Car Colors
 

This is probably insignificant in the whole scheme of things, but I attended the Pepsi Midget Nationals in Sun Prairie on Sunday night and it struck me that of the 25 cars in field, 16 of them were painted black. Five were white - only four were painted a color other than black or white. Frankly, I found this kind of drab. The first heat had 8 cars - all of them black. A kid in front of me asked his Dad, "Why are all of the cars the same?" Add to this the fact that there were a number of pairs of team cars that looked almost identical - it was kind of difficult to keep track of who was who. And I'm not a nube - I've been to easily over 100 midget races at Sun Prairie alone in my life. This is a trend I've been noticing over time.

Am I the only one who thinks this? Why isn't there more variety of car liveries in midgets? It would make watching the races more interesting. I've always loved the Hoffman #69 sprint cars because are so identifiable on the track. The orange Wendy's midget that Jerry Coons Jr. drove is beautiful. Why don't more teams try to make their cars stand out like that?

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I had the same complaint at the Chilibowl. I can't tell who is who. No originality anymore.

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I really don't care the color, You got 25 midgets. Most of us would be happy to get 20. In the day like today where getting a car together and actually taking it to a track cost a small fortune. I'll let the paint job slide.

Numbers however, I remember one Chili Bowl where there were a couple races where eight of the top ten were all 71s and many of them identical except maybe a small K or X after the number.

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Much of the unpainted black bodywork is carbon fiber with unpainted black plastic tail tanks.. The white body work is unpainted white gelcoat fiberglass with black plastic tail tanks (I don't think they make white plastic tail tanks.)
Paint weighs 8 to 10 lbs and cost a lot of money so unless you have a sponsor who pays for the paint and insists on a certain paint job, it probably won't get painted.
If you go to the pit, you will see many cars who don't even paint the frame, to save money and weight. They just spray the frames with WD40 to control rust.
Its good that cheap "stick on" decals are available or many of them would use "shoe polish" numbers.

Unfortunately, with most racing going to spec cars, they also seem to be going to spec black and white "colors"

Actually, Most of the top nascar, indyspeccar and sports cars use expensive decal wrap for all of their colors and graphics to save 15 to 20 lbs of weight.

When I use to get fiberglass parts in my shop for repair, I could read the entire history of the car by sanding down through all the layers of different paint colors, just like rings of a tree. Some of this stuff probably had 15 to 20 lbs of extra weight with 6 to 8 layers of extra paint.

It is quite sad what this has all turned into.....

mac miller in INDY

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:42::Any color you want as long as its black:42:: "Henry Ford"

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I as well notice the identical color cars, when you have 3 red cars , 6 white cars and 8 black cars in the feature its difficult to identify who is who . Hence the reason I powdercoated my chassis orange and painted the body yellow . My yellow paint job cost me $12.37 of rustoleum yellow. and touch up is a breeze.

Cost is part of the reason.

I used to co-own a sign shop with sprint car driver, Brian Hayden. Vinyl graphics can cost a car owner quite a bit of money. Brian's cars have been yellow since 2001 maybe. He owns his own body shop so he paints everything himself. All we have on the car is the yellow paint, maybe a sponsor decal & numbers. We always felt the money spent on race car graphics would be better used to buy more spares, tires etc. you know, things that keep a car racing.

If the car isn't on the track all you've really got is a cool looking garage toy.

The multi car teams usually have more money to play around with stuff like graphics.

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It all comes down to cost. Also, if you need to do touch ups, it is 100% easier with black or white. When you add colors, trying to match those up are near impossible. Graphics cost a lot of money, and the more intricate, the more cost. Like Bill said, we spend our money on what is needed to run, not to make the car more colorful.

With that being said, if I got a sponsor that wanted a car a certain way, and they want to pay for it, then I would do that.

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Paint is a hassle and an expense on something that on any given night might be trashed.

What I would rather discuss is how come I can't read anybody's name on the side of the hood?

It's either on there in some small font, or some weird font that I cannot read, even when I'm in the pits standing next to it.

The fans in the stands do not know who is who anymore.

Those that do not put the driver's name on the side, I've always wondered why not?

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I can't see the cost of paint doing anything. Have you paid for a "wrap" lately?;)

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From a design standpoint, one thing my customers (not just racers) always wanted something that looked flashy on a computer screen. What looks flashy on a computer screen can be very difficult to read from any distance. Flashy outlines and shadows around text are the main reason. Another cause is fluorescent colors.

Another thing is letter size.
Size: Actual size in inches of a letter/number.
Impact: The distance where a letter/number is most readable.
Maximum: The farthest distance a person can read a letter/number.
Size - Impact - Maximum
2 in. - 20 ft. - 70 ft.
3 in. - 30 ft. - 100 ft.
4 in. - 40 ft. - 140 ft.
5 in. - 50 ft. - 175 ft.
6 in. - 60 ft. - 200 ft.

These distances vary depending on color combinations and vision. If you mix in a couple of outline colors, a shadow color, letter color and then background color... Forget about these measurements. If it's on your racecar, nobody is reading it unless there standing right next to it.

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Fans appreciate nicely painted race cars (ala Johnny Lightning or, the day-glo STP cars etc). I remember race cars from the 60's 70's and 80's by the paint schemes. I became a fan of certain teams, cars and drivers because of the way the cars appeared. Young fans, in particular, are very impressionable. Ignore the fans and you'll lose them or, worse yet, never get them in the first place. The racing "community" as a whole, is not doing a very good promoting our sport. The crowd is getting older and older. Yes, they'll get Chuck's money and my money no matter what the color, however, there aren't enough of us die-hards around, anymore, to pay the all the bills. We need to create new fans.....somehow.

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I score MSCS races and I would love a large number on the nose and tail tank. It would also be sweet if guys using a letter would put one on that I could see from the booth A 3 inch letter at 100 mph is a real ***** to see Thanks for letting me vent

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This is very well put. It more or less echoes my feelings and is the underlying reason I bring this up.

And thanks to everyone for chiming in. It's very enlightening.

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Re: Car Colors
 

This thread fits in nicely with one of my pet peeves. For non-wing racing to grow its fan base it needs to find more than the non-wing thing to set it apart: 1. As stated earlier, paint schemes which set cars apart are great for the newbie 2. we need to find ways to once again make the view of the driver "at work" easier for the spectator, especially the newbies. I understand the need for the right side cover, but it certainly would be nice to be able to once again watch them wrasslin' these things around!

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I couldn't agree more, Bill, but you left out one important factor: contrast. I spent lots of years in the graphics industry, and am a firm believer in the "form follows function" theory. Cars have names/numbers for one purpose only, and that's identification (function). If the lettering is a beautiful piece of design (form) but can't be read, then why bother. Outlined lettering is, in my opinion, way overused, simply because most of the time the outline is proportionately too large for the character size or there isn't sufficient contrast between the car, the lettering, and the outline. Outlines are OK as long as they don't impede legibility. If a driver wants to run a visor with his/her name on it, which I personally like, think contrast. Because names on the visor are usually fairly small, keep it a simple font, one that's easily read at speed and from a reasonable distance.

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You want different? Check out Jimmy Lights car

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Nothing cooler than a flat black car with a #1 in duct tape on it.............i.e. Kurt Gross........JMO

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Kurt Had a big 1 with a X almost the same size could read his number while he was still in turn four :6:

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Chris Nunn, as I was reading the posts I thought like you did. Here it is, and boy does it have color. This is the midget.

http://u1.ipernity.com/26/35/39/33363539.437fcbf7.jpg
IMG 1622 copy par Chris Pedersen, on ipernity

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My favorite was Ballou a couple years ago where they thrashed all night to get another car together. got to the track, were told they had to have a number on the tank and only had enough duct tape for a ? mark

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I love a car with gold numbers. One of my favorite color schemes.

http://davidm.smugmug.com/Other/Port...SC_0097-X2.jpg

Our car has a black frame and a red body for one simple reason......that's the color it was when we bought it.

I used to care about stickers and wraps. At some point you realize you are spending a lot of money on something that doesn't make you any faster and just gets beat up after awhile.

I appreciate manufacturers giving me stickers when I buy something. We give those to the little kids that stop by our pit area on race nights.

Just thinking out loud here. Why would it be so difficult to wrap a Sprint car which has a lot smaller body then it is to wrap a modified? Is this a money thing where modifieds have more money or weight difference? There are very few modifieds that aren't wrapped.

It's only marginally more difficult to wrap a midget/sprint compared to a mod/late model. The curves of the body make it slightly more complicated.
It's just a style thing here in Indiana. No body seems to want a car with a nice color scheme.
The cars in Indiana have nothing on the cars in Pennsylvaina and the rest of the east coast. Non wingers should take a cue from the wing guys...

16 out of the 22 starters Sunday were black. I kept thinking Thorson was Rico, couldn't tell them apart. I almost never knew which Lein car was which. Why can't the team cars be painted differently? They could flip the colors or something. I get that paint or vinyl costs money. But, when every single stock car at our local track can afford it, I think most midget teams could. The problem is the modern day owners just don't care what the cars look like. Did you also notice the stands were less than half full? A coincidence? I think so. I used to be a fan of certain cars because of how they looked, regardless of who drove them or how fast they were. I used to day dream about them all the time. This year, there hasn't been one car that I've thought about once I left the track. I used to drive an old VW car at Sun Prairie with an Edmunds hood. I would get a ton of people looking at the car after the races and signed a bunch of autographs. They always commented how much they liked the car. When I moved into a modern style car, hardly anyone came by anymore.

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I notice that its ok to discuss how other people should spend they're money. Im sure everyone out there would love to have nice looking cars.

Reality is, Is it more important to be able to rebuild your motor after a couple dozen races or paint your car while it sits in the shop motorless because It sure looks pretty.

10g-20g-30g + Sponsorships, Im sure they'll be happy to make it look nice for ya. Take it to the Mall in the winter and market etc.

Heres a real scenario a few years back. USAC Eldora opener. All these cars showed up with pretty paint jobs, lettering, numbering, By the end of the night USAC had a trailer load of busted hoods and body panels from rocks and mud clods, many teams were out more on hoods and paint jobs than they would get in return if they didn't finish better than third.

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Chuck, couldn't agree with you more, for what it would cost me to KEEP my car bright and shiny, it puts fuel in my tanks, tires on the corners, food in my belly, and helps pay entry fees. Some cars are nice looking, with just the basic stuff, the main thing being clean, don't roll it out of the trailer with 3 weeks of racing mud still on it, even if it is just one color, or no color, if it's clean, it's OK, cause by the time the first heat race is over, it won't be clean anymore. I use prepainted aluminum for my hood, and body panels, and for under 75 bucks I can replace them all, but after several years, they still look OK to me, it'd be nice to have new shiny wheels, and a different paint scheme at least every year, but it has nothing to do with making it any faster, or getting a bigger pay out, and with no sponsors but myself to worry about, I don't worry about it, if I had to have my fuel tank repainted, it'd probably cost me 300 bucks, which will buy a lot of diesel gas. Getting there, and getting the job done, is my main focus, there was a time when I could afford the NICE stuff, and I did, but not lately! Bob

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A new body usually comes in white or black, so most people put numbers, a name, and sponsors on the side and leave it a plain color because a custom wrap can cost atleast $800 and paint can also cost $800. And the first time a sprint car or midget touches the track, rocks and mud ding your awesome paint job, not to mention the fact that each trip on the track could result in a wreck that could destroy that nice paint job. Plus at the end of the day I would rather have a spare frame, and extra shocks, so when I do wreck it I can race the next weekend. And nice paint jobs will not help you win any race. But, if if someone want to pay to design my car I will have no problem with it.

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I started painting my cars yellow so I could see the thing as it goes around the track; old age is a pain sometimes.
I gave up on show quality paint & use spray bomb tractor paint with some vinyl to mimic the old Wynn's Friction Proofing style. It takes time and only looks good from 20 feet away but it is what I can afford.
When we raced with Badger in the 1970s there was a rule about "professional appearance." You were allowed only ONE race weekend in primer. After that you had to look decent. That said, we selected a paint color to match duct tape and requested #11 so we could number it with fancy engine turned foil tape. No money for a sign painter.
What about the safety issue of so many black cars? Didn't the USAC Focus west division have issues on poorly lit tracks?
Team cars can at least put contracting tape on the roll bar padding to help the scorers.

Fans want cars painted different colors which cost money but when Dave Darland's car owner Steve and Carla Phillips ask for $500 to help keep getting Dave to the Track, Everyone on here started to complain, I just don't think fans understand the true cost of racing

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My favorite color is gel coat white...

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Great Post!
Best Regards,
John:32:

Race cars are the same as going to a horse race or show. Everyone complains about "all" the horses are Bay colored. Everyone likes a Paint or a white socked black horse. But at the end of the day. Everyone loves the one getting there picture taken and the biggest check at the pay window.

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Not me unless my money was on that horse ;)

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My Lightning Sprint has right now nine different colors from the body panels to the 4130 custom made steering and rear radius rods. Some of the painting I did myself others I had two different body shops do $$$. If you count the wings that will make ten colors. I really enjoyed putting the different color combinations together more work than most people realize!!!

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When I was active with my team back home, I was bent on a good looking car. And I paid the price for such. I was the guy who did the armor-all on the tires for the heat races.. Painted the white hoosiers every week, and CLEANED the car.

As for looks, I still pay for the wraps, because when I show people what I do and did, I hate to show em a blank car with some die-cut decals. Yeah, it costs a lot, but for me, and the owner too, it was satisfying to hear that we've got the best looking car on the track. Easy to see, basic colors that contrast well. No flashy barbed wire, smoke and fire, dragons and stuff (the modifieds come to mind). Basic and clean. Have we been beaten by cars with WD-40'd chassis and gel-coat fiberglass, and duct tape numbers, yeah many times. But the 800 bucks I put into the looks of the car, or team alone, as we've got shirts too is money well spent IMO. And realistically, that 800 would go into the motor, or tires, fuel, whatever.. But when were building stuff out of our garage, and running against Don Ott and Wessmar engines, if were gonna finish 6th, were gonna look good doing it.

Attachment 11786
Attachment 11787

16 black cars are better then no cars folks.