[opnwhlmnd]

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester Did you read the article?

Yes teacher I read the article this spring when it came out. Do I need to pass a 10 question quiz now?

While I have much respect for Gappens any article with a Kenny Brown opinion is pretty much worthless to me. I think it's hilarious that his Extreme/POWRi merger has only hurt POWRi.

National engines
Production based engines
D2 engines

Paging Don Moore for advice on the topic.

Face it midgets are not a weekly class, except in Badger land, or a weekly touring series. USAC does the traveling series the best as evident in their car counts. Badger does it best for local/regional shows.

We still haven't answered the OPs question of why small car counts the last two USAC Midget shows. Had 31 at Lawrenceburg midget week so it can't be all doom and gloom as this forum prefers.

[Charles Nungester]

Originally Posted by opnwhlmnd Yes teacher I read the article this spring when it came out. Do I need to pass a 10 question quiz now? While I have much respect for Gappens any article with a Kenny Brown opinion is pretty much worthless to me. I think it's hilarious that his Extreme/POWRi merger has only hurt POWRi. National engines Production based engines D2 engines Paging Don Moore for advice on the topic. Face it midgets are not a weekly class, except in Badger land, or a weekly touring series. USAC does the traveling series the best as evident in their car counts. Badger does it best for local/regional shows. We still haven't answered the OPs question of why small car counts the last two USAC Midget shows. Had 31 at Lawrenceburg midget week so it can't be all doom and gloom as this forum prefers.

Im not all doom and gloom but I want a future for the sport. Every track can't run saturday night and every racer can't race two or three times a week..

That is why I've been asking for co-operation and possible alternatives. Anyone know what Montpelier got for steel block sat night? Bet it was the highest count of the four tracks that ran.

And you are right about midgets not being weekly. Haven't been anywhere close to it since the Namars, Cora days.

[Vookie]

Moles and Denny are recovering from injuries, Thorson and KTJ were racing winged sprints. Jesse Love was racing at DuQuion in a ARCA race on Sunday night. Mariah Ide was a MIA.
All 6 drivers are in the top 25 in USAC points.

Chance Crum was racing local sprints at Bloomington and LPS.

https://usacracing.com/standings/midget

Extreme points,
https://xtremeoutlawseries.com/series-points/

Powri Points
http://www.powri.com/points/?c=1037&i=22453&t=Drivers

[BrentTFunk]

I think one of the problems with sprints and late models is that they are too divided up. You used to just have late models. Now you have several different types of crates, limited etc. Same with sprints. You have 305, 360, 410, steel block. So you take a small pie, and slice it into a bunch of pieces. This results in a less entertaining program for spectators. Even though the cost is lower, they race for less.
I also think the weekly schedule is too long at some tracks. Low buck guys can't afford to race that much. A car owner told me over 10 years ago, it costs him $2000 a night to race. Bet that number has not went down. All this did not happen overnight. It has been coming for a long time. I noticed that guys who run the economy classes still have enclosed trailers, 4 wheelers, side by sides. Stuff that 30 years ago no one had, and they were still able to race.

[Charles Nungester]

Originally Posted by BrentTFunk I think one of the problems with sprints and late models is that they are too divided up. You used to just have late models. Now you have several different types of crates, limited etc. Same with sprints. You have 305, 360, 410, steel block. So you take a small pie, and slice it into a bunch of pieces. This results in a less entertaining program for spectators. Even though the cost is lower, they race for less. I also think the weekly schedule is too long at some tracks. Low buck guys can't afford to race that much. A car owner told me over 10 years ago, it costs him $2000 a night to race. Bet that number has not went down. All this did not happen overnight. It has been coming for a long time. I noticed that guys who run the economy classes still have enclosed trailers, 4 wheelers, side by sides. Stuff that 30 years ago no one had, and they were still able to race.

I've said this too. Not sure about the they race for less thing as there are a bunch of higher paying races for lower classes. Modifieds were once a claim budget class to get people into the sport and headed toward LMS now how many 5-10k races are there for Mods?

[Vookie]

Tmez on the Badger midget class.

"Pro versus average Joe’s. We are at Angel Park speedway in Sun, Prairie Wisconsin. They have a smaller midget division called the badger series. They raise a less horsepower four-cylinder motor. This is the K 20 motor. They also run a eco-tech motor and I was asked to drive one of the cars while we were up there, racing the national midget. I was unable to make practice in that set the night Behind. Turns out it was pretty good entertainment for my YouTube channel as always. Thanks for watching."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf2vT4ph5TI

[Chief Wahoo]

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester Anyone know what Montpelier got for steel block sat night? Bet it was the highest count of the four tracks that ran.

20 is your answer

[Hubie48]

I'm just a fan, but years ago I had money in the sport

Midget racing NEVER made sense from an economical standpoint.

Now, running a Autocraft at the SpeedDrome once a week was a total blast. We would run IRP races and had a ghost of a chance. Then the Pontiac showed up. That was the beginning of the end of affordable midget racing.

If KKM boycotted, the entire USAC series would die!

[spankytoo]

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester Did you read the article? Gappens says 1500-5000 to win are non economical to race. Also Sun this track host D2 which cost half. From what I seen with Florence, Paragon and others running 10k to win races and barely having full fields for them for LM's Sprints and midgets aren't far behind. The evidence is everywhere.

Question: Why do big paying races get less cars?
Answer: Lack of purse clarity. Sure there are two sprint car races in the state of indiana in the next two weeks that pay $20K each to the winner. What does 2nd pay? What does 20th pay? National teams take home the money. The lower end teams lose money, or maybe break even if they can finish top 12. Especially when a local races pays $5K to win. The usac guy comes and nabs it. Then it's standard payout from 2nd on back.

The knoxville nationals gets the car count because the payout makes it worth it. Every main pays out! Even if you transfer! This is how you grow a race / series.

https://www.knoxvilleraceway.com/Art...rease-for-2023

[Charles Nungester]

USAC is clear as day on payout and start money is three times Reg shows payout. At least double. It's in their schedule under event info.

BURG
SPRINT FEATURE POINTS/PURSE STRUCTURE:

POS. PTS. PURSE

1 70 $20,000

2 67 $8,000

3 64 $4,000

4 61 $2,000

5 58 $1,750

6 55 $1,500

7 52 $1,200

8 49 $1,000

9 46 $900

10 43 $800

11 41 $775

12 39 $750

13 37 $725

14 35 $700

15 33 $675

16 31 $650

17 29 $625

18 27 $600

19 25 $600

20 23 $600

21 23 $600

22 23 $600

This thread will lock soon so. Reply quickly.

It also helps to have several nights of racing so teams have a chance to recoupe some of the travel moneyh One off shows don't draw from far distance. But Sprint Week, Smack down. Knox Nationals, Kings Royal, Tuscadora do have multiple nights to make it feesable to put a thousand in the tank to get there and back.