OT: MWR, Boyer, NASCAR

djbamber · 9/11/13, 5:40 PM

This has been going on for a long time. I remember Jeff Gordon's first championship for Rick Hendrick at the last race of the year, there was another team car entered. No sponsor except one of Hendrick's Chevy dealerships. The car was painted plain white. ESPN commentators Jerry Punch, and Bob Jenkins commented on the extra team car at the start of the race. I think that after Jeff had accumulated enough points to win the WC championship, the unsponsored team car retired. One would be left to believe that the extra car out there was to help " game" the system. Anyone else out there remember this?

old time Hoosier · 9/11/13, 5:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REH24

This is nothing new, teams been doing this for a long time but now with the MWR deal the media will make a big deal about it. Next will about teams letting other team members pass to pick up the extra 5 points. Media will be digging up things that been going on from the start of racing and make news out of it.
REH

Never been a big fan of NASCAR but I will admit they certainly know how to market their product better than any other sport including the stick and ball bunch. The problem that I have seen surface with NASCAR is similiar to the World of Outlaws in that they have far to many rules. So many in fact that they themselves loose track of the correct inforcment with consistent infractons. Or, in other words, they fail to keep a record of penalties enforced and make knee jerks reactions with unGodly punishments. The Boyer spin wasn't the first of such incidents and correct me if I am wrong but didn't Dale Earnhardt Jr. spin on purpose to keep from being lapped a couple of years back at (I think) Bristol. His punishment was a warning if I remember correctly. Again correct me as I am not that big of a NASCAR follower but when an accident occurs on the track isn't it a automatic yellow flag? If that is the case then Mark Martin won the Daytona 500 a few years back as he was leading off the fourth turn when a crash occured behind him and the race remained in a green flag condition and Harvick caught and passed Martin and won the race. Should not the yellow flag waved at the moment of the crash and thus finished under the yellow and Martin would have won. Yet this summer in a similiar incident they (NASCAR) reversed themselves and DID throw the yellow on the last front stretch of the last lap. That is two different enforcements of the same rule infraction isn't it?
At any rate this is a big bruise on the ego of NASCAR and if sponsors are questioning these policies it might possibly be time for some changes.

Gregg · 9/11/13, 8:55 PM

The mess is getting bigger.

NASCAR is looking into Penske Racing and Front Row Motorsports. Apparently David Gilliland was asked to let Joey Logano pass. The pass allowed Logano to grab the 10th and final non wild card spot in The Chase. hmmmmm!

http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/stor...-091113#!i4hdr

Mud Packer · 9/11/13, 9:59 PM

A real easy way to fix all of this. DUMP THE CHASE. Also get rid of the sleezy dog rule and also automatic qualifiers and level the playing field. Start the 43 fastest cars in qualifying and get rid of provisionals and past champions provisionals. While they are at it, how about the green, white, checkered fix as well.

Oh wait, that won't work. Mike Helton and crew can't manufacture entertainment like the WWE. Remember when racing was easy to follow.

SteveB31 · 9/11/13, 10:25 PM

I have a great idea. Lets do it like us dirt guys do it. No spotters, no two way radios, no mirrors, no pit stops and the fastest car wins. Pretty simple idea huh?

ISF · 9/12/13, 12:14 AM

This kinda' stuff, at least from a fan perspective, seems to be the by-product of huge conglomerate multi-car ownership. Team orders are perfectly legal in Formula 1 which lets everyone off the hook in reference to enforcement and penalties. When the sanction tries to regulate and enforce in these matters is where things can, and sometimes will, get murky. I don't like team orders but they are unavoidable with multiple ownership.

In regards to NASCAR teams qualifying a car/cars driven by non-regular Cup drivers and having that car/cars to fall out or re-enter the race, whichever is needed, Richard Childress Racing did that kinda' stuff very successfully way back when Earnhardt was in points battles. Neil Bonnet and Jeff Purvis are two names that come to mind among drivers who filled the seats of those RCR accessory teams but I believe there were more. This stuff took place well before Gordon won his first Cup championship so that might have been where HMS got the idea in 1995.

Sprintcarfanatic · 9/12/13, 6:28 AM

AHHHHHhhhhhhhhh stay tuned until tomorrow for more of As The Stomach Churns.

apexonephoto · 9/12/13, 7:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djbamber

This has been going on for a long time. I remember Jeff Gordon's first championship for Rick Hendrick at the last race of the year, there was another team car entered. No sponsor except one of Hendrick's Chevy dealerships. The car was painted plain white. ESPN commentators Jerry Punch, and Bob Jenkins commented on the extra team car at the start of the race. I think that after Jeff had accumulated enough points to win the WC championship, the unsponsored team car retired. One would be left to believe that the extra car out there was to help " game" the system. Anyone else out there remember this?

Jeff Purvis was the driver
http://www.racintoday.com/archives/42932

ronmil · 9/12/13, 3:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronmil

Anybody remember the illegal fuel episode at Daytona when MWR first entered NASCAR and the Toyotas were struggling to qualify? Don't remember all the details, but there was a substantial fine and suspension of some MWR personnel.

Didn't notice that this episode was mentioned in post #21.

Shawn · 9/12/13, 3:43 PM

IMO, if NASCAR is going to blame the penalties on Michael Waltrip Racing on the radio traffic they reviewed, then there should be a penalty against Penske. Or, it could be against Penske and Front Row Motorsports. It's pretty much the same exact thing that happened with MWR, but it was letting a car pass on track for one position. So, it's not quite as bad as slowing down, then pitting to lose more spots, but it's an obvious attempt to affect the outcome.

If NASCAR would've admitted that they thought the spin (by Bowyer) was intentional and included that fact in their penalty, then they could get by without a big penalty against Front Row Motorsports and Penske. I feel like they now have their hands tied. However, I can see them coming up with some dumb excuse and not penalizing Front Row Motorsports and Penske, or at least not harshly. I think at this point in the week, they don't want to affect the Chase by taking away or adding drivers.

They could take away points from Logano, but that isn't fair because they didn't affect Bowyer's Chase position by taking away points going into this weekend. Once again, NASCAR put themselves in a bind. Bowyer should've been docked points that affected his Chase position. He should've stared 12th, like twenty points behind 11th, for example. Instead, he's the same position, the same amount of points out of the lead and nothing is really affected for his Chase run.

As hard as the penalty seemed at the time, NASCAR left too many open holes in their defense of the penalties. So, I guess we'll see how this plays out, but one thing is for sure, they've totally screwed up NASCAR as a whole and this is what they have ended up with.

9/12/13, 12:14 AM	#36 Re: OT: MWR, Boyer, NASCAR
ISF Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 3,044	This kinda' stuff, at least from a fan perspective, seems to be the by-product of huge conglomerate multi-car ownership. Team orders are perfectly legal in Formula 1 which lets everyone off the hook in reference to enforcement and penalties. When the sanction tries to regulate and enforce in these matters is where things can, and sometimes will, get murky. I don't like team orders but they are unavoidable with multiple ownership. In regards to NASCAR teams qualifying a car/cars driven by non-regular Cup drivers and having that car/cars to fall out or re-enter the race, whichever is needed, Richard Childress Racing did that kinda' stuff very successfully way back when Earnhardt was in points battles. Neil Bonnet and Jeff Purvis are two names that come to mind among drivers who filled the seats of those RCR accessory teams but I believe there were more. This stuff took place well before Gordon won his first Cup championship so that might have been where HMS got the idea in 1995. __________________ Silver Crown Championship Dirt Cars properly driven on a one mile dirt track are classic poetry in motion. Using that analogy, Jack Hewitt is one of the greatest poets of all time.

9/11/13, 5:40 PM	#31 Re: OT: MWR, Boyer, NASCAR
djbamber Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 89	This has been going on for a long time. I remember Jeff Gordon's first championship for Rick Hendrick at the last race of the year, there was another team car entered. No sponsor except one of Hendrick's Chevy dealerships. The car was painted plain white. ESPN commentators Jerry Punch, and Bob Jenkins commented on the extra team car at the start of the race. I think that after Jeff had accumulated enough points to win the WC championship, the unsponsored team car retired. One would be left to believe that the extra car out there was to help " game" the system. Anyone else out there remember this?

9/11/13, 8:55 PM	#33 Re: OT: MWR, Boyer, NASCAR
Gregg Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 3,941	The mess is getting bigger. NASCAR is looking into Penske Racing and Front Row Motorsports. Apparently David Gilliland was asked to let Joey Logano pass. The pass allowed Logano to grab the 10th and final non wild card spot in The Chase. hmmmmm! http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/stor...-091113#!i4hdr

9/12/13, 6:28 AM	#37 Re: OT: MWR, Boyer, NASCAR
Sprintcarfanatic Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 755	AHHHHHhhhhhhhhh stay tuned until tomorrow for more of As The Stomach Churns.

9/12/13, 3:43 PM	#40
Shawn Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 452	IMO, if NASCAR is going to blame the penalties on Michael Waltrip Racing on the radio traffic they reviewed, then there should be a penalty against Penske. Or, it could be against Penske and Front Row Motorsports. It's pretty much the same exact thing that happened with MWR, but it was letting a car pass on track for one position. So, it's not quite as bad as slowing down, then pitting to lose more spots, but it's an obvious attempt to affect the outcome. If NASCAR would've admitted that they thought the spin (by Bowyer) was intentional and included that fact in their penalty, then they could get by without a big penalty against Front Row Motorsports and Penske. I feel like they now have their hands tied. However, I can see them coming up with some dumb excuse and not penalizing Front Row Motorsports and Penske, or at least not harshly. I think at this point in the week, they don't want to affect the Chase by taking away or adding drivers. They could take away points from Logano, but that isn't fair because they didn't affect Bowyer's Chase position by taking away points going into this weekend. Once again, NASCAR put themselves in a bind. Bowyer should've been docked points that affected his Chase position. He should've stared 12th, like twenty points behind 11th, for example. Instead, he's the same position, the same amount of points out of the lead and nothing is really affected for his Chase run. As hard as the penalty seemed at the time, NASCAR left too many open holes in their defense of the penalties. So, I guess we'll see how this plays out, but one thing is for sure, they've totally screwed up NASCAR as a whole and this is what they have ended up with.