Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

mimispeed you need to get your facts straight. I worked for AMSA for years and 2 cars motor were checked weekly.Random pick. Safety checks were done quietly and without fanfare. We got a lot of grief from some when it was pointed out the rules. Also the DQ at Lawrenceburg The Driver told us not to send fuel to be tested because he knew it wouldn't pass.

Get your facts straight. I said crash not fuel dum dum. Lol Roberts crash. When Roberts said rod hit him and with no evidence Jerry gave rod the boot.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Guess I'm also blind never seen the word CRASH.

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Because of this stuff Rod is smart tech it now then he goes to trailer swaps motors put the fire eater in then they don't check it after a win
Damn wonder if I could do this
Nope can't change it that fast

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I was right behind that crash it was ugly but a bad bad call on jerry it was a racing thing left front to RR not intended to happen 2 cars same line
And hell yes jerry has had the ass for him and few others and favored a few

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Damn wonder if they will be big motors @ eldora tomorrow going to race my 360 I bet there will be a better engine there than mine . Well hell maybe I should stay home

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

They been doing that same thing for years:3:;);):5: a lot of the time there is "malice intent" by the overtaking driver.

So they DQ us because we run battle bars that stick out beyond the rear tire when we pull the tire all the way in. That would have been a non wreck with 4 point bars with the outside bar even with the outside the tire, much much more safer set up.

So what is the reason for writing the rule the way it is now. Why don't USAC and other open wheel groups use this rule???:11::11:

Can anyone give me a reasonable answer, other than that is how we always done it.:7::7:

I guess by no direct response Mr. Striker the answer to your request would be no, Why don't you offer an added weight incentive to kinda of sweeten the deal sure would like to see you guys race with us, but taking that Midget purse shouldn't be that bad.

Trust me them old "Hench" and "Foz" cars don't want anything to do with you with or without a "BUILT" motor.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Isn't this racing you need to come with a set of legitimate rules instead of basing it off **** you got especially if you run up front, why beat the book to death don't you want competition isn't that what racing is about

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

The guys who beat the rule book to death are usually the biggest cheaters look at my left hand while I stab you with my right its pathetic to ***** about motors when you run up front consistently trade motors with the last place guy I mean a lot of driving is talent RIGHT!

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

MMSA doesn't have a book they are doing good to have a page and+++++++"THAT IS A GOOD THING". Some racers race to win with the rule book. Bill like everybody else got a little "BMW Fobia" this year but hopefully he will get over it. Keep the motors stock, keep them new 1 or 2 years old and you got what we always had good cheap racing.


The unfortunate thing is there has always been a horsepower race between the Orienttal bikes but them darned Dutch came at it with a vengeance and the magazines wore the hype out writing how bad they were (translated money exchanging hands). Then we got into this continued wearing down of the "American Economic Engine" by people intent on putting us in our place. Couple that with high gas prices, a tsunami in Japan and a bunch of other racers in different type cars falling in love with our engines, low import numbers and low sales numbers and you get in our racing world what the rest of the American People are getting ready to experience "INFLATION"!

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

You can spend however much money you want but if you can't drive you're not ever gonna win

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Does anyone want to buy some stock right out of the bike engine kits. I think that there are 6 on the way in. Gsxr 1000 05-08 and 04-12 r1's. Lets start this stock motor deal right now. Ill tag and mark every engine i sell. Ill also keep a log book of where every engine goes.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Looks like a guy with so many motors could switch motors for one race then switch back to race them "Waynesfield Stock Motors".

Bill Jones:6::6:

We will make this like INEX 600 RACING.This is a group for Legend car racing that you can only buy your sealed engine from. I would love to be that guy!!

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I would but there not in yet.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Be careful what you wish for! That guy started out a millionaire already and those things only make him chump change. If you really want national rules it will take a guy like that to implement them. His cars are junk bricks but every piece on your car had better come from him.

If you got this bunch together in one little room they would probably have to call out the National Guard.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

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That is what we call creating a shortage to raise prices, you know like antifreez in the 70's or gasoline today.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

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A lot of times them "STOCK" right off the bike motors aren't too stock. I have gotten one very gray area motor off of EBAY one time. Then what do you do? These crotch rocket kids spend a lot of money on their bikes before they make a mistake and we end up with their motors.

That was the nice things about the 600cc motors those kids were a lot younger and dumber and more of them out there, making them darn right cheap. Then what happened those danged sidewinders came along.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

well rob you and Andy might have got a lot of other mini sprint groups/racers involved in helping our class get some attention.now is the time to come together on a seriously exceptable stock rule. Amsa,Mmsa,Mals, I know that the motors we run are very easily bought all over the place and the Internet remember the turd remarks on the 2009 yzfr1.
I could have purchased any brand on eBay for under $2000.00 bucks and stuck with the turd.lol I love blue sorry. I paid $800.00 bucks for a 2010 yzf r1 plus $150.00 for shipping.
try putting a claim of $2000.00 bucks on the winners motor (block only) then all the building will stop I will guaranty no one will dump money in them..... not even me. please keep on the positive side it's to all our best interests to keep this awesome class going in the right direction.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Phill I agree. I think a claim would be great. The gsxr guys are gonna need a lil more money though. I think 2800 would cover everything.
As you said earlier, I don't know you and you don't know me. However if we all could sit down together and look at these points I don't see why there can't be a national rule sanction.
I'm sure a meeting face to face would be alot less entertaining, and wife's and mothers would not be mentioned.

A engine can only make so much power when it's stock. It's either limited by comp, displacement, or longevity (rods).

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Wow, I'm really going to miss this....nope, I'm not!

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you will only have to replace the motor with the same type you was claimed....all day long one the web for under $2000.00 bucks for Yamaha,Kawasaki,Suzuki,Honda's.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

AND when I knock you out of the( perfect attendance award ) I mean the points race because I claimed your motor and Striker is waiting on a shipment will I be the A-HOLE.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Before the motor crunch I always bought low mile 1 year or less old motors and could run them for several years and race hard. Now they are just impossible to find and when you do $5000.00 ouch. "This too Shall Pass". Just hold on and don't get antsy. The MAL bunch is trying to keep the old motors alive.

We have pulled two rods apart this year carrillo might have helped them for three more seconds before the pins pulled out of the pistons., we have spun 3 rod bearings carrillo won't help that a bit. The two we pulled apart we ran out of coolant on, the other three spun rod bearings when we ran out of oil to that rod even back on a wet sump.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I'm sure there is peaks in motor availability. For instance there is a young man we race with here at the MMSA who blew up a motor which was recently rebuilt. Turns out the guy who put it together neglected to tighten the bolt which holds the pick up on the oil pump, lasted 2 races. Bad luck and it happens.. However I've been searching all evening and I've only found 1 07-08 bare engine for under 2k, and after shipping its just over. I know I've seen them cheaper but it's not common on that one.
Phil by chance did you read mike mesendicks post?

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

that's racing have a back up.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Back up BANK?

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

You know I'm pretty old but I can remember my Dad telling me to take care of our back yard and not worry about the neighbors back yard. I think that pretty well holds true here. This all started because Srtiker Racing wanted to pull 300 miles to race with the MMSA group in a new car he had purchased that has never run without a wing before. He knew his motor was a tick out of bounds and asked for permission to race. Well we wont be racing this week but if we were he would have my blessings to do so. MMSA is run by a benevolent Dictator by the name of Bill May. I can remember several years ago at Shady Hollow raceway in Kentucky. A loan guy in a sidewinder not knowing there was a difference showed up to race, Bill asked each of the racers would it be ok for them to race with us and I guess he got an up vote because that thing raced with us.

I for one say let Striker come on down we would love to race with him. Will I be the only one?

As for MAL they kicked me off their board last winter and I don't think the money is enough to entice me out there, SOO maybe they should spend more time on their post board and build it up and stay the hell out of ours.:7::7::7 GOOD NIGHT

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I don't have a dog in this here hunt but as for my series there are provisions just for this...add 50 lbs and a run a SP-3 or no weight and use a SP-4.... Sp-2 duro.'s @ 40-43...sp-3 @ 49-52 and a sp-4 durometer's 60-64....BIG difference in compound

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

still waiting on some one to tell me how your going to check internal engine parts at the track as part of tech. so you pull the pan, see my rods are aftermarket, how do you know if there light weight after market or the stronger rods? how are you going to check for aftermarket pistons if there stock dome, just lighter?

stock bore stock stroke and ports of the head is all you can check. stock bore stock stroke rule and go race.

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

Perhaps giving someone a call might have been a better route.

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You're right, you can't really check anything on the bottom end. All the power is being made in the top end and you're pretty limited on what can be checked there. I know other things can be checked,, CC and deck height.


We,, (MALS) have been working on getting a meeting set up for this fall with MMSA, MLS, ILSS, AMSA and maybe WIMS to work on a common set of rules.

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OK***** They make this little thing like the doctors use when they want look down one of your holes, it's called a bore scope and believe me when I say in some holes it really hurts.

My idea tec inspection would be:

1. Draw a pill to see if you get around the world or simple bore stroke and fuel check.

2. If you loose and win the around the world treatment. here is what you would get.

3. The racer and car would be invited into an air conditioned trailer with plastic wind curtains, the car would be placed on stands.

4. The bore and stroke would be made in the usual way.

5.All 4 plugs would be removed as well as the valve cover and right side engine cover.

6. Two pistons would be turned to bottom dead center, tecs choice.

& Insert bore scope down one plug hole and observe piston crown, a stock piston will look nothing like a race piston, (see example of stock piston on page 3 of this post). Those two lines running across the piston get a lot closer to the center hole on a high compression piston, further apart on a low compression piston. Stand out like a Babby Ruth in a punch bowl to someone who looks at them all the time.

7. Put the angle viewer on the bore scope and by looking down different plug holes you can observe the valves and shape of the valves, same thing stock valves and Ferra valves just don't look the same. Tec make decision on weather more tear down is necessary.

8. Measure cam heal and toe with mike that should give you good idea about cam lift, Horsepower is made with lift and valve size.

9. Take the bore scope and insert it in the holes inside the engine side cover from this vantage point you can observe rods and crank counter weights, hard to hide carrillo h beam rods and shiny machined counter weights.

10. The tec can check the Methanol at the track, hard to hide stuff in there, but gasoline has different weight from station to station, might want to send it off. There is a lot of horsepower \one can put inside gasoline and not get caught with.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

MMSA has one too>

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

MMSA has one too>see experimental engines in rule page. Spiker just bought it up before he spent all that money on fuel. I think he would fall under experimental engine.

Seems like everyone would rather address everything else rather than Spikers request to run with MMSA for one race with an engine just a little outside the norm!

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Ill have s bone stock engine package for my car Monday to run all tracks but Waynesfield.

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

With Mike's hot rod you should be able to run up front at Waynesfield Too with a stock 08 gsxr running at min weight. The other chassis are really old school design when compared to his, they work best when running a wing.

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

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Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

First..........I need to apologize to anyone and everyone......Particularly Mr. Bradley. I let my passion for this class override what little common sense I possess. I kinda got out of line with my comments on this thread. Everyone please except my apology.

I have been involved with Mini-sprints/Lightning Sprints since 1986. Yeah..........that long. And no.......I didn't start when I was 1 year old either unfortunately. I have an undying passion for this class. I have raced about everything else you can imagine but I always have stayed involved with this class. I see it starting to take one it's down hill slides that I have seen in years past. That doesn't need to happen. Not if we can get it under control as a collective group. Anyway......I tend to get a little defensive about our cars. Obviously, something I need to work on.

Just had a really nice phone conversation with Mr. Fortune. I appreciate the communication sir. He and I are both going to try to organize some sort of "meeting" of interested groups to try to come up with a NATIONAL set of rules. Something all parties agree on. Something we can all live with and maybe help promote this class on a nationwide basis. We have some really good people in various groups that I am sure can make this happen. We/I will try to keep everyone posted as this develops. Anyone interested please try to contact me. We have to start somewhere people.

Phil Heavelow............(913) 371-5212 or (816) 223-1009 cell. Or jmillwight@kc.rr.com

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I would sure like to apologize for those remarks last night Phil. It was getting late, and motors are a sore spot with me right now. I have no ill will toward you or Mark but this national rule deal won't float, the best we could hope for would be a real popular regional group (LIKE UMP ) that everyone would more or less want to emulate. Lets face it most of us run stock motors and we can run anywhere we choose or can afford to run, motor wise.

There will always be people looking for an edge and willing to spend money to achieve those means.

The thing to think about is there ain't no "motor magic". The fastest motors will always be in the car with the most modern chassis, the newest tires and shocks, and the best drivers. It is hard to beat that combination with any kind of hot rod motor.

I saw a motor builder advertising that his motors won the championship with MMSA. He didn't give that darned driver or mechanic a bit of credit. I have been around enough to know that bunch is fast in a $hit box. But the add will get a few more people to spend a little more money with him so they can try to beat that set up. And that is what racing is about.

Have you ever seen an illegal motor in a car at the back of the pack? Those are the guys that need one.

Now how about them battle bar rules??:11;:11; They would prevent an awful lot of flips.

How about adding weight so a 250 pound guy can run with the 90 pound kid? And people wont be spending so much money on light chassis and parts to make up for that last "BIG MACK ATTACK".:11;:11;

Honest Dad himself:6::6:

Re: Attn: Mmsa mini sprints
 

I'm with you Phil, Been there done that. History will repeat itself if we aren't careful. The sad thing is people don't have their eye on the ball. They want to blame the motor for everything and escalate the spending on them when really it is very seldom the engine that wins races. We spend a lot of money if we have it on (chassis shocks and tires ) with a good driver that will make you fast, to hell with the motor.

To help grow the sport perhaps we need a rookie class where a guy can come in and run with his peers. If nothing else start them in the back of the pack and let them race for a trophy amongst them selves. When the race directors feels they have progressed enough then move them up to the front of the pack he can do that also.

It would be nice if some of the more experienced racers could take a rookie under their arm and get them up to speed a little. Maybe even have a little class on set up and gearing and even driving style. Those things would help us grow the sport, Bitchen about motors won't do nothing for us.

NO COMENTS ON RIKERS REQUEST YET???:19:
mo cars mo moneys:D:D

Honest Dad himself:6::6: