Observations from an old fan
 

This is going to be kind of long, so I apologize in advance.

My wife and I attended the ISW finale at Tri-State Saturday night. It was only our 4th race in about the last 10 years. We are not new fans however. During the 70's, 80's and 90's we attended hundreds of sprint, midget and Silver Crown races at venues all over the country. Since it had been since 2008 since we had last attended a USAC sprint race, we were struck by several things:

1.) I am all for safety...we lost SO many drivers in the early years. With that said, I hate the fact that so many cars have just a 6"-8" opening on the right (crowd) side that the driver now looks through. And many cars now have a high left side too. Being able to see the driver was a big part of the excitement of going to the races. I am disappointed that today's youngsters will never be able to see the drivers at work.

2.) People on here complain to high heaven about the "tractor show" or "tractor parade" at Tri-State Speedway. Obviously, these folks never sat through an hour of track prep after qualifying and again before the feature at Terre Haute during the 70's and 80's. It was NOT uncommon for hot laps to begin at noon and the feature to checker at 5:30 or 6 PM. Tri-State admitted to "dragging their feet" a little and we still walked out 4 hrs after hot laps started.

3) What happened to interviewing the top qualifier? Are drivers too busy to be interviewed now? Or is it just that Tr-State doesn't interview anyone? Get the drivers out in front of the crowd!!

4.) From what we saw, the average age of the crowd in the backstretch grandstand was probably well in to the 40's. We saw very few people in their 20's and even fewer children. IMO this is very concerning for the future of the sport.

5.) Today's racers certainly are more physical with there equipment than the racers of the earlier era. Bumping and banging seem to be just a part of it today. Years ago that would get you a severe talking to if not worse from the officials, and certainly an agitated discussion would occur back int he pit area.

I am certainly not saying that we should go back to the way things were in the 70's and 80's! It was a dangerous era and too many great drivers were lost or severely injured. I do believe though that for the future of the sport a way needs to be found to contain costs and get more young people involved and attending races.

Steve

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:7::7::7::7::7::17::17::17::17::17:

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You have done 16 post without any of it being positive. Maybe you need to go haunt someother web site If you really had read Steves post he brought up some good problems that need addressed

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Openwheelfan1

As a mechanic I can tell you sometimes the biggest discovery of a car's problem are detected when the mechanic make the first test drive. Problems with a car's performance usually happen so gradually that the owner does not pay any attention to them. The mechanic on the other hand discovers them right away because they are so pronounced to him.

Because you were once a very avid race fan who has been away for some time, you like the mechanic pick up on these problems right away. Yor post should be read very carefully by people involved with racing. Some of these changes have happened very slowly and perhaps are the reason for the lack of new blood you noticed in the stands the other night. Racing has two distinct type of participants, those in the pits and on the race track and those in the grand stands. Both have a very different view of what racing should and should not be. The big problem is the racers in the pits and on the track do not take those fans in the grand stands view into account very often. They just can't find time to interact with the crowd.Racing is controlled by the back gate crowd, with very little concern for those people paying to come in the front gate.

Racing depends on the front gate crowd who also invest a great deal of time and money into our sport.

I have noticed the same things you have, and wish others would also. Discovering and admitting you have a problem is the first step in taking care of that problem.

Racing as we know and love can not exist without the front gate. We all>>> both front and back gate crowd>>>> need to work together to help bring about change to make going to the races fun for everyone.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

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I've always loved the meet and great with the driver segments. It helps the fan to put a face to the car, and it also helps the driver to get some free publicity. The only problem I see with that is it takes up more time in the show's schedule. Also I've noticed that promotion has suffered a lot as of late. Those in the general public usually have no idea that there might be a race going on not 5 miles from them that they would like to go watch, heck some might not even know there's a track within that same 5 miles from them. Is it really that hard for a track promoter to solicit a spot in the local news paper or radio network?

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Just a observation and not to criticize any promoter here. I believe they are doing what they think is best for their track and $$

I notice a HUGE difference in the number of kids at tracks that allow the 10 or 12 and under in free, Have been told by many parents that used to go, It's just too expensive to haul the kids too now.

I don't know the answer and its only a thought, Wouldn't it be better to get the two 12-15 dollar adult admissions and all the concessions that go along with it than nothing at all?

Also know a couple tracks run kids club type things. For a couple bucks they get a coloring book, some other things and a chance at a pic in victory lane..

While this particular instance given is USAC $25 premium tickets and the fact that a third to a half of the attendees are doing most, if not the whole tour camping/motel. I can see where kids would add a huge expense to 9 days of travel and entertainment and therefore might not be relevant to the overall scheme of things.

I feel for promoters, There are so many options and getting people in the gates *Although I find the entertainment and competition totally worth the $$* is a daunting job indeed.

That being said. Sprintweek had stellar crowds and stellar car counts and again, Both probably have nothing to do with the overall scheme of things as generally counts have been down.

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OK Here Comes My 2 Cents On ISW !!! I am the official chaufuer for the President Of H.A.R.F. and we hit all of the races during ISW except I cant make the one at LPS because its my auction night.Poor Bob Has To Drive Himself lol. We have a great time taking advantage of the down time before Hot Laps and Quals. Every track does their best to make ISW and their weelky shows the best they can be. Yes, We Can All Find Something To B**CH About but put yourselves in the promoters shoes and you will feel different. Each track has the good and bad, But if you didnt think the show at KOKOMO with DD Bouncing Off The Wall More Than Once And Getting The Win Was Awesome maybe its time you saved your money and stayed home !! Not being Mean just putting in my 2 Cents. The Drivers From Every Race We Saw Winners Or Not Were ALL WINNERS !! One Last Comment, If you didnt think the Dunk Tank At B Ton Was Fan Interaction You Missed The Boat !!! Those Guys Are Still Dripping FroM The Dunking !! See You At A Track Soon And Before We Know It ISW Will Be Back Again !!!:D

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Only bad thing about ISW, is that it is too short! JMO..............

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I think you need to draw a distinction between constructive criticism (i.e. evaluation) and "********". In every work or recreational experience there must be a place for objective evaluation or there will no improvement nor will problems ever be addressed.

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From another old fan. Just spent an enjoyable weekend with friends at the Grove. Helped the local economy. Enjoyed that beautiful area of Pennsylvania for my fifth Grove race of the year. So what if it's 430 miles from home. Visited the EMMR as we always do. Saw Lance win his 300th victory. Saw the Posse beat the Outlaws. Talked racing with the neighboring drunks during the three hour rain delay. Time passes quickly with quality conversation. And when we get old and are sitting on the porch, we plan to be talking about the races we saw, not the ones we didn't see. Wait a minute! We're in our seventies and already are doing that. But we're adding NEW stories. :10:

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As for Indiana Sprint WEEK....Wish it was sprint MONTH,,,,but this ol' man wouldn't be able to hold out.

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I would think USAC would be in charge of driver interviews as they ran the sprint car part of the show and had their own announcer as well. Tri-State has a habit of interviewing the top three finishers at all their shows and I like that. I also always see TV ads for all Tri-State shows and a couple of friends heard ads on the radio for the Sprintweek show as well so the Helfrich's do promote their track. They used to do tug-o-wars once a year for fun and it was always a kick to watch. Speedway Man has had a lower profile this year but he recently mishandled some kryptonite so that may explain his abscence. I see quite a few young people at the track myself but an informal poll done by the announcer one night would be interesting. Have the 20-30 year olds stand, then the 30-40 and on up the ladder. If half the crowd never stands because they can't then you know there's a problem. HA HA I thought the crowds and car counts were outstanding especially when you consider the state of the economy and the lack of leadership in righting the ship. It shows just how passionate the fans are for the most exciting sort of motorsports there is -- Sprints on Dirt!!!

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Tom I believe that Kryptonite was Mrs. Speedway man ;)

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The dunk tank was a real good idea. It brought excitement to some of the down time cooled off the drivers and was an outlet for the fans. Promoters have to promote and the gang back in the pits need to help them promote their antics.

The best promotion besides the guy that jumps in the box with the stick of dynamite that I can remember as a kid was the promoter at the Sports-Drome down in Jeffersonville In. managed to find a guy with a heard of Camels. He decided to drag race them with the most popular drivers on board as Jockeys. It brought out a great crowd with the grandstands filled on both sides of the race track.

However it did backfire on him just a tad bit, Andy Hampton one of his big name drivers at the time fell off one of them dumb things during his race and broke his arm putting him out of commission for several weeks.

We need to do whatever it takes to make the show more enjoyable for the fans. It may take having the drivers leave the pits for a bit to help the promoter out. Way back in the day the purse was a percentage of the gate and the more people they could get through the turn stiles the more money the racers made. I am going to make a personal search for that Camel Rancher if any Promoters are interested, I figure him to be about a hundred and ten by now.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

I don't say to much on here but Mr Steve brought up some good points about the younger people getting them to the race track .
I kinda of worried about future of our sport I seen some folks on here knock on promoters about kids bicycle race ,fire works etc I don't mind them because them kids are our future fans . I my self was one of them kids in the bike race in the 70's forty years still a fan.
Also like to see the drivers meet the fans a little more i was so impressed to meet Dave Darling it was like he wanted to meet me .
I also met some race fans from Wisconsin during ISW week they explained there race track situation up north .he said you Hoosier don't realize how lucky you all are to have so many tracks to go too. I walked away not minding chewing on the dust from terre haute. We all should try to take care of our sport .

It is sad to see fewer younger people at the races each year. I for one don't think it's so much ticket price as it is technology. Kids hardly leave the house anymore, playing video games and watching tv are hobbies for kids now, it's sad because they aren't true hobbies but it's true. Fortunately for me I grew up at a race track, was even blessed enough to race for several years. It's in my blood and I'll be at any track within 3 hours of me barring I'm off work and have no other commitments. My girlfriend and I brought her niece(8) and nephew(10). They had a blast, and at TSS kids 10 and under were free so the cost us nothing to get them through the gate. They are already talking about going again. I feel the issue isn't the kids but adults not trying to step up and bring kids to the track. Her niece and nephew's parents would have never brought them to the track so her and I did. They got pictures autographs, souvenirs, and memories. They will return. The sport will only grow as we allow it to, by showing up to complain about dust, or tractors, or bleachers isn't moving open wheel racing in the right direction. Take you grand kids, or nieces and nephews to a race a few times a year. They'll grow to love it like we do or they will rot away in front of a computer or tv. This is not to be taken negatively just my 2 cents. Our sport will grow as our fans grow, period.

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I think the fact the crowd is of an older breed is a good point that was brought up. Now being in my 20s I don't see a ton of 20something people in the stands. I have a few friends that will come with me once in awhile but a lot just aren't interested in the idea of, "going to their first dirt race" when I ask them. Most of the time I'm at the track with my dad, whom is the reason I love being at the track in the first place.

Another thing I see a lot of is instead of going to watch the races a lot of the younger crowd just see it as an excuse to drink WAY too much alcohol to the point they have no clue what's even going on as far as on the track. Eldora Speedway being the worst for this kind of behavior especially at the big ticket shows (Dream, Kings Royal, World 100).

Trying to get younger fans involved is certainly something we as fans, drivers, owners, promoters, etc...should all be mindful of because like or not all of this is a business and everything comes down to $. If there's no cash flow the sport as we know it will vanish. That being said I wish I had an answer to the problem but I dont.

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One of my favorite family pictures is my brother in I standing next to Al Unser's Sprint car on a open trailer at the Indy Mile. I wish more people took the time to go to the pits after the races. When your 10yo getting to touch a race car, is a very big deal. Everyone is in too big of a hurry, to get somewhere today. When the drivers started getting merchandising trailers, it killed the after race meet the drivers. The Outlaws are the worst, by the time the fans can get to the pits their gone. Some may disagree with me, but it will kill ever getting new fans & Kids interested.

I caught the last night of isw . Loved the track but saw something that bothered me a little . A 10 yr old kid booed a driver with his mom n dad . We need to make gd fans as much as new fans . Knoxville has a new promotion " kids free night " I believe 18 n under free . I was at the first one and it was great to see all the kids there . They r having another one this Saturday and I'll b there , hope they have another great turnout of the future fans ! Should b a great show too !!! Lots of travelers tuning up for the 360 and 310 nationals .

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People 30 and under and people with kids don't want to come watch an hour long tractor show two times a night, they want to get there, see a show and then leave. If you can't prep a track for the night, you can kiss those fans goodbye,

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Did that show with the track work take any longer than the other shows?
If not, Whats the B&**#

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You, sir, shouldn't disgrace Opperman's name with such drivel.

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Paragon Speedway, sat July 26 Family Night Adults $10 Kids 12 & under FREE also Kids bicycle races. A Kid won't be at the races unless you take them.

That about sums it up Mr. Ford! 👍

Re: Observations from an old fan
 

Tri State ran USAC last .so people could go to the pits after the races and the drivers and cars would still be there The pits were packed and people were walking around with smiles on their faces kids were getting stuff signed and getting to sit in some of the cars. Thanks TSS and Drivers and owners and crews for doing this :6:. Seeing this reminded me of getting to do that when I was a kid years ago Man that Ben Her was a gasser ;)

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In the "for what its worth" category, and not taking anything away from Keith Ford at Paragon, per Tr-State's website, kids 12 and under are free for all of their events. That seems to be the policy at most of the Indiana tracks, or was when we used to attend regularly. What we didn't see a lot of at Tri-State Speedway Saturday night was families. There were lots of guys, and lots of couples, and there were a few couples with a young (under 7) child in tow, but there weren't hardly any with multiple children and almost no pre-teen (10-12) kids in attendance, at least not on the backstretch. Since we haven't been attending races much for the last 10 years, I don't know if this is what is now normal or was unusual.

And before someone asks, we stopped going to so many races due to life getting in the way. A son in college participating in athletics involved lots of travel that taxed the budget in the early 2000's. Retirement and some health issues taxed the budget in the later 2000's. Moving 300 miles SW of Indy made races harder to get to. Not complaining about any of it. Just life!

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Clay County Speedway in Flora always has plenty of kids and families attending. They also spend a lot of energy and attention to making it fun for the kids to come. Bike races, bike give aways, Easter egg hunts, kids clubs, selecting kids as trophy presenters, driver autograph sessions. They make an effort and it pays off. Many tracks don't even make an effort, then people complain when there aren't any kids there. Of course some people on here complain when kids ARE there, so who knows.

Another issue now that I don't think has been brought up. Kids aren't going to as many races to watch because many odnthem are already racing themselves. Which also takes mom and dad away too.

Back in the day you couldn't race this young, now you can. Makes a big difference.

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Itook my 5yo grandsons too TSS specifically for the Deere show and speedway man.There ape over that stuff.I aways see youngsters having a great time doing everything but watching the race,rolling in the grass at bton,playing with toy racecars in the bleachers etc.

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When the kids were little they would save the dirt off of the race cars, and take it home and build miniature race tracks on a piece of plywood complete with bill boards, pits flag stands etc to race their Match Box sprints on, They even went so far as to clip the wings on some of them. Best I can remember I think they even had a miniature Chili Bowl with real Chili Bowl Dirt.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

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This has to be the most constructive, well thought out and educated statement I've seen on here in a long time. Well said sir!!!!! To all of those that think he is just moaning and groaning are NOT reading (as usual) the entire posting line for line. I to have seen a decrease in the 20 and younger fans. Under 12 free is a great way to boost that. Also kudos to LPS for having the kids being allowed in the pits free!!!! This needs to be known and recognized!!! Other promoters should take notice. Anyway it was a GREAT POSTING !!!

I've brought up the same point about the looks of the cars and being able to see the drivers. After the race at Terre Haute I actually offered Robert Ballou sponsor money if he would run the next race there without an arm guard!!! He looked at me strangely and said,"I don't follow you." He seemed to be unaware that sprint cars ever ran that way. He asked a crew member if USAC would even allow it. lol. He then gave the standard excuse that rocks would hit his arm. Just a few years ago I ran my silver crown car at Eldora with no arm guard to appease fans against the crew chiefs advise. He said I was crazy but you know what, nothing ever hit my arm there in three races. The worst I ever got in a midget was a small bruise that I considered a badge of honor. Point is, today's drivers and owners just don't car much what the cars look like or what the fans like.
As far as the age of the fans goes, have the stands ever been packed with 20 something's? In 34 years of attending races it seems to me the crowd has always been dominated by older folks. They are the ones who can afford to go the most often. And as far as the little ones go, I got the feeling they were left at home for sprint week so parents could party it up. I had a blast hanging out with people and I think it's ok not to drag the kids along one trip a year so parents can relax and have fun. I did bring my 7 year old but it was a constant battle dealing with restroom visits, concession stand visits, and just trying to keep him sitting still during the action!

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Very few Track owners are "Promoters"....

The "Races" are held for the FANS.... not car owners ! duuhhhh

All decisions based in the following manner..

Fans first

Drivers 2nd

Car owners... dead last...

All promotions do Qualifying.

Then ALL events are FULL reverse....period...

Simple enough...

who.. is the problem....?

Car Owners......every time...

Just try and find a Track owner who knows how to run a show....

Lincoln speedway in Pa.. is the BEST RUN SHOW ive seen in 30 years....

The Grove isn't even close....:)

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Which is exactly why I refuse to purchase any souvenirs at WoO events.

steiny
:32:

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DAD, treat this guy nice, we've done quite a bit of business on Ebay over the years! Bob

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If the races are run for the fans then you can buy the cars and pay for them to race too!

:7::7::7::7::7::7::7::7::7:

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I wonder how many on here as Kids started as going to Jalopy races, the 1930 Ford/Chevy coupe type. It was super afordable, popcorn and Coke was about it for concessions. Coke in one of those about 6oz paper cups. They had Hot Laps, Trophy Dash, Heats, Consi and Feature. Sometimes they had a "Powder Puff" race, which was fun to watch. Seems the cars were colorful. I must have had a great time as I can remember it as though it was last week.

I remember the first Super Modified race I went to, seemed the cars were going 750 miles an hour. I again was super impressed with the first sprint car race I attended, open face helmets, No Cage, big fairgrounds grand stand, the drivers were sort of gentlemanly. Working the wheel, some really fighting it even on the straight. Those cars always seemed to slide further and go faster.

I am sure todays kids find todays races just as exciting.

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Ghost::

I would wager that you probably never got the chance to watch Jan race or ever met and talked to him after a race. Do you think that his popularity came only from the way he worked and interacted with a race car, or maybe could his people power be partially a big factor in his legendary status.

Car owners know that it also depends on the fans to help finance their endeavors. You should look up some local Go Kart club that supports its activities on the back gate only and jump in with both feet and above all else "Enjoy Yourself"!!!

Honest Dad himself:6: you also ate up all the images!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!

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I damn sure don't put my car on the racetrack for guys like that!!!!!!!!!!:17::17::17::17::17::17::17::17::17:

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After reading through all the posts, I'd like to add some opinions / observations / experiences. First a little background on me. I'm 25 years old. I've raced since 2004 (mini cups, 600 uprights, Street Stocks, TQ's, Lightning Sprints). I started out as a NASCAR fan around 1999 to 2000. I saw my first USAC Sprint car race in 2009 (Sprint Week finale @ Haubstadt). I'm now a pretty die-hard open wheel fan. I think non-wing sprint car racing is the greatest form of racing on Earth, and I think the Indianopolis Motor Speedway has always been and will always be the greatest speedway on Earth (being a Hoosier, that was embedded in me before I became a race fan myself). I have been a racer on the track a lot more than a fan in the stands, but I'm catching up on my spectating more the last couple years. So here are some suggestions from the 20-something crowd:

*TAKE A BUDDY - My Dad and I attended that first sprint car race in 2009 at Tri-State. It was the coolest thing I had ever seen by far. We left thinking, "Mom's gotta see this". So we went back and took her along. Even not being a die hard race fan, she was impressed and amazed and it didn't take much persuading to get her back again. The next year, we took two car loads with some buddies, an uncle, and a cousin, and introduced them to Sprint Car racing. Again, no one knew what they were in for, and no one left disappointed. This year, I took another friend and his wife, along with my fiance back to the ISW finale. I spent the entire road trip telling them how awesome it was going to be. I'm sure they were skeptical. My buddy and his wife had not been to any dirt race before, so this was a complete culture shock. The sprints rolled out to warm their motors, and my buddy said, "Aw, he must be having trouble. They're having to push him." (I guess I forgot to mention of few things on the way down). They were instant fans the second that hot laps fired off, and they're already ready to go again. The sport sells itself if you can just bug people to death long enough to go with you! Non-race fans may take a little more adjusting, but take some of your NASCAR fanatic friends with you. They already like racing - show them something good for a change! After watching a guy back it into the corner, hammer off the cushion, and ride a wheelie past the flag stand, it's hard to look at 500 miles of mediocre the same way.

DRIVERS NEED TO INTERACT - Taking time to meet the fans and make the night special for them helps everyone - the drivers, the fans, the track, the series. I was fortunate enough to have a good year at my local track last season. We ran all the races there, won a few, and won the track championship. I have hero cards that I ordered from vista print. I designed them on the computer and just had them made there. I forget how much they were, but I ordered a big box in 2012 and I've been handing them out pretty hard for 3 years now, so it was definitely a good investment. I started going into the stands last season after every race and signing autographs, talking with the fans, and especially taking time with the kids. They really love meeting the drivers and having a little keepsake. I've wore a black cowboy hat at the track for several years as kind of a trademark. Along with the hero cards, I started giving a cowboy hat away to a kid on some nights. On one occasion, I gave one to a little boy (about 5 years old) and autographed it. The next week, when I went back in the stands, he was back at the races wearing that hat, and he gave me a picture he drew of my car, COMPLETE WITH SOME OF MY SPONSORS LOGOS ON IT. That made my night and his. Driver's that don't take advantage of this kind of interaction with the fans are missing one of the most enjoyable parts of being a driver and missing the opportunity to promote themselves, the track, and the future of our kind of racing.

THE TRACTOR SHOW DOESN'T HURT ANYONE - There are a lot of great race tracks in Indiana, but for me it's hard to find anything to complain about at Haubstadt. The track prep is the best in the country and it shows with great racing all night long. I've seen 4 ISW races there over the course of 6 years, and I think you could probably set up your car this year the same way you did 6 years ago and be right on the money. It's smooth, it's consistent, and it's great racing. I personally kind of enjoy watching them work the track and see what goes into it - and it really doesn't take long if you consider they have a fresh, fast track ready in about 20 minutes or so. I've raced at a lot of places where they leave it set for a couple weeks, dump some water on it, pack it in, and call it good. Busted oil pans, and broken spindles later, some might disagree. Another thing about reworking the track is that it gives fans a chance to get something to eat, grab a jacket out of the truck, and check out some t-shirts for sale; and it gives teams a chance to make adjustments, and it gives drivers a chance to mingle with the fans (as mentioned above). This year's ISW event at Putamville was a hell of a race, but once hot laps started, you didn't want to venture away from your seat for more than a couple of minutes or you'd miss something worth seeing - which was every time a car was on the track.

I'll leave it at that for now. Tune in next time when I explain why I agree that kids under the age of 12-15 should be in the stands now and racing themselves a little later. :22: