The Cat is out of the bag
 

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Holy crap! Talk about a revolution. Looks like Emmett decided to shake up the open wheel world, in 2010.

Jerry

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Question is, Will it be 360 or 410? If it's 360 you could probably scrap WOO, and All Stars.

So Knox Nationals are Goodyear only and Kings and any other big Eldora Races are Hoosier?

We'll see if Humpy steps in.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

WOW!!....is rite....n if Emmit Haan is involved.....it'll more n likely work!!....360 or 410....Hmmmmm.......
_________
Brucer':32:

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Yoooouuuuuuuuuuu Hooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!! Holy Cow!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Interesting start to the off season. I can hardly wait until February and see what will be on the drawing board by then.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Cant make it work. Black helicoptors must have taken control.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Heh heh heh......
:6:

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

This should be very interesting.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

This is better how?

---------- Post added at 09:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:34 AM ----------

I wouldn't be too cocky....people riding others coat-tails often get flipped off during the ride.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

[QUOTE=LEADERS EDGE;144084]This is better how?[COLOR="Black"]

My question exactly. Many posts have been put on this board about how hard it is for a NON-WING guy to get a descent payout. Now the Indiana fans are going to be asked to support a whole new wing circuit. Which usually means that for a promoter to pay the purse of these "bigger" organizations ask for, then the little guys purse suffers at the weekly show. :10:

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Hey Leader --

You may be right - but, I'm thinkin' Emmett wouldn't bother unless there was a bonafide opportunity.
And, I'm sure that the "coat-tails" you refer to weren't very big to ride on anyway...Otherwise, why do it?
Like many others feel, competition is good and can only help to make "the ride" better hopefully for the racing teams.

The questions are -- Why does something new automatically get scorned with skepticism?
Why also is it assumed that existing organizations have to "flip off" others?
I have never understood that reasoning. In the end, the best product wins in the eyes of tracks & fans, right?

Seems to me that it's high time for racing organizations to "play to win" vs. "play not to lose".
Every good racer knows this. Imagine a driver that's fast all day long but keeps looking over his shoulder...
What are the chances that he will get passed? Pretty damn good if you ask me!!

Oh well - Will just have to see what happens!
Good luck to all & here's hoping for great racing events in 2010!

Jimmy B.

---------- Post added at 02:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:39 PM ----------

[QUOTE=spankytoo;144092]
Help me out...

How is it that Indiana fans will "be asked to support a whole new wing circuit"? That doesn't mean that the fans ACTUALLY WILL!! If it's not their bag, they won't support it. Simple as that...Want to make sure that weekly shows remain viable with good purses? Don't give the track promoters A REASON to stray too far!! How do you do that? FAN BASE, FAN BASE, FAN BASE with CAR COUNTS, CAR COUNTS, CAR COUNTS. I.E. CREATE PROFITS!!!!!!!!

It's up to THE TRACK to sign up "bigger" organizations & larger purses. And, they will only do that if they feel that there is a return on their investment. If the weekly shows' purses suffer; then, that isn't the new series' fault.

We all love open wheel racing & very passionate about it. And, the tracks love their fans & racing supporters. But, make no mistake - tracks are a BUSINESS in it to MAKE MONEY regardless what series or type of car races there.

I'll never forget talking to a guy from Toledo Speedway about 4-5 yrs. ago. Those who know this track remember a fast, high-banked, paved, 1/2 mile with lots of great racing history. It has a little 1/4 mile on the front-stretch, too.

They host the school buses a couple times a year within their regular Friday shows. They pack the place every time and make an absolute killing on THE FRONT GATE. They pay the winner $100 and give anyone an extra $100 if they flip over another bus. The crowd goes crazy. Now, this isn't many people's style of racing. But, Toledo does it a couple times a year to MAKE MONEY. Would they rather have more traditional shows? Probably; but, it's business, nothing more, nothing less...

Thanks for listening, y'all. Had to get that off my chest.
Have a great day!

Jimmy Baumgartner

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Found this posted on Brand X.

There was a meeting Monday evening in Dayton, at one of Eldora's lodging partners' locations. Emmett Hahn was there, Tony Stewart was not. Stewart had Larry Kemp and Larry Boos there, in addition to one of his business partners. Nichols apparently contacted something like 28 tracks. There was representation from around 10-12, at most. Stewart supposedly mentioned to some people before the meeting and via phone that he might put a team together to run the series, beyond what he currently has on the WoO tour. Steve Kinser is rumored to be the driver. Stewart did not commit Eldora to running any of the races. TSR likely wouldn't pull out of WoO because those teams' sponsorship is contigent on TV races. This meeting was to explore the possibility of running a forty race series with a $5000 to win, $400 to start show that would cost $32,000 overall per race, in a four state area (OH., MI., IN., PA.). A point fund of about $160,000 was discussed. They want to have a Speedweek. There would be a Hoosier right rear spec tire. This meeting came about because of the All Star Circuit of Champions signing with Goodyear. The meeting's leaders insisted that they are not doing this to compete against the WoO, but the All Stars' recent tire decision made that series vulnerable, in their opinion. Bottom line is this...this new series would attempt to schedule races at Hoosier and open tire facilities, with the idea of trying to convert more tracks to Hoosier. No firm committments were made by tracks at the meeting. The organizers gave the track promoters ten days to decide whether or not they'd be behind this new series. That's basically where things are as we speak.

Tony Stewart isn't buying WRG...trust me on that one. We'll just have to see what "big" announcement he actually makes in Charlotte.

Right now, Fremont and Attica are on Hoosier's deal. This week, Sharon, Tri-City and Mercer all went with Goodyear. I'd think it's likely K-C Raceway does the same. The central Pennsylvania tracks aren't interested in any series Emmett Hahn organizes, based on past experience (remember the 358 debacle ?). Port Royal signed with Hoosier but isn't interested in another series, as an example. My sources tell me that no Indiana tracks were represented, although somebody at the meeting mentioned that one of the meeting leaders said that, possibly, three tracks were interested, with Gas City supposedly being mentioned by name. The only PA. track in attendence was Mercer, which signed with Goodyear two days later.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

car count is down,fan base is getting smaller,expenses to run a car is up,OH AND NOW AN OTHER SERIES TO TRY AND RUN :21: :15::21: :15:

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

D.O., in all fairness, you should also post the rebuttals to the above post, from the people who were actually AT the meeting. The same people who pretty much picked apart the above post with the facts. Always consider the source....and the source's agenda. Just sayin. :6:
David.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

My comment on coat tails is directed at Keith(Reveloution) and his midget engine program that he is doing with ASCS. His program could get bounced pretty quickly or at least his involvement in it.(As is in he was riding along and got flipped off to the side of the road. No longer riding the tails of the coat)

I don't see Indiana fans supporting very many wing shows at the moment. I also don't see how one group will be any better than the other. This is the 3rd time that Steve has been a part of a group going against the WoO. The first two were not successful.

I like Emmet and believe he is as good as it gets, but this is a tough road to hoe.

If anything, this takes pressure off of USAC as it doesn't appear that they will have to defend themselves from an ASCS Non-Wing battle, but they have many other battles that I believe will be hard for them to fight.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Would be cool if they ran a schedule of half wing races and half nonwing races.will never happen but would be different and exciting.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Dave I just posted what I found without having to spend time listening. That looked like it summed it up pretty good for everybody else who didn't want to spend time clicking and listening to that show.

Personally Good Luck to all on this. Sounds like something else to confuse the fan and create hard feelings between tracks and racers and manufactures.

Maybe soon somebody will put out a proper release on it for all to read, until then good luck with fact or fiction.
D.O.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Thank God we all have 'Edge to let us know how we are doing... Here I thought things were finally starting to go well but I guess I better start looking for new work (again!) Don't know where he gets his inside info but he's a genius. Guess I'd better get this shop closed up and go see if they are hiring down at the quickie lube....

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

I hear ya man, sometimes it seems like we need a program to follow along. :15:
David.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

USAC tried that trick in the mid '80s....it was pretty much a short lived 'experiment'.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

When the World of Outlaws first started the decision on wing or non-wing was made by the racetrack.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

I know this post isn't worth the red background it's printed on but, wouldn't it be neat if the WOO ran what the tracks ran, whether it be wing, non wing, dirt, pavement, 410, or, 360. In my silly book that would really make the WOO the
WOO! And no tire rule of any kind, just contingency money. Just sayin.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

You're right,I don't know anything.

How could I? Being that you are so tight lipped and oppossed to shameless self-promotion.


What do you have against the quickie lube?

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

It was pretty much a short lived necessity for usac to even get a race at some tracks. Wang's were hot late 80s then everybody went broke

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

I thought this was done before with Steve K's involvement. Wasn't it called NST?

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

And years before that with Karl Kinser and it was called USA I believe.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

USAC tried it in the mid '80s..................

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

If I'm reading this correctly, the NST and USA deals were national, geared towards direct competition against the WOO. I think this latest deal is regional, Indiana-Ohio-Michigan, maybe Pennsylvania? I would imagine the All-Stars would be the club to worry. Could be wrong.
David.

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Dave,
Sounds like you're dead on.

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Not only that, Jim, but having Emmett moving this along might make a difference?

How's the Santa bidness?

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Well, I hope this doesn't come off as an old timer lamenting the past, but do we really think that multiple sanctioning bodies vying for the same participants and fans is a good idea? Often on this site there are remarks about "the good old days" particularly as it relates to USAC in the 60's and 70's. I would respectfully postulate that the reason these were halcyon days was that there was a focus on fewer organizations with a true ladder to the so-called big leagues. We now seem intent on eating our young with more and more series, tire contracts, etc. I would hope that USAC abd other non-wing followerrs would see this an opportunity to actually fill a niche which if handled correctly could grow larger. Winged racing, like many aspects is having competition devoured by aerodynamics which make for less and less passing. Hell, watch a Dick Wallen video from Eldora from the 70's even during a day race; no dust, cars backin' it in, etc. Now contrast that today with a winged race from the same place: rubber down, dust, and not a front wheel turned toward the fence. Looks like Winchester, just no macadam. So keep the wings off, reduce some of the body work, and actually make USAC racing a different animal from the all the others. As in all things which are successful, one must find itsm own niche and mine it, not copy others who are already in trouble!

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

There is a whole lot of common sense and truth in the above post!!

Re: The Cat is out of the bag
 

Here is Tony's BFD: http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...g-adds-driver/