Quote:
Originally Posted by openwheel44
While I agree a "tire rule" is an option.....an option some groups have already adopted, I personally don't put too much faith in it. Not unless you put on an absolute "brick." Then what have you done? Slowed all the cars down. Maybe to the point a friggin' 600 is faster than our class. Sounds like a good formula to grow that 600 class though! Since our cars put out limited horsepower in relation to the RR and LR tread width (contact patches)......I don't see that tire that big of factor. Especially when the track is somewhat tacky. I think we all agree......tacky tracks, about anything works as long as it has air in it due to our limited HP. I'll admit that as the track slicks off possibly by the feature that tire makes a slight difference. But you said yourself......the racer that knows setups and driving skills will still prevail. So why force people to buy a more expensive tire? Yes.......I am talking about Hoosiers. I run Amercian racers for one simple reason..........cheaper. And they work as good as Hoosiers in my opinion. And yes I have run them both. It would be simpler to just have a durometer rule but then some organizations will lose out on their Hoosier "contribution." And that ain't good. Trust me....I have raced in a couple of other classes with spec tire rules. Honestly........didn't save me any money and it didn't change the outcome of any of the races. Fast guys are fast.....for a bunch of reasons.
Weight? Again........let's weight the hell out of them so that same 600 mentioned above is faster than our Lighting Sprints. Look around........on small quarters, they are about the same lap times now. Ooops.......there we go pushing racers to the 600 class again. Speed and economics is our selling point. We don't want to give away the speed and we need to control the economics as best as possible. But maybe I am looking at this all wrong. I figure there will be a bunch of people much smarter than me at this meeting to enlighten me. None of us are looking for an argument...............we are looking for solutions to grow this class.
Your no-go gauge system will require multiple gauges though.......right? I like the idea though. We have been using the scissor type unit this year. It works but there is definitely room for improvement. I may not be a motor man, but bore and stroke is about the least of my concerns but you have to start somewhere. Me..........it's all in the head and the compression. Mark is exploring the possibility of limited RPM's and a way to check it. The 600 guys are evidently doing that now in certain areas. That might be another starting point? Why have aftermarket rods then? Whatever is decided......it has to be "techable" with minimal effort.
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Phil
The Hp Is in the head. That is why we run old Kawasaki's.
The heads unlike Suzuki are ported right from the factory. The BMW came up with a shorter stroke bigger bore thus bigger valves and even more Horsepower and RPM> If and when it works the Japan makers will follow suit.
What I have noticed this year is low mile motors are hard to find and .ooo5>> five ten thoundsandth of an inch in crank main bearing clearance make a big difference in the life of one of these motors.
Good news for the motor building people bad news for the racer.
MC brings up the point of rev limiters, more cost to the racer but a good idea. We would want to advance the cam timing a little put longer ram tubes on to move the torque and Horsepower numbers down on RPM scale. Still More money and that would slow them down a little also but make them live. If you take the rev limiter off of a stock motor it will just keep on revving until the valves and piston collide and. Checking with the 600 people might be a good idea.
Weight>>>>We generally cross the scales at 1050 to 1075 pounds and on a good day we can run with anything or anybody out there. It isn't done with high dollar motors although them old Kaw's are bears right off the bike. We won the last race we ran and I bet we were also the heaviest car in the field. Weight matters in the start line to turn one drag race after that it is all driver and car. Slow these weight watchers down a little in the drag race and you will make better racing, and make the foot ball player feel more like getting a race car. Why would anyone buy a race car if they knew they would start off at a 100 pounds disadvantage from the hot shoe Jockeys out there. By cutting out the big guy and making him feel non competitive from the start you are eliminating over half of your perspective racers. We started out at 95 pounds and I felt it wasn't fair to a lot of the racers and I said so. Now we are 250+ and I still don't think it is fair. The only saving grace is that the same thing that makes one get heavy "age" is also the thing that turns one into a better driver "experience".
Tires>>>> I laughed at Ron when he bought up the idea. When it comes to hooking up a race car he and his sons are the best around. They are racers to be emulated and gives one something to strive for. They should win their share of races and nothing makes me feel better than to beat them once or twice.
The tire business is competitive, boy I love competition. When Hoosier sets the price American racer can beat it. They would like nothing better than to take all the mini sprint business away from Hoosier, I don't know if Hoosier feels the same way, but that small slice would be noticed. We have run American racers before and had no problems. There is not much mark up in tires but if we could get American racer on board and implement some of the ideas I brought up it could make racing cheaper. On some occasions promoters have used spec tires as a cash cow for themselves. Be forewarned racers usually don't put up with that Idea. I am sure other racers out there have other Ideas of their own.
Now is the time to use this old board. I don't intentionally try to P1ss people off, but I am pretty good at it. What I do try to do is get people thinking, and sometimes I might be a little too direct.
The only idea that is stupid is the one that you have and don't bring to the attention of others. Now is the time and place to do it.
I have had a love affair with mini sprint racing for a long time now. They are the most affordable, fastest form of open wheel racing out. I would sure never do anything knowingly to hurt or impede the growth of the sport.
You can also be sure if I can rattle your chain and get you thinking a little and talking>>>>> I WILL.
Honest Dad himself
