Question about passing points

Jonr · 7/16/17, 9:43 AM

Is the passing points determined on the starting positions on the line up board or the starting position that takes the green? i.e. When a car breaks during hot laps that was due to start on the pole, and everyone simply moves up a spot on the inside what happens with the passing points. Same question when the front row cannot get a line up completed and get moved back a row?

Thanks
Jon R

Stevensville Mike · 7/16/17, 10:35 AM

If I remember correctly, when SOD used the passing points a few years back for a few years, it was where the car was from the draw. So, if you are 6th, and get moved to 4th, you start in 6th per the points. This would be the same if, let's say, the pole car wishes to drop to the rear, for whatever reason. He could not claim starting in the rear. He is given the pole to start.

Although, in theory, passing points is a great formula, especially when qualifying doesn't occur, it complicates things WAAAAAAAY too much for the average fan. Just use the "top x cars advance". Keep it simple.

Jim Gardner · 7/16/17, 10:41 AM

Passing points isn't overly complicated. They're preliminary races, average fans can understand "every pass means points."

I believe chili bowl, powri and such classify starting position based on the cars position at the one to go from the flag man.

markmckeon · 7/16/17, 10:49 AM

"Advancement from heat race to features is based upon passing points earned in heat race and qualifying races. Passing points are based upon car starting position when the yellow light goes out prior to the initial start of the heat or qualifying race." Source: chilibowl.com

Jonr · 7/16/17, 1:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Gardner

Passing points isn't overly complicated. They're preliminary races, average fans can understand "every pass means points.".......

As someone who has watched a lot of ASCS races, they are overly complicated. How a third place finish in one heat is not worth as many places as a fifth place finish is another heat is complicated. Also, how winning a heat race does not earn you the most points possible is complicated.

With that all being said, I do not want to watch time trials at every race that I go to. I think that there are pros and cons to both formats.

jaybird · 7/16/17, 1:48 PM

Once you get a copy of the formula that they use to figure passing points it is easier to understand. Basically it rewards every position gained and penalizes for position lost. The only exception is for the pole setter who only gets maximum number of points for a win.

markmckeon · 7/16/17, 9:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaybird

once you get a copy of the formula that they use to figure passing points it is easier to understand. Basically it rewards every position gained and penalizes for position lost. The only exception is for the pole setter who only gets maximum number of points for a win.

passing points chart.jpg

BrentTFunk · 7/17/17, 11:28 AM

I used to like passing points because it saved the track, but the time you add qualifiers you wear it out even more. Try to explain to a casual fan setting around you and it is even more confusing. The worst part is the fastest two cars start on the front of the feature.

illiNOISE · 7/17/17, 1:49 PM

I wish most announcers would do a better job of explaining whatever the track or series formula is. The fact that they often don't leads me to wonder if THEY don't even understand it.

As long as you're not dealing with a super large car count (think Chili Bowl), I think a compromise system could be devised. Say you have three or four heats. Take the top two finishers from each to a dash. To line the dash up, refer to those competitors pill draw numbers. Then invert them. (So someone who wins their heat from the pole would likely start the dash from near the tail, while a racer who finishes 2nd after starting way back in their heat has a shot at the pole.) This basically would yield very similar results as using points, but with FAR LESS MATH.

Stevensville Mike · 7/17/17, 3:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markmckeon

Attachment 21163

Yeah.... that HALF point always leads to sure confusion. Now the math gets even tougher.....

And, as illiNOISE pointed out (above) I often wonder if the track announcer understands the format. For places that run sprints weekly..... sure. But when a small touring series comes to town, like SOD or GLSS, my question mark referring to the announcer goes up.

7/16/17, 10:41 AM	#3
Jim Gardner Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 566	Passing points isn't overly complicated. They're preliminary races, average fans can understand "every pass means points." I believe chili bowl, powri and such classify starting position based on the cars position at the one to go from the flag man. __________________ Jim Gardner

7/17/17, 1:49 PM	#9
illiNOISE Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 886	I wish most announcers would do a better job of explaining whatever the track or series formula is. The fact that they often don't leads me to wonder if THEY don't even understand it. As long as you're not dealing with a super large car count (think Chili Bowl), I think a compromise system could be devised. Say you have three or four heats. Take the top two finishers from each to a dash. To line the dash up, refer to those competitors pill draw numbers. Then invert them. (So someone who wins their heat from the pole would likely start the dash from near the tail, while a racer who finishes 2nd after starting way back in their heat has a shot at the pole.) This basically would yield very similar results as using points, but with FAR LESS MATH. __________________ Even Roman Chariots ran non-wing, and on dirt. Hail Caesar!

7/16/17, 9:43 AM	#1 Question about passing points
Jonr Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1,626	Is the passing points determined on the starting positions on the line up board or the starting position that takes the green? i.e. When a car breaks during hot laps that was due to start on the pole, and everyone simply moves up a spot on the inside what happens with the passing points. Same question when the front row cannot get a line up completed and get moved back a row? Thanks Jon R

7/16/17, 10:49 AM	#4 Re: Question about passing points
markmckeon Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 25	"Advancement from heat race to features is based upon passing points earned in heat race and qualifying races. Passing points are based upon car starting position when the yellow light goes out prior to the initial start of the heat or qualifying race." Source: chilibowl.com

7/16/17, 1:48 PM	#6
jaybird Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 213	Once you get a copy of the formula that they use to figure passing points it is easier to understand. Basically it rewards every position gained and penalizes for position lost. The only exception is for the pole setter who only gets maximum number of points for a win.

7/17/17, 11:28 AM	#8 Re: Question about passing points
BrentTFunk Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 17,257	I used to like passing points because it saved the track, but the time you add qualifiers you wear it out even more. Try to explain to a casual fan setting around you and it is even more confusing. The worst part is the fastest two cars start on the front of the feature.