Right now that is a very cost efficient form of racing.

When's Drew gonna let you hop in his? Or take that fancy Henchcraft out?

Interesting comments, but let's stay focused on the topic. Some good posts so far.

I think the first question you should address is whether you want this to be real answers or just fantasy dreams? Scrapping all the currant midgets (to be replaced with combo cars) or going back to 1960's technology (steel blocks) or even making everyone with a midget buy all new wheels to fit a narrower tire is just fantasy. The real question is how to make the hundred's (see Chili Bowl) of midget's that are out there come out and race.
And I will admit, I don't know the answer. But in my opinion, opening up the tire rule is not the way to do it. And no, I don't work for Hoosier or any other tire company. Nore do I work for USAC or any other midget organization. And I don't even own a midget.
But I am a hard working, low dollar, sprint car owner/ driver and I know what a tire rule has done for me. About 12-15 years ago (I know, this is a bit dated) I had just started running pavement with Tom Isch's now defuct winged pavement sprint series based out of Fort Wayne. And I was just running everyone's used tires and doing the best I could. At our yearly meeting, Mr. Isch invited American Racer in to discuss with us possibly running their tires. Donna Dayton and Brian Tyler came in and gave us a very nice presentation on their tires. And I will admit, I was a bit bored because, remember, I was just running what everyone else took off. After their presentation and everyone was just BS' ing around, I don't remember how or why, but I ended up talking to Ms. Dayton. And she asked me what it would take for me to buy her tires. I explained that I didn't really buy tires. She asked me again what would it take. I told her that a right rear needed to cost $100 and last two nights. She very politely told me I was dreaming (my words, not hers). The series decided to open the tire rules. In the spirit of "competition" some guys were getting free tires, some guys were paying full price (this from both brands). The guys with free tires naturally always had new tires on the car. And were able to run softer ones. Us poor people were still running on the same old scraps we always had. Oh, and by the way, the price difference between the two brands was less then five dollars. By the end of the year, it was decided we would run on Hoosier tires (definately the better quality tire, even used) and we would all use the same compound. We also went to one tire dealer and everyone paid the same price.
Today, we (HOSS) run Hoosier tires, and yes, I buy at least a right rear every time we race. But I'm pretty sure everyone is paying the same price on tires. Except maybe the guy selling them. They (Hoosier) contributes to our point fund every year as do they to every series they are a spec tire for. The only change I'd like to see is a rule on the quantity of tires you can put on a night. But I doubt that will ever happen.
Yes, I know, I own a sprint car, not a midget. But I may be one of the few people on this board that actually spends money (although not much) on a race car. I have seen first hand the difference opening up the tire rule makes. Yes, in the "real world" competition between businesses is good. It drives prices down. But in the racing world and in my experience, all it did was make the fast guys faster. Thank you all for your time.

Tom Paterson

I think Duke has a great start to a good midget series here someone should jump on this. To add to it I would say you keep the midget off the big tracks (1/2 miles and bigger) they are to hard on motors. I don't think midgets were build to run those kind of tracks.

i'll throw a few of my ideas in the ring. they probably won't be detailed enough for full report status, but then again, i am writing this at work, LOL.

I think that the best bet would be to try to work with the existing equipment as much as possible. I talked with a few motor builders over the years about a midget motor along the lines of what was done with the ASCS 360 sprint series. Basically take their V8 head program, along with the rules on valves and porting etc. and put it on a midget block built to be somewhere in the 185-200 ci range (depending on where it need to be to compete). The basic idea is to use the cheaper head with more cubic inches to build, or rebuild a motor to be competitive with the "Open" motors. You could start new on a rodeck, fontana, hawk block etc. or take your old gearte -12, brayton etc. and convert it. I would also eliminate titanium rods in this equation, and limit compression. There would be alot of leg work to be done to make it all work, but i think by eliminating the ti and using a head that could be bought for about a $1000 with the ASCS limitations on porting you could have a chance to built a less expensive motor that would run with the high dollor stuff without outlawing the existing motors. I also think that doing it this way elimates the need for "another class" to dilute the midget market further, and also dodges the "sportman" stigma that makes it tougher to draw a fan base and good payouts.

If you still want to run a Pink, Esslinger, Stanton, you can, if you want to buy a new one you can, But you could also by this "spec head" midget motor for less money, that needs less maintenance for less money. It also alows for fairly easy checking, with a compression test and alum plugs added onto the oil pan to check for ti rods. Since it would be fairly easy to check, it also eliminates the need for the sealed motor deal. That alows a guy like me, who happened to have a father than started rebuilding offy's when he was 14 teach him how to do a basic rebuild, to do alot of the work myself instead of crating it up and shipping it off to a motor builder.

On some of the other topics, i am in favor of competition on tires, so i would like to see a deal where you could choose between american racer or hooiser. Maybe a deal where the RR has to be an SP3 hoosier, or a American Racer 45 (its been a while since i had a racer to durometer, so i am not sure if a 45 is really about the same as SP3). The same could be done on the LR with a racer that durometers like say a d15 hoosier.


I say SP3, because i am in favor of a harder tire rule, not rock hard, but harder than an SP2. i don't think it would save alot of money from a buying tires point of veiw, maybe some, but not enough to fix the greater problem. i do think that it will take away a little traction, thus taking away a little of the HP advantage and equaling thing out a little bit. The high dollar guys will probably still put a new one on every night and the new one will still be a little better than a used one, but if it take out a little of the big HP advantage and puts a little more emphasis on the driver and mechanic side of things it is OK with me.
Enough rambling, poor grammar, spelling and run on sentances, i need to get back to making signs, i have a midget racing habit to support you know!

Steve Stroud

Spridge silently slips into the classroom and hits teacher, Mr. Moore, with a spitball between the eyes !

There are some good points here and some off the mark(In my opinion) but thats what it's about. I do not believe Midget Racing is going away, it just needs some mending and some people who care. I think there are some great stories being missed in the sport.

Was that Spridge or Spicolly? Oh wait Spicolly ordered the pizza delivered to class...MY BAD

From the few post I've read, I don't know why you'd have to throw away the equiptment being used now. a weight rule or smaller injector rule could use this up.

Chuck, not getting into it but you can't just scrap 40g motors, some teams have a half dozen of em.