just how consistent are USAC's race track safety standards? Anyone who's ever been to Kamp knows that the cars in the east parking lot are well within reach of a flipping sprinter, and that the frontstretch fence is way too low. Gas City's extended frontstretch guardrail is going to decapitate an open wheel driver at some point, unless steps are taken to correct it. Chad Boat found a grader out in the open off of turn two at Brownstown earlier this year, and even though it's my favorite race track in the world, Kokomo needs to do something to soften the angle of the pit entrance just shy of turn one. My point is that USAC went ahead with planned races at all these places this season. Granted, the issues at a couple of those tracks are less glaring than what appeared to be the case last night, but still... It makes me wonder if there wasn't more going on behind the scenes at UCS.

8/8/08, 11:58 AM	#59 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
thebus79h Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 446	And honestly, thinking about it. The midget race was actually very good I thought. Sprint car race wasn't bad, Bland had em covered, that's for sure. Not many cars left, but the racing was fantastic for what it was. Slidejobs all over the place, would be a good track to race on.

8/8/08, 12:16 PM	#60 Re: UNION COUNTY - Midget Week
cshuman Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 809	While everyone is entitled to their opinion, I didnt see many owners or driver say anything here. First of all, the promotors should be ashamed of a FEW of the concerns that were brought up, some of them were very obvious. With that being said, and I hate sticking up for USAC, but Bill Carey and Jason McCord personally went out and fixed the two major concerns of the competitors which was the front stretch wall, and the rebar in turn three. After that, there was a meeting held to decide whether to run or not, after a small majority said we arent running, Bill Carey said, ok we wont run, and the statement will read, "the competitors decided the track was unsafe." I really believe the vast majority of the drivers wanted to run. Bill never said anything about USACs lack of checking this place out before we ever got there, which is my biggest problem with the whole thing, we pay USAC to represent us and make the moves and calls in our best interest which they obviously dropped the ball on this weeks ago. I do applaud the promotor for saying, look, the fans are here, you guys are here, if you wanna race we will race and run for the advertised purse. He tried to make the best of the situation and that was good. The racing surface really was not that bad, we have raced on MUCH worse in the past month. As far as the safety of the track, this sport is a dangerous sport, always has been, and I dont see that changing anytime soon. I know I have run at MANY tracks that were in the same category as Union County, did I feel I was putting myself in danger? Not anymore then I was at Gas City the night before, or Oskaloosa the night before that. It comes down to some people are in our sport to get somewhere else, and some of us are here to make a living at something we love to do, so if I am stupid for running last night so be it. I am going to Gas City tonight to do what I did last night, race, thats what we do. shu