USAC Purse
 

Have been hesitant to broach this subject as there has been much discussion. So I will direct this directly to USAC and indirectly to those on this forum. What is the explanation for the pitiful purse being paid in the Sprint Division? Tuscarora pays 52K, WoO don't even go there, etc. Great racing going unrewarded. At this rate it will shrink even more to a regional Indiana series and then what is the point of paying for a USAC sanction fee. Once again we watch great racers go to wing orgs. Remember when WoO came along and they were dismissed by USAC as just some sort of upstart group? In the words of the great philosopher Yogi Berra " it seems like deja vu all over again".

Yes usac needs an substantial increase in pay especially in start monies there is a big dip in winnings once you get the top5 in the a main something needs to change like a pay cut for the president of usac Mr Kevin Miller after all isn't wasn't usac always a not for profit group at one time?

In Indiana, Why pay more when you can get the same drivers for 1200 to win

Re: USAC Purse
 

You buy a USAC sanction fee to use USAC's great insurance if needed. Also for all the other perks like mailed to you, or direct deposit purses and USAC officials history and write ups. All it's scheduling etc.

Im coming in at someone of a defense of USAC's payout. It's three times the purse of the highest weekly Indiana show and probably much more than that.. It brings in great competition and in most cases makes the tracks a good $$ in some cases enough for the track to survive the rest of the year on as most weekly shows without a ton of track sponsorship lose $$$

I hear about all these big show's paying big $$$ but they are usually two or three night shows where the prelude races make up the Saturday show's purse, Not to mention $50+ gate prices.

I got no problem with a racer wanting to improve on their position or race for more. But I think they'll find racing winged for real money cost three times as much also your going to find three times as many competing for the same $$. USAC has ten regulars, All stars 18, WOO 25. Beat any one of them and your accomplishing something.

IMO the only thing I wish usac could do is draw more and more loyal sponsors to it's racers. Seems they come, stay a couple years and gone. There's some WoO and LM sponsors who've done it for decades.

Re: USAC Purse
 

Does USAC need a purse bump? sure. but lets not brag about 52k at port. Sure it was nice, if you won, but there was a 40k difference between 1st and second. paid 1500 or less from 12th on back. You really want to impress me and a group of drivers, knock the top heavy purses away and pay more throughout the field.

56 sprint cars and a sold out crowd...I’m impressed 👌👌

Here is another analogy of how far USAC is behind the times. AJ Foyt made $23,728 for winning the Hoosier 100 in 1968. Tyler Courtney was victorious in this years Hoosier 100 and was paid a whopping $10,000. You can spin your defense of USAC any way you want, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out the math on that one. 51 years later and racing for almost 14k LESS!!! Even I know that's bass akwards

Re: USAC Purse
 

What is the point of this debate? If you feel like the mid pack USAC guys are underpaid stop by their trailer and buy them a RR some night. There isn't a series in the country, sprint cars, late models, drag racing or Indy car that gets paid what they deserve. Just go buy a ticket and support your favorite series or track.

Bingo, Chris

So what's the answer then?

I am willing to pay more to watch and unless a BIG time sponsor or sponsors emerge, that is what will have to happen to raise purses. I am not sure that the rest of the paying customers would be as willing as I am, and there, my friends, is the rub. USAC does a good job, remember, they are a multiple division series. If they could afford to pay more, as a non-profit, I’m sure they would.

Hopefully this is where floracing will provide help over time. If it provides more exposure may be easier to attract sponsors both to teams and events. Event sponsors would fund bigger purses.

Thats a fact Christmas

Thats a fact Chris

Re: USAC Purse
 

This is not comparing apples to apples. In 1968, the Hoosier Hundred was part of the Championship Trail and was the second largest (in attendance) date on the Trail. Also at that time, USAC had a policy of a fixed purse vs. a percentage of the gate (I believe in 1968 it was 40%). Since attendance at the HH in the 60's could easily be over 20,000, the winners share could be significant. During the 60's, the Hoosier Hundred also had lap money, which was included in the published $$ winnings. This lap money came from sponsors donating the money, NOT from the race organizer. It could reach up to $100/lap. If a driver led all 100 laps, he could win $10,000 more than the purse.

While I absolutely agree that purses should increase for USAC races across the board, I personally think it is going to take an increase in admission prices to fund it. A series sponsor bumping up 40+ (the USAC Sprint PLANNED schedule for 2019) event purses by meaningful amount would be a significant number.

Re: USAC Purse
 

How do we know they do not have a big time sponsor? Nos? Amsoil?

Paragon pays $1400 and is not getting any USAC regulars other than possibly Darland who competes in a non USAC car.
Here's who you dont see at Paragon regular show, Courtney,Bacon, Windom, Stockon, Cummings, Grant, pretty much the front runners at USAC.

Re: USAC Purse
 

Convince the top 15 USAC drivers to stop running local shows. And then make sure that they show up to the big 'Local' races that pay up. Guys like Ballou, KTJ, Cottle, Stockon, C. Short, Leary, Bacon, Cummins and TMez all pick up weekly shows around the state when USAC isn't running. We've seen them at Gas City, Lawrenceburg, and Lincoln Park for $1,500 to win and $200 to start. But chances are, those guys are driving home with that $1,500 while the local guys are mad that a USAC guy came and cherry picked.

The other answer? Make sure there is something USAC going on every weekend. USAC has a lot of racing where you're gone for a week, but they still take quite a few weekends off.

Re: USAC Purse
 

The asylum here would go more nuts if USAC raised the purse and promoters had to charge a $30 general admission fee.
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Re: USAC Purse
 

There are a lot of reasons to point at besides USAC for lower purses than over 20 years ago. The fact that you are reading this on your digital device is a big one. The sad fact is that there are fewer butts in the grandstands to pay for anything. And "sponsors", like the ones on this page, need a return on their investment. Anybody that turns the wrenches or loads the trailer knows there is a lot of work before there is and sound for excitement. Young people don't want to get their hands dirty or travel for a few hours unless there are wannabe "musicians" or opportunity for intoxication involved. The days of Foyt and the Unsers are history. There are plenty of exciting drivers to watch today. Few are ready for their "close up"..can any avoid saying "gotta thank my crew, they worked their butts off'?? Cost of admission isn't the problem. Try taking a kid to ball game. Ernie Saxton showed that decades ago. Doing nothing is also not an option. If you are a spectator, take a kid to the races next time. If you are a racer, watch tapes of Bobby Cicconi. He as always an entertaining "get" for announcers. He actually thought before he opened his mouth. And respectfully submitted, I don't see more trailers pulling in the back gate unless we figure out how to stop the spiraling cost to even bring something there.

Re: USAC Purse
 

I assume you are speaking of KYLE CUMMINS?

Good to see the spelling police are on duty. At least give me credit for getting Stockon correct.

Re: USAC Purse
 

quote=Bill Angel;520308]Good to see the spelling police are on duty. At least give me credit for getting Stockon correct.[/quote]

You are correct.

Eye was on the Stockon spell. You get a C- for the day.

Re: USAC Purse
 

You would think a percentage of the revenues from Flo would be contributed towards the purse :15:

Agree, only used that as an example, but $900 for 5th in a standard USAC purse is inadequate.

Re: USAC Purse
 

For two or three heats and a feature. You bet. For four heats and two consi's and a feature, NO.

No. But for 2 or 3 thousand you'll see Stockton in the 5 car, Cummings, grant has came out for unsanctioned shows and so has ballou and a few others.

I dont have answers. I wish I did though.

The question should be what is USAC's ultimate goal for Sprint car racing. When Ted Johnson started the outlaws his goal was to make Sprint car racing on par with NASCAR. A big time televised racing circuit. I don't think it quite made it to the heights he envisioned (During his lifetime) none the less he set the standard for a touring national series. I believe the powers to be at USAC are comfortable with the status quo that they are currently experiencing.

Again, USAC maintains 3 major divisions of racing. IF they focused solely on sprint cars (I personally hope that never happens) then maybe we would see more aggression in building it into a true nationwide series, with the accompanying purse structure. I don’t think that will happen.
A group like the MSCS, whose focus is solely on sprint cars, could look to begin such an expansion. I just don’t see it happening.

Re: USAC Purse
 

usac. and toyoto are killing racing they will not pump engines down. and usac is not going to pay more money when there guys out there that would race for nothing deppeengineering

Re: USAC Purse
 

When did USAC start paying race purses? Last I checked (also last contract I read), it was the track putting up that cheddar. WoO (with the exclusion of some select places like Eldora) lease tracks and they DO pay the purses.

22 USAC races in the state of Indiana alone for 2019. USAC is not strong enough outside of Indiana to be able to market an event at the scale of WoO and $30+ tickets.

Re: USAC Purse
 

USAC has a good balance within Indiana right now. Tours like Eastern Storm are doing wonderful things for broadening brand awareness on a national scale.

Doesn't everyone in the industry DESERVE more money? The track prep people? The ticket sellers? Drivers? Car Owners? Crew Members? Sure, but unless someone has that famed money tree, it ain't going to happen. Everyone always wants more, but with the nature of local racing being the way it is while society as a whole is steering away from sporting events in general, there needs to be the understanding that growth will be very slow and returns low, if at all.

Re: USAC Purse
 

did you look at the stands from both years? Maybe you could talk to the PROMOTER not the sanctioning body, y'all need to use your brains, in 1968 the Hoosier Hundred was part the USAC CHAMPIONSHIP Trail, it had drawing power because of Indy drivers, you can all stop ******** when there are no more silver crown races, that'll probably make you happy

The Outlaws do promote SOME shows on the schedule, but the majority they do not. It’s no different then a track having a USAC show, the track is responsible for the purse.

Justin Grant racing with a wing at atomic with the all stars tonight

Re: USAC Purse
 

Every encounter I've had and every "non elite" track I've spoken with has had to go through SLS Promotions.

Re: USAC Purse
 

I think since Casey is actually in the business of overseeing a major series I'll take his word for it.

Re: USAC Purse
 

I used to work for a track (Hartford Speedway, MI) and was with the owner in every step of the process (including the face to face talks with Larry Hillerud) that had to deal with WoO and when we inquired about doing the show ourselves instead of using SLS we were repeatedly told that the only way to have a WoO show was to go through SLS. Now if things have changed since 2016, great! Happy to hear it.

I don't claim to be 100% up to date on the latest happenings (haven't even gone to a race in 2019), just speaking from my personal experience working behind the scenes. I respect Mr. Shuman's input as the foremost authority on the subject.

Maybe it's time I post the old contracts (SLS/All Stars/ASCS/etc) for everyone to see how things get broken down (or at least used to get broken down) and how little tracks get left with.

WoO lets SLS Promotions which is Steve Sinclair, other Track Promoters & Owners, along with some races The World Racing Group/WoO has a hand in the shows, too. They are selling Tickets for the Terre Haute Wabash Clash USAC/WoO 2 day Combo again this year, for instance. A USAC Purse with sanctioning fees for a standard 5,000 to Win $500 to start show is around 30 Grand. A WoO standard purse for a single day show of 10 Grand to Win & $800 to start is around 80 Grand! Some WoO shows run for a reduced purse of 8 Grand to Win & $600 to start & then obviously several run for substantially more money.
Coming up with that kind of purse is tough for these smaller venues, especially if the weather is iffy, etc.

Side note, USAC ran for 4 Grand to Win & around $210 to start back in the early 2000s, when I ran with them, for some Sprint Week shows, with 50 plus cars at most shows.
Nearly 20 years later, I agree, the Purse hasn't increased enough to offset rising costs to run a Top Notch Race Team.

SLS currently promotes roughly 5-10 WoO shows a year. Plus other events that usually involve the IRA sprint cars.
They have one WoO race left on their calendar this year in October at at Lakeside.