[sceckert]

Most of us there don't believe he WAS "life-flighted". It was 15 minutes or so after the ambulance took him away from the crash when the helicopter left, and that was more likely for a roadside call than for transport of Darren. It's possible, but I sort of doubt the transport had him in it. The x-factor here, previously unmentioned, is that the accident never should have happened had the flagman not thrown a nonsense yellow for a lightning-quick 360 that Kevin Thomas did and kept going. It was unnecessary to throw that flag, period. And it set up the incentive for Hagen to take a shot at Ballou that put him on the razor's edge of an unforgiving cushion after several laps of just running comfortably. This is becoming fairly epidemic, these days, with hair-trigger cautions being thrown for incidents that do not otherwise have an effect on the race. Best of luck to Darren, of course, as the crash was vicious by any measure, and he reached scary altitude before coming back down to the track.

Originally Posted by sceckert Most of us there don't believe he WAS "life-flighted". It was 15 minutes or so after the ambulance took him away from the crash when the helicopter left, and that was more likely for a roadside call than for transport of Darren. It's possible, but I sort of doubt the transport had him in it. The x-factor here, previously unmentioned, is that the accident never should have happened had the flagman not thrown a nonsense yellow for a lightning-quick 360 that Kevin Thomas did and kept going. It was unnecessary to throw that flag, period. And it set up the incentive for Hagen to take a shot at Ballou that put him on the razor's edge of an unforgiving cushion after several laps of just running comfortably. This is becoming fairly epidemic, these days, with hair-trigger cautions being thrown for incidents that do not otherwise have an effect on the race. Best of luck to Darren, of course, as the crash was vicious by any measure, and he reached scary altitude before coming back down to the track.

Nonsense yellow or not, it's still Hagen in the seat.

[midgy]

Originally Posted by sceckert Most of us there don't believe he WAS "life-flighted". It was 15 minutes or so after the ambulance took him away from the crash when the helicopter left, and that was more likely for a roadside call than for transport of Darren. It's possible, but I sort of doubt the transport had him in it. The x-factor here, previously unmentioned, is that the accident never should have happened had the flagman not thrown a nonsense yellow for a lightning-quick 360 that Kevin Thomas did and kept going. It was unnecessary to throw that flag, period. And it set up the incentive for Hagen to take a shot at Ballou that put him on the razor's edge of an unforgiving cushion after several laps of just running comfortably. This is becoming fairly epidemic, these days, with hair-trigger cautions being thrown for incidents that do not otherwise have an effect on the race. Best of luck to Darren, of course, as the crash was vicious by any measure, and he reached scary altitude before coming back down to the track.

I was at the driver's meeting and Bill Carey said that they would go caution for ALL 360 spins.

[sceckert]

Originally Posted by midgy I was at the driver's meeting and Bill Carey said that they would go caution for ALL 360 spins.

I don't doubt that at all. But it's idiotic. A guy in last place half a track from the leaders with two to go who executes a 360 and continues may merit a Black Flag, but stacking up a field that is otherwise strung out breeds just the sort of incident that happens here. Of course Hagen was still the one who jumped the cushion, but the hair-trigger caution--while policy, perhaps--is s-t-u-p-i-d.
All occurrences should have the particulars of the moment taken into consideration. That caution was unnecessary. It set the table for what transpired.

[Charles Nungester]

Lisa, Thanks for the update.

To say the yellow caused the crash is Ludicrous at best. It setup a restart on which the accident happened but IMHO thats grasping at straws considering ALL RULES and PROCEDURES were followed as PRE STATED.

Do I think the race could have continued without the caution? Probably but done as stated is just that.

The other scenario is that KT spun, It remains green and these cars run down KT at twice the speed. SOmeone else gets injured, then blames being laid on the starter for not throwing a yellow.

I wasn't trying to yell just emphasize.

Get well Darren.
Chuck

[wildthing1h]

the reson for the yellow was cause thomas jr done a 360. drivers were told in the drivers meeting that no matter what if you done a 360 and stopped or kept rolling you would recieve the black flag and that the yellow would come out due to the high speeds of that track. good rule i believe it should be kept in place at all usac races this season.

[6157]

Originally Posted by wildthing1h the reson for the yellow was cause thomas jr done a 360. drivers were told in the drivers meeting that no matter what if you done a 360 and stopped or kept rolling you would recieve the black flag and that the yellow would come out due to the high speeds of that track. good rule i believe it should be kept in place at all usac races this season.

Dumb rule.

You have to be told to slow down to avoid a spinning car? You probably shouldn't be racing then.

[racefan20]

The spin was low in turn 4 a hard place to see for approaching cars. Have you ever been there? Eldora is quite a different animal than the tracks out on the left coast.

[sceckert]

Originally Posted by racefan20 The spin was low in turn 4 a hard place to see for approaching cars. Have you ever been there? Eldora is quite a different animal than the tracks out on the left coast.

The spin was also half a track from the leaders with two to go and was executed very quickly. If that is the rule, that is the rule, but I believe circumstances are peculiar to any occurrence, and that 360 was not a compromising one. Had that rule not been authored, the incident should not have brought out a yellow. There should be incentive for a racer to not stop in the event of a spin of this nature.
The caution flag set the table for what happened next. It is a case-study in the potential inherent in the yellow flag-black flag for a spin rule.
I understand the rule. I don't and won't agree with it.
But it's all incidental to Darren's well-being, which is the only important by-product of all this drama now.

Steve,

I love you to death - but somehow pointing the finger at Tom Hansing in this situation is a bit like this logic. Darren gets hurt, falls in love with a knock out nurse at the Miami Valley Hospital - they get married, and have a son who is very smart and in time becomes a real mover and shaker - The son, in turn, marries an exotic Russian beauty who is well connected politically, and through the union, Darren's son becomes the most powerful man in Russia. Unbeknowst to him, his bride is evil, and she slips him a tonic which causes him to lose all bearings - So while derranged, he sets into motion events that lead to a nuclear holocaust --- and this all started because Tom Hansing threw the yellow on a lazy 360 spin during a sprint car race at Rossburg Ohio.