[hogan6]

Originally Posted by OnTheHammer He certainly wasn't on J.W. Hunts christmas card list, nor Hewitt's.

Who cares? Nobody got more out of a racecar than Vogler. A true racer. Like him or not. When he showed up you knew the event has gonna be better.

[old time Hoosier]

In 1986, when USAC came to Minnesota, Rich Vogler argeed to arrive two days ahead of the race and go on a PR tour. He promoted not only the speedway where the USAC'ers were to run he also was an excellent spokesman for sprint car racing and the USAC organization. I accompanied him to 2 TV stations and 3 radio stations and he was gracious and accomodating to the media people and left a good impression of sprint car racing. He was also very confident in his abilities and told every interview that " I will win the race" He didn't win but made no excuses afterward. The fee he charged for this two day excursion? The speedway paid for the fuel in his airplane and that was all. He was the epitome of a professional race car driver and handled all of the PR duties like a businessman / executive.

Originally Posted by racefan20 YA know Derek you arent and never have been important enough to me to bother knowing where you sit at Kokomo but if you want me to call you an ass to your face and you know where I sit(top row just to the turn 4 side of the booth) have at it. Actually I WASNT a Rich Vogler fan when he was racing, I rooted for Steve Butler. My late wife began helping Mrs Vogler with the scholarship many years ago and through that I got to know her and admire her spirit and her will to keep her sons name alive by helping others. So I am much more an Eleanor apologist than a Rich apologist. Either way I dont appreciate you kicking dirt on someones grave and hurting the feelings of someone I care very much for and am protective of. She has done more for the racing communuity than someone like you can even imagine. You on the other hand only want to get on your soapbox and kick people around from the safety of your keyboard. A case in point is your accusations that BC was little rich kid that bought his way into the sport, which if you actually had the facts you would know is absolutely not true. I know that I am wasting my time on this rant but i had to get this off of my chest. You know he must have really got under your skin if you cant get over it 19 years later. Grow up!!

I offered you the invite to approach me, don't turn it around. If you have a legitimate ***** with me, one that means enough to you to name-call, come see me. If not, stay behind "the safety of your keyboard", as you put it. We sit just down and to the turn one side of Dean's stand, and have for all my 27 years.

You want to talk about "importance"? You really are a legend in your own mind. I'm usually not quite this childish, but since you opened the door, I'll gladly walk through it. Let's survey the pit area, maybe then we'll see whose name carries more weight, if you want to play that game. Speaking of that, I loved this little gem: "More for the racing community than someone like you can even imagine"? Who is someone like me? Someone who's been around the sport all his life? Someone who's seen it intimately from both sides, rather than just from the stands? The myopic viewpoint of the average race fan is the problem that people have with specific posters on this board, and the board in general. Trust me.

Didn't kick dirt on anyone's grave, I was just voicing a pretty common thought. Sure enough, more people agree than do not. Eleanor's work is admirable. Rich's track record was and is admirable. I'm not sure what your malfunction is that makes it impossible for you to understand that someone can respect the accomplishment, but dislike how it got done. My post had nothing to do with Eleanor. If she read this thread and got upset, she's putting too much credence into others' opinions of Rich. There are very rarely Vogler-themed threads here. There were people fawning over the guy right and left in this one. When else was I going to bring it up?

Lastly, enough with the Clauson thing. I know you and Shaw love to bring it up but that thread happened almost two years ago. It started about Tim Clauson's love affair with Turkey Night being on pavement. Then it migrated to Bryan. I didn't and don't know the Clausons' financial affairs, but if I remember correctly my point was about the equipment that Bryan started in. Not everyone gets the benefit of that type of stuff starting out, although it's pretty common nowadays. Rake me over the coals all you want, but if you know your ass from third base, you know that what I'm saying is true. And that's not bashing Bryan, it's just exploring the differences between the way things are now and the way they used to be. I prefer the way they used to be.

Any other questions?

[Bill Gardner]

Derek and John... If pounding chests is really important... move your discussion to private messages.

[Seadog]

All I was doing here was honoring one of my fallen racing heroes. I didn't think it would lead to all of this. Were all racing family here. Let's move on and let's go racin'!

[Vukie]

"Forget Rich Vogler? You might as well ask us to forget elementary school, or the first time we saw a falling star. His image and his exploits are burned into our consciousness because if you were involved in USAC racing in the 1980s he was a central figure all along.

But a new generation is among us today, younger people who know only the Internet and text messaging and driver development. Although technology has been awfully good to them, they were deprived of the opportunity to see one of the most exciting men to ever climb behind the wheel.

However, they recognize the name, and if they know nothing else they realize this guy must have been one special racer because the most accurate indication of greatness is that your legacy long outlives you. And here we are, almost 19 years later, still talking and marveling about Rich Vogler."

http://www.nationalspeedsportnews.co...son-about-love

[duel]

my dad and i were at the kings royal that night. news of salem cast a shadow over all of us on turn 4 before the feature. Rich was our groups icon. we will never forgot him. one memory of Rich was when he drove that miller 65 car at Winchester on those open shows against roadsters. man could he drive...R.I.P. Rich