Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

Who makes the best FC seat in your experience? Kirkey? Butlerbuilt?
Why is it the Best?
Does everyone use FC or do some use a more traditional seat with net on LS?
What can be done to protect spine in hard landing? Gel seat cushion? What's out there?

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

I use a pavement ButlerBuilt FC with added dense foam under me. It actually came out of Brian Scott's nationwide car. Sure it's a little beefy but I've taken some tumbles and it has held up quite well.

There are still quite a few drivers that use head nets and I used to be one of them. It's not bad, but I sure am glad I have my full containment seat.

I by no means am saying its the best, but it's what I use and I am very happy with my purchase.

JJ

It's a lot about personal preference. I dont like the way Butler fits me, so I bought a fC kirkey. I just added a custom molded insert done by Dave Sharpley at DJS. Uses impact absorbing beads that can be formed to the curvature of your body. Even custom seats do not conform to the curvature of the body.

Butlerbuilt to me is by far the strongest and most comfortable. They have the most padding and their E-Z sert molding that molds to your lower body not only increases safety,but adds a bunch of comfort in that area.

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

Ask Joey Saldana after last nights crash.

There's this product, as far as padding goes. I know one person who runs it, he said it was very comfortable but he hadn't taken a big spill with it yet.

http://www.802solutions.com/analysis/

Butlerbuilt hands down....

Look at Marcus niemelas USAC accident from a couple years ago....


I watched a kirkey full containment seat bend all sorts of directions after a fairly good tumble by a fellow racer, after seeing the seat afterwards I would never run a kirkey

Isp seats. Heavy and not the prettiest but the best seat on market

LaJoie seats have had one since 2005 and they work great

I run Ultra-Shield seats and have always been very happy with them.

Something to think about.. a bent seat means some energy was absorbed by the seat instead of your body and brain. I don't believe stiffer is always better.

-Justin Grant

Butlerbuilt is the safest, most comfortable seat in the business! Don't trust your life with any other brand! Call 800-621-7328.

I've used custom Butlerbuilt Seats since the early days of full containment seats in 2002.

Thanks,

J.T. Stapp

I see a lot of really poorly mounted seats. Guys all proud of their custom seat then they do a half-assed job of putting it in the car.

Any seat is only as good as how it's installed.

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

Richardson gives me a great deal so I'm very loyal to them because they are a sponsor... that being said.. I've never seen anyone complain about a Butlerbuilt and there are a million of them sitting on the shelves if you need one. I've seen a few Ultra Shields bend, and I just don't like the Kirkeys. I can tell you Steve Richardson will be more than happy to help you out because he doesn't make alot of sprint seats. I find my Richardson seats to be just as thick, sturdy and well built as the Butlerbuilts; and they are 22lbs (6lbs lighter than Butler). That being said... just do your research and don't skimp out on $300 when it comes to safety gear. Good luck!

Lajoie! The best available.

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

Not to be contrary, but the Marcus wreck you mentioned is one that concerns me. I'm coming to sprints from dirt late models and I've witnessed as the rise in popularity of FC seats increased, there was a corresponding rise in concussion brain injuries and trapped drivers unable to escape in a fire. Some people don't consider concussions as being serious, but after watching a TED talk on a study they've been doing and what they've learned about what actually happens to the brain during impacts, I'm not sure totally rigid is what you want, like Justin Grant mentioned. As a matter of fact the new seat regulations being thrust onto the DLM world is why I'm leaving late models, they essentially are trapping you in the car and I refuse to put myself in a situation where under even perfect conditions its difficult to get out, add in being upside down or God forbid, a fire... When I broached this subject with one of the series officials, he told me, "Don't worry we're gonna come get you out with a fire blanket"... So he expects I should just wait in the car as it burns while they respond with a blanket. No thanks, I'll go learn how to race wingless sprints.

Anyway I like the way USAC approaches the seats leaving some driver preference and options. I appreciate all the input and I'm taking everybit into consideration.

Oh yeah, congrats on the twins Justin.:6::8:

I am partial to a rigid seat. I have both an older (2005) Kirkey, and a Butler built. I have never been sore after wrecking with either of those seats. I have been hurt when my seats have bent. Of course, this could be a function of the severity of the wrecks. On the concussion front, the worst concussion I suffered in a race car was in a car with no head rest and double window nets. Look at the new Butler built seats, the head rests have huge pads to help decelerate the head. I like my Butler, my Kirkey requires a bit more work to mount properly, as it needs extra supports to be sufficiently rigid, but with my current frame I can make myself more comfortable on the car with that seat. As important as seats are, seat belt mounting is just as important. If your belt geometry is not right, the belts will not work right. I spent 10 months with a limp because of this fact, and I am lucky it wasn't worse.

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

Just like with helmets, firesuits and seatbelts... there is no "Best" or "Worst"... proper installation and perfect fit are way more crucial to protecting yourself than brand name or price. A $275 closeout simpson voyager helmet that fits right will protect you much better than a brand new $1200 carbon helmet thats a size-size and a half too big. A fresh $70 set of crow belts that are properly mounted and adjusted will protect you more than a 3 year old set of $400 hooker ratcheting belts that were never maintained and are mounted at the wrong angle.

For somebody new to this side of the sport with no point of reference your best option is clearly to go with a new seat that was built to fit your body. Next best option would be walking into some place like saferacer, Speedway motors, Smileys, Indy raceparts, etc and taking advantage of their large inventory by actually pulling a handfull of kirkeys, ultrashields, and butler EZs off the shelf and stuffing your butt in each one until you find the perfect fit.

A used seat is not out of the question, but it will be a needle in a haystack hunt...especially for somebody that is 500 miles away from the nearest functioning sprintcar team like you are.
If buying used make sure that you are actually getting an 8-10 degree seat instead of the 20 degree layback stockcar seats...make sure the seat hasn't had multiple mounting holes drilled in the same area, make sure the structural integrity hasn't been compromised due to damage or a hack job to make it fit in a certain car.

Safest in the business? Facts please

I saw this thread a couple of days ago and started to comment and then I didn't.

Justin Grant brings up and excellent point. My experience with seats from the beginning includes Kirkey double wrap seats without headrests (double head nets) all the way through full containment style seats.

I don't have any physical evidence to give other than my symptoms after big accidents. I can tell you from my experience that with the Kirkey Style double wrap standard seat my body would be way more beat up after a crash without having the shoulder containment and head containment to keep you from flopping around in a violent crash, but the concussions were not as severe.

With the full containment style seats I ran later in my career, my body didn't get beat up near as bad but I sustained more concussions with a full containment seat than I did without one. IMO, the close proximity of the head supports creates a "ping pong" effect with the head/brain.

Like I said earlier, my personal symptoms are my only evidence, but with the FC seat, conscussions seemed to come easier from smaller hits.

To back up Justin's point, when I was younger I had a conversation with Bob East about cars and seats giving way in big wrecks (my thinking was that they were less safe), but the energy that gets dissipated is very important. If the seat and car don't give a little, then the driver takes all of that energy.

All of that said, I personally loved the Ultrashield products. Those guys are good to work with and a fair price. Old man Hunt in Lincoln, NE builds a nice custom seat, but they are not very forgiving on the ribs. I never sat in a Butlerbuilt. Kirkey has not done much with development like their competitors in recent years. LaJoie builds a nice seat, contours to lower back nice, I did not like the feel of no rib wraps though.

If I had it to do all over again, I would spend the time and money on a custom molded insert. None of the seats provide good lower back support.

I will give facts why I think isp is, it strong where needs to be flexible where needs be, rib support is mainly to keep your spine straight it is also one of weaker points of the body, so good padding and seat with some flex there good thing. The hips and shoulders are strongest parts of your body, that where you want solid seat to support you in crash. Isp has the the rids area strong yet soft enough, hips shoulders strong. Isp standard seat is heavier then some others and doesn't look as nice as others. Isp does build a light weight seat, but isp told me pri few years it will bend, he only made it because people wouldn't buy is regular seat and he doesn't recommend it, but if you want light weight over safety he got seat for you.

Re: Best Sprint Racing Seat. Why?
 

The things you mentioned about the, "ping-pong" effect, came out in the Stanford study I watched a Ted talk on. Concussions don't come about exactly as we might think they do and don't usually occur on the surface of the brain where it impacts the skull. What they've discovered so far is that in an impact, the skull/helmet rebounds and impacts the brain while its still traveling toward to skull. The brain distorts and twists inside the skull and a sheering action takes place near the center at the mid-line, tearing the membrane that separates the different portions. I know a few late model racers who purchased top of the line, custom fit FC seats and without having a crash, just racing on a rough surface with high banks, had concussion symptoms for several days after, just from being "ping-ponged" between the head rests. This happened on multiple occasions and to more than one driver. This also is one of the factors that caused my departure from late models, I couldn't get anyone to listen and they were mandating we strap ourselves into something I believed caused harm and increased risk of serious injury. Being an older racer I have no desire to diminish my mental faculties for later in life when I can no longer drive, like being able to feed myself and remembering where I live. The Marcus Neimila(sp?) wreck and his lingering issues are why I keep asking questions. I'm not looking for confrontation mind you, but awareness and a serious conversation, the sharing of info and experience. I've yet to have 1 manufacturer of FC seats discuss this issue. The late model sanctions knee-jerked and I fully expect to hear of more injuries forthcoming, but with open wheel there still seems to be the possibility of a discussion. Thank you to everyone who has contributed to this thread, keep it coming, this isn't a race, its about truth and caring about yourself and others.:8: