[Racerrob]

Originally Posted by rocket5612 Rob, One chassis on dirt and pavement is the biggest thing needed to save combination dirt and pavement series'. Now, there are plenty more dirt midgets and sprint cars in this world then there are pavement cars so I would write the rules to benefit the dirt cars. How do you police one chassis on dirt and pavement? You actually write a rule book and enforce it. Merely saying this cannot be policed is an excuse not a reason. The Legend Car series' were successful at this, but they went to the extreme with their rules and created a monopoly for certain parts suppliers, so I would not go that far. Plus their cars are junk and their tires are harder then any tire on the planet so the racing is terrible on dirt. What is the engine plate to rear axle on the typical dirt sprint car or midget? I'll bet this doesn't vary more than 2" from manufacturer to manufacturer on dirt. So, allow 2" to move but thats it. Set a wheelbase limit that isn't 10" from shortest to longest and you have that problem solved. For the midgets I would recommend a low of 71" and a high of 73". This doesn't hurt anyone because all the "big" teams already have dirt cars. Yes, some guys who have strictly pavement cars will have to buy new cars, but it is a small price to pay now to survive in the future. Set the rules so the engine must be on the centerline of the chassis. In the midgets maybe, and this is a big maybe, require the engine sit straight up and down. This is easily done with a motor plate. That isn't much of an investment at all. Also, as I said in my previous post make the same offset rule on dirt and pavement so the same rear axle can be run on both surfaces. Also, one important thing would be a seat height rule so nobody is lowering the driver from dirt to pavement. Also, requiring six pin hubs on the front since they are needed on the high speed pavement tracks is necessary. No "special" car will be needed. All current dirt cars would be legal. USAC is going to have to be the one to make these changes especially in the midget division. All the other midget clubs just follow whatever USAC does so they need to step up and take the reigns to save it. When it comes to sprint cars USAC is not king and we all know that. However, I am sure that when it comes to dirt cars they are not that different manufacturer to manufacturer on the engine plate to rear axle measurements.

I believe that the cure will prove terminal for pavement racing and severely damage dirt racing. You are correct in your assessment that dirt cars engine to rear axle centerline measurements vary about 2”, usually in the 39” to 41” range. Beast pavement car is around 46.5” so all existing Beast cars will be junk (see new generation SC series). I believe the current wheelbase limits are 84” to 90” so that is already in the rules and enforced. Will you set a crankshaft centerline height (minimum and maximum)? I have seen dirt cars with a 7” to a 9” centerline height and I believe the Beast is 6”.

The majority of the cars at the pavement tracks are there because they are chasing National Championship points. These teams will most likely invest in the combo car idea and return next year. There are a few car owners that race ONLY pavement. I don’t believe they will invest in a new car (again see new generation SC car series). Even when USAC brought back the old style SC car the series will take years to recover from the experiment.

By the way, do you remember the reasons why USAC went to the new generation car? There weren’t enough tracks willing to host SC races and they needed a new car to race on the 1.5 mile tracks that have become a NASCAR standard. It was intended to ensure the long term viability of the series. How’s that working out for them? They alienated the majority of the SC owners by making their existing pavement cars obsolete and then alienated the New Generation SC owners by mothballing their investment. The old cars owners are still smarting from the original shot to the groin and have not returned. (our car will probably not race again.

Now as you stated the combo car will need six pin hubs on the front for the high speed pavement tracks so this I am assuming will be a required for the dirt tracks as well since the ultimate goal is to reduce car ownership costs and we don’t want separate running gear for dirt and pavement. So now the locals that run Bloomington, Gas City, Lawrenceburg, Haubstadt, etc. on a weekly basis will be forced to buy six pin hubs and wheels or skip the USAC sanctioned shows. Car counts went down when a HANS was required, many citing the cost to purchase as the reason, but at least this was for a safety device. That being the case, do you believe the locals will gladly fork over $1,000 plus just so they can be USAC legal? Maybe some of the guys in Indiana will indeed make the conversion but what about when we travel to PA or IA? Since we only have 15 to 20 cars that travel USAC will once again become a regional series.

Now the six pin hubs we run on pavement are not stock six pin hubs and spindles. They are special made with extra material in critical places. Do you think the well funded teams will buy multiple sets, lightweight for dirt and heavy duty for pavement? What will your offset rules be? Do you know that we are currently allowed more offset on dirt than pavement? Will we have to run 2 front brakes on dirt as well as pavement? Will we have to run steel rotors or can we run aluminum? If you say 2 front brakes of steel so that they can be used on pavement and dirt you have just lost additional local car support. Otherwise it sounds to me like we will need two sets of front axles, one for dirt and one for pavement.

How about shocks? I guarantee you that what I run on pavement and dirt are light years apart.

Believe it or not, the rear ends are interchangeable now. Our motors are interchangeable now. Someone suggested that you should have the same fuel cell dirt and pavement and enforce the rule with a minimum gallon specification. That’s fine but we probably just lost some more local support.

So if we write the rules to minimize the damage to the dirt series what will I need to do to convert my car from dirt car to pavement?

 Change front axle assembly complete with Hubs, Spindles and Brakes
 Change Front Radius Rods (to maximize advantage under rules)
 Change Shocks to pavement shocks
 Change braking system to account for additional volume of pavement brakes.
 Move motor plate or rear links to take advantage of 2” to axle Centerline allowed in rulebook.
 Move motor plate down to lowest allowed measurement.
 Change driveline due to motor plate/rear links change
 Change tires and wheels
 Change to heavy duty steering gear (dirt steering gears will NOT work at Winchester)
 Change pitman arm and drag link and tie rod to heavy duty for pavement

The above list is off the top of my head. When you look at the amount of increased work for the teams (considerable) and the cost savings (frame and body since almost everything else will be changed) does this really make sense?

Like Duke I have also been around a while. In 1988 I converted a standard Gambler dirt car to run on the pavement utilizing many of the items listed above. We ran 2nd and 3rd at the two races we entered at IRP which were telecast on Thursday Night Thunder. This was Kevin “Pup” Huntley’s 1st and 2nd time ever on pavement. I found out through that experience that it was much easier to build a pavement chassis instead of trying to make a silk purse from a sow’s ear. The result was the Buick V-6 which Rich Vogler drove to the championship in 1989.

I am all about cost savings and the long term viability of the sport on both dirt and pavement. But unless you can demonstrate how the rules could be written to not penalize the USAC or local teams on dirt while allowing safety and cost savings on pavement you are not living in the real world.

Rob Hoffman